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September, 2020

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WARNING: Destroy Your Pieps DSP Beacons

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Troy.
Posts: 5066 - Karma: 12,449
To make sure everyone is aware: the Pieps DSP Beacons/Transceivers are consistently switching modes while stowed properly. If you haven't heard the story specifically, Nick McNutt's ski partners think his beacon switched off during the avalanche, which resulted in the full burial. Nick's beacon had been checked at the trailhead.

Since putting stories out on social media, everyone is hearing more and more fail stories of DSP Sport and Pro avalanche transceivers. A lot of folks just thought "oh shit, I guess mine is being funky, must be my fault." I've personally heard from a half-dozen or so friends who have seen the same issue.

IF YOU HAVE A DSP PRO OR SPORT BEACON: keep that shit in a drawer.

Also, consider emailing Black Diamond and Pieps requesting an exchange for a transceiver that will work under stress.

Ideally, Black Diamond, Pieps, and/or their parent company Clarus Corp will issue a mandatory recall notice on all DSP Sport or Pro models and immediately discontinue sales. This is a beacon that has a huge potential to fail during the times you need it most. This is a model that carries potentially criminal negligence due to the manufacturing errors.

However, they haven't done this yet. So, it might be helpful for their office folks to know how unsafe their product is.

If you need help finding the email addresses of Clarus Corporation employees, feel free to DM me.

TLDR: Don't use that shit, your life depends on it. Don't let your friends, their lives depend on it. Go raise hell until we have a safe product.
Oct 11 2020 6:00PM 80 0
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TheWeaz
Posts: 713 - Karma: 1,288
To clear this up a little for those wondering, the black diamond branded ones that came into the US I think 2 years ago have a different button style that doesn’t seem possible to accidentally turn off. These are not the yellow/ green or yellow and grey ones, they are blue and a dark grey/ black.

Ive heard of black diamond replacing people’s pieps beacons with these ones. So if you have a pieps beacon hit up the warranty department and cause a fuss, even if its out of warranty. No one should be using a beacon in backcountry that has a chance of turning off.
Oct 11 2020 6:39PM 29 0
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TRVP_ANGEL
Posts: 8998 - Karma: 52,712
TheWeazTo clear this up a little for those wondering, the black diamond branded ones that came into the US I think 2 years ago have a different button style that doesn’t seem possible to accidentally turn off. These are not the yellow/ green or yellow and grey ones, they are blue and a dark grey/ black.

Ive heard of black diamond replacing people’s pieps beacons with these ones. So if you have a pieps beacon hit up the warranty department and cause a fuss, even if its out of warranty. No one should be using a beacon in backcountry that has a chance of turning off.device

Thats what i was going to ask since I have those (Black Diamond DSP BT Pro). The design seems almost identical on the surface, can someone confirm/vouch of a case for them suffering from the same issue?
Oct 11 2020 7:05PM 3 0
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TRVP_ANGEL
Posts: 8998 - Karma: 52,712
Link to pastebin of full story (plus additional comment by christina)
Oct 11 2020 7:11PM 3 0
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animator
Posts: 1332 - Karma: 3,746
BCA tracker 3 hasn’t failed me yet so I’m gonna stick with it
Oct 11 2020 7:22PM 23 0
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TheWeaz
Posts: 713 - Karma: 1,288
TRVP_ANGELThats what i was going to ask since I have those (Black Diamond DSP BT Pro). The design seems almost identical on the surface, can someone confirm/vouch of a case for them suffering from the same issue?

The beacon part is exactly the same, the only difference is the color and the way the on/off/ search/ send button is activated.

on the black diamond beacons there is a spring loaded piece that you have to move left to allow the switch to change modes.

on the pieps one the lock is simply depressed and then the switch can move. It would seem that as the beacon is used more it becomes easier to depress what is basically just a bent piece of plastic. Also the button to move the switch is raised above the rest of the beacon so a hard hit and sliding motion seem to be able to change modes.

on the BD the button isn’t raised and is spring loaded, as well as the direction of motion needed doesn’t seem like it would be able to happen in a fall. These ones also haven’t been around nearly as long so it’s totally possible that after being used for a long time they could develop the same issue, but as of now it seems like a better design.
Oct 11 2020 7:38PM 7 0
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SkiingNinja
Posts: 1880 - Karma: 325
Crazy story. I have one of these ... good to read.

I wonder if facing the beacon towards your body could help, so there isn’t one point that is “exposed” to the front and any force from the outside would spread over your body and not depress the lock mechanism. Scary stuff.
Oct 11 2020 8:23PM 2 0
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ChangeCashMoney
Posts: 288 - Karma: 1,075
Wild to hear, thanks for putting the info out there. I’ve got my fingers crossed we don’t see a huge influx of avalanche incidents this winter with more people venturing into the backcountry. Pray for snow, respect the terrain and approach it with practical knowledge of how to keep yourself and others safe.
Oct 11 2020 9:39PM 2 0
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Nickc88
Posts: 554 - Karma: 1,487
Good thing to know while shopping for a beacon, thanks for this thread.
Oct 11 2020 9:41PM 2 0
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BigPurpleSkiSuit
Posts: 4795 - Karma: 19,266
Big ups for thread, thank you
Oct 12 2020 1:47AM 5 0
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crazyskir05
Posts: 27 - Karma: 23
Scary stuff.

Highly recommend the Ortovox 3+

3 antenna with an accelerometer that will auto switch back into broadcast mode if stationary for too long (i.e. you're burried while searching)

Also uses the accelerometer to detect vertical orientation to optimize the distance that your signal is broadcast.

Also runs on 1 AA battery that is really easy to replace (ie no excuses to keep it charged above 80%)

Haven't looked at other beacons in a while but if you are looking at upgrading this is the only one that I know helps you get found better.

I bought a refurbished one over 6 yrs ago and haven't had one problem.



*edit, after searching, looks like there are several now offering similar features with more range, but I'm confident w/ what i've got so...

**This post was edited on Oct 12th 2020 at 4:34:11am
Oct 12 2020 4:15AM 4 0
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SFBv420.0
Posts: 2270 - Karma: 1,138
strong sensationalized headline
would seem to me if this beacon had these issues you would be able to recreate this problem in a safe enviorment and have tangible real measurable proof instead of we "think' and we "know" of other instances of this failure and actually post those additional failures instead of pure conjuncture and lack of real evidence of failure
Oct 12 2020 7:56AM 0 32
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CatBoy
Posts: 217 - Karma: 852
SFBv420.0strong sensationalized headline
would seem to me if this beacon had these issues you would be able to recreate this problem in a safe enviorment and have tangible real measurable proof instead of we "think' and we "know" of other instances of this failure and actually post those additional failures instead of pure conjuncture and lack of real evidence of failure

Click the link in the original post- their insta vid shows the ability to slide the transceiver modes without pressing the safety button.

If you are expecting a RCT or years of data collection on these particular devices it's not going to happen. It's a small market, a small community, and anecdotal evidence is the most of what we have. It's also good enough for me.
Oct 12 2020 11:47AM 5 0
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safarisam
Posts: 8155 - Karma: 17,957
SkiingNinjaCrazy story. I have one of these ... good to read.

I wonder if facing the beacon towards your body could help, so there isn’t one point that is “exposed” to the front and any force from the outside would spread over your body and not depress the lock mechanism. Scary stuff.


I've typically skied with mine that way, there was a day I was sled skiing and we did random checks-- mine had switched. I bought a BCA one the next day.
Oct 12 2020 11:49AM 10 0
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RiotsBin
Posts: 2 - Karma: 27
So when looking at Christina's Latest post, the Pieps DSP Pro is the previous model. A person in the thread talked about the newer model having an updated locking system. I have the newer one, and I cannot make it do what Christina does in her post. (linked below, the last video is a demonstration). The new Pieps/Black Diamond Pro BT and similar models have a much better spring loaded lock, as shown in these pictures. Even Nick, who commented on her post said the new model should remedy this situation.

The pictures attached show the new locking mechanism, and you have to use considerable force to slide the lock switch to the side. This model is from 2018-19 season and newer.

In a comment on Christina's Post, Nick does talk about how the company believes that the old beacons are still within the acceptable design range, so if people are up to making decisions for the upcoming system, know the company and the industry views tolerate dangerous ranges.

Nick McNuttI collected some beacons from friends who had these models, of varying age and usage levels, and was able to easily override the switches on all of them. BD tested them afterwards and although they all had reduced holding power, they claimed that they still fell within the margins of the original design specs by @avalanchepieps.
It’s a shocking thing to learn that even though it’s that easy to move the switch, it’s still “good enough” to be accepted by the industry.



Christina's Post.
[URL]https://www.instagram.com/p/CGKiX6FnesY/[/URL]

If other people are having the same issue the older model has, with this one, then please let me know
Oct 12 2020 12:06PM 2 0
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Troy.
Posts: 5066 - Karma: 12,449
RiotsBinSo when looking at Christina's Latest post, the Pieps DSP Pro is the previous model. A person in the thread talked about the newer model having an updated locking system. I have the newer one, and I cannot make it do what Christina does in her post. (linked below, the last video is a demonstration). The new Pieps/Black Diamond Pro BT and similar models have a much better spring loaded lock, as shown in these pictures. Even Nick, who commented on her post said the new model should remedy this situation.

The pictures attached show the new locking mechanism, and you have to use considerable force to slide the lock switch to the side. This model is from 2018-19 season and newer.

In a comment on Christina's Post, Nick does talk about how the company believes that the old beacons are still within the acceptable design range, so if people are up to making decisions for the upcoming system, know the company and the industry views tolerate dangerous ranges.




Christina's Post.
[URL]https://www.instagram.com/p/CGKiX6FnesY/[/URL]

If other people are having the same issue the older model has, with this one, then please let me know


Hey RiotsBin,

You're half-right here. The DSP Sport (green/yellow) still has the same issue; the differences comes down to if it's Pieps branded or Black Diamond branded. TheWeaz covered it pretty effectively earlier in the thread.
Oct 12 2020 12:29PM 1 0
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RiotsBin
Posts: 2 - Karma: 27
Troy.Hey RiotsBin,

You're half-right here. The DSP Sport (green/yellow) still has the same issue; the differences comes down to if it's Pieps branded or Black Diamond branded. TheWeaz covered it pretty effectively earlier in the thread.


The new BD ones and the new Pieps ones are identical, just coloring differences. The issue Weaz spoke on was just the fact that it was a newer model. The new line of DSP beacons from them feature the updated switch, including the Powder and Pro, which McNutt was advocating for as a replacement when speaking with BD/Pieps. However, the Sport is still fitted with the outdated switch.

*Edit* I just wanted to clarify for people with the new Pro and Powder beacons to not necessarily toss theirs, but the Sport ones gotta go.

**This post was edited on Oct 12th 2020 at 12:41:48pm
Oct 12 2020 12:38PM 2 0
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TheWeaz
Posts: 713 - Karma: 1,288
I didn’t know pieps had changed the lock switch as well, I’m in the US so pretty much only see the black diamond ones now that they are branding them themselves. The updated lock switch shouldn’t be susceptible to the same issues, but they also haven’t been around long enough to see if they wear like the older pieps models did.
Oct 12 2020 12:43PM 2 0
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Troy.
Posts: 5066 - Karma: 12,449
SFBv420.0strong sensationalized headline
would seem to me if this beacon had these issues you would be able to recreate this problem in a safe enviorment and have tangible real measurable proof instead of we "think' and we "know" of other instances of this failure and actually post those additional failures instead of pure conjuncture and lack of real evidence of failure


Hey @SFBv420.0 , sensational headlines aren't my personal flavor; I fuckin wish I didn't have to.

Given that the ski community is as tight-knit as it is, I'm hesitant to post direct receipts, but if you had clicked any of the links in this thread, you would have found the CarFax

**This post was edited on Oct 21st 2020 at 6:38:25pm
Oct 12 2020 12:46PM 13 0
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Troy.
Posts: 5066 - Karma: 12,449
RiotsBinThe new BD ones and the new Pieps ones are identical, just coloring differences. The issue Weaz spoke on was just the fact that it was a newer model. The new line of DSP beacons from them feature the updated switch, including the Powder and Pro, which McNutt was advocating for as a replacement when speaking with BD/Pieps. However, the Sport is still fitted with the outdated switch.

*Edit* I just wanted to clarify for people with the new Pro and Powder beacons to not necessarily toss theirs, but the Sport ones gotta go.

**This post was edited on Oct 12th 2020 at 12:41:48pm


Ahh shit, thank you for that clarity. I didn't have enough coffee in the tank before I started responding.

The scariest part of all of this is the fact that BD/Pieps has upgraded the system but is still trying to sell off old stock.

TheWeazI didn’t know pieps had changed the lock switch as well, I’m in the US so pretty much only see the black diamond ones now that they are branding them themselves. The updated lock switch shouldn’t be susceptible to the same issues, but they also haven’t been around long enough to see if they wear like the older pieps models did.


Pieps's line carries the same Pro BT and Powder BT with the upgraded lock-slide.

From a design side of things, having the lock physically move off the switch-catch seems to be pretty solid, but depending on the material construction of the slide, we could easily see the same material-degredation over time.

**This post was edited on Oct 12th 2020 at 12:55:43pm
Oct 12 2020 12:54PM 2 0
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DingoSean
Posts: 22667 - Karma: 14,781
Ive never heard of this sort of thing happening with the DSPs or the Sport/pro models over the years, but Id definitely make damn sure that the slider is locked in place if youre going to continue using it just as I would with any beacons send function.
Oct 12 2020 1:17PM 1 1
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TRVP_ANGEL
Posts: 8998 - Karma: 52,712
DingoSeanIve never heard of this sort of thing happening with the DSPs or the Sport/pro models over the years, but Id definitely make damn sure that the slider is locked in place if youre going to continue using it just as I would with any beacons send function.


the 3rd video in the instagram post in OP shows that it can be changed even when the lock is secured
Oct 12 2020 3:07PM 5 0
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tri_photo
Posts: 980 - Karma: 1,971
I’m still rocking a Tracker as well, they don’t let you down!
animatorBCA tracker 3 hasn’t failed me yet so I’m gonna stick with it
Oct 12 2020 3:33PM 2 0
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animator
Posts: 1332 - Karma: 3,746
tri_photoI’m still rocking a Tracker as well, they don’t let you down!


Yes sir!!
Oct 12 2020 4:00PM 0 0
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artrud
Posts: 591 - Karma: 1,384
Going into my third winter with my DPS Sport. Initially I thought the sliding piece seemed strange, it's a bit exposed and probably at risk to breaking if hit at the right angle and hard enough...but anything breaks with a large enough impact. Decided to purchase it because the security/quality of the sleeve you place it in plus I was sold on the interface and it's ease of use in case of emergency. Additionally knowing several others who use and recommend it (friends, pro athletes, etc.). Mine still seems secure after two seasons, but after reading these stories and how common failure is I've reached out to PIEPS to understand what they're doing to address this and if my 5-year warranty applies for a new and better designed beacon. I really hope they do the right thing here and put people over profit.

support@pieps.com
Oct 12 2020 5:58PM 3 0
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BestedChina
Posts: 2 - Karma: 29
Hey Everyone,

I think i might have figured out what is going on here with the OLD Pieps DPS Pro and Sport transceivers. I have a DPS pro and I've been playing around with it for the last couple minutes:

When the transceiver is set to "SEND" it is possible to have it transmitting but the plastic button is not fully engaged or if it worn it can easily slide into "OFF" mode while you push it into the supplied body harness. The big yellow plastic sliding selector switch catches on the edge of the harness as you push the unit into the harness and turns off your transceiver !

I have included some pictures of what I am describing here for clarity. Also, this will apply to the DSP Pro AND Sport models as they have the same selector/button combo.

Stay safe !

*** I am not an engineer, this post is a result of a poorly educated individual fucking around with a beacon for half an hour. Your safety is your own responsibility ***
Oct 12 2020 6:48PM 8 0
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Avalancheairbags
Posts: 1 - Karma: 19
Hi NewSchoolers community,



@BestedChina can I use your pictures to write an article about this? I don't have Pieps at home right now :\.

Small reminder that you need to replace your beacon after 5 years of using.

Also a reminder about BCA Tracker 2 issue found by me last winter. Firmware upgrade already available ;).

BCA Tracker 2 changes periodic signal after 12 hours in send mode.
https://plecakilawinowe.pl/bca-tracker-2-changes-periodic-signal-after-12-hours-in-send-mode-firmware-upgrade-available-in-two-weeks/



Fingers crossed for Pieps DSP recall :(.

**This post was edited on Oct 13th 2020 at 3:36:56am
Oct 13 2020 3:26AM 4 0
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DeebieSkeebies
Posts: 29684 - Karma: 30,980
Just to confirm as someone who just recently bought a new DSP Sport (the green/yellow one thats newer), Should I certainly send mine back to EVO where I bought it from or BD/Pieps.....This isnt too confidence-inspiring at all and definitely will be buying most likely Mammut and staying away from these beacons until this issue is entirely resolved.

**This post was edited on Oct 13th 2020 at 12:33:19pm
Oct 13 2020 12:32PM 2 0
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Troy.
Posts: 5066 - Karma: 12,449
AvalancheairbagsHi NewSchoolers community,



@BestedChina can I use your pictures to write an article about this? I don't have Pieps at home right now :\.

Small reminder that you need to replace your beacon after 5 years of using.

Also a reminder about BCA Tracker 2 issue found by me last winter. Firmware upgrade already available ;).

BCA Tracker 2 changes periodic signal after 12 hours in send mode.
https://plecakilawinowe.pl/bca-tracker-2-changes-periodic-signal-after-12-hours-in-send-mode-firmware-upgrade-available-in-two-weeks/



Fingers crossed for Pieps DSP recall :(.

**This post was edited on Oct 13th 2020 at 3:36:56am


Holy shit, that is an amazing writeup on the BCA Tracker flaws. On behalf of the community, thank you for spending the time running those bench tests.

@safarisam has a broken slide on her DSP as well, she could grab some photos/videos if need be. I'm sure Christina from IG would be willing to let you use her videos as well.
Oct 13 2020 2:07PM 1 0
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Troy.
Posts: 5066 - Karma: 12,449
AvalancheairbagsHi NewSchoolers community,



@BestedChina can I use your pictures to write an article about this? I don't have Pieps at home right now :\.

Small reminder that you need to replace your beacon after 5 years of using.

Also a reminder about BCA Tracker 2 issue found by me last winter. Firmware upgrade already available ;).

BCA Tracker 2 changes periodic signal after 12 hours in send mode.
https://plecakilawinowe.pl/bca-tracker-2-changes-periodic-signal-after-12-hours-in-send-mode-firmware-upgrade-available-in-two-weeks/



Fingers crossed for Pieps DSP recall :(.

**This post was edited on Oct 13th 2020 at 3:36:56am


Holy shit, that is an amazing writeup on the BCA Tracker flaws. On behalf of the community, thank you for spending the time running those bench tests.

@safarisam has a broken slide on her DSP as well, she could grab some photos/videos if need be. I'm sure Christina from IG would be willing to let you use her videos as well.
Oct 13 2020 2:07PM 1 0
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Troy.
Posts: 5066 - Karma: 12,449
I still have not heard from anyone at Pieps, Black Diamond, or Clarus Corporation so far this week. Please, send some emails if you are as concerned as the rest of the community is.

We cannot have more of our friends dying because Black Diamond and Pieps will not take responsibility for their actions.

Black Diamond:
bdmo@bdel.com
ski@bdel.com

Pieps:
office@pieps.com
info@pieps.com

Clarus Corporation (parent company)
john.walbrecht@claruscorp.com
aaron.kuehne@claruscorp.com
taylor.west@claruscorp.com

Clarus's Investor Relations:
CLAR@gatewayir.com

Why CC the Investor Relations contact?
A: currently, Black Diamond and Pieps have created gross negligence through the failure of this product and the failure to respond. Fiduciary duty is the requirement for an organization to always work in the financial best interest of the shareholders (Clarus Corp stockholders). Exposing a company/shareholders to a lawsuit due to negligence of product design will tank their share price, and thus Clarus Corp by ignoring this problem is not taking actions required by their fiduciary duty.
Oct 13 2020 2:17PM 5 0
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safarisam
Posts: 8155 - Karma: 17,957
Troy.Holy shit, that is an amazing writeup on the BCA Tracker flaws. On behalf of the community, thank you for spending the time running those bench tests.

@safarisam has a broken slide on her DSP as well, she could grab some photos/videos if need be. I'm sure Christina from IG would be willing to let you use her videos as well.

I’ll dig around and check for my old beacon tonight. It may have been sacrificed to Ullr in March. If I find it I’ll post a video because I had one fuck up up as well while out sledding. LMK if anyone wants to know more about how it was being worn, used, etc.

**This post was edited on Oct 13th 2020 at 2:29:03pm

**This post was edited on Oct 13th 2020 at 2:29:47pm
Oct 13 2020 2:26PM 1 0
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Kevski
Posts: 6956 - Karma: 2,235
Dang, this is not the kind of thing to take lightly. My dad and I both have the suspect ones. Don’t want to see my family get any smaller by relying on a faulty safety product.
Oct 13 2020 5:50PM 3 0
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freestyler540
Posts: 11716 - Karma: 5,687
BestedChinaHey Everyone,

I think i might have figured out what is going on here with the OLD Pieps DPS Pro and Sport transceivers. I have a DPS pro and I've been playing around with it for the last couple minutes:

When the transceiver is set to "SEND" it is possible to have it transmitting but the plastic button is not fully engaged or if it worn it can easily slide into "OFF" mode while you push it into the supplied body harness. The big yellow plastic sliding selector switch catches on the edge of the harness as you push the unit into the harness and turns off your transceiver !

I have included some pictures of what I am describing here for clarity. Also, this will apply to the DSP Pro AND Sport models as they have the same selector/button combo.

Stay safe !

*** I am not an engineer, this post is a result of a poorly educated individual fucking around with a beacon for half an hour. Your safety is your own responsibility ***

I have that same model, the pieps pro. Spent a lot of money on this beacon. Bought it last year when my trekker 2 failed (search mode could not focus on the closest signal). Im pretty concerned about this...
I was warned by the shop to double check the lock and to insert it with the screen facing you. It should prevent accidental switch offs.
Oct 13 2020 8:29PM 1 0
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freestyler540
Posts: 11716 - Karma: 5,687
Why is http://www.pieps.com is down?
Oct 13 2020 8:36PM 5 0
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BestedChina
Posts: 2 - Karma: 29
AvalancheairbagsHi NewSchoolers community,



@BestedChina can I use your pictures to write an article about this? I don't have Pieps at home right now :\.

Small reminder that you need to replace your beacon after 5 years of using.

Also a reminder about BCA Tracker 2 issue found by me last winter. Firmware upgrade already available ;).

BCA Tracker 2 changes periodic signal after 12 hours in send mode.
https://plecakilawinowe.pl/bca-tracker-2-changes-periodic-signal-after-12-hours-in-send-mode-firmware-upgrade-available-in-two-weeks/



Fingers crossed for Pieps DSP recall :(.

**This post was edited on Oct 13th 2020 at 3:36:56am


Go for it. Hopefully more people will be aware of this problem.
Oct 13 2020 9:12PM 0 0
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ATLskier
Posts: 8200 - Karma: 384
Wow, I picked a great day to log in to NS for the first time in years. I had the exact problem with my DSP Sport. It was a big day/objective (NE Coulior of Lone Peak, UT) and we started the day off normal beacon check. After switching to trail shoes, I went to turn off my beacon and it was already off. My stomach dropped at the discovery. I never had any crashes that day(likely would have died had that happened), and it must have switched during transition or in a short rap we did. BD warranty replaced it, but it's still the same model. I will go to BD Warranty Friday and see what they can do.

I can't thank you enough for posting (especially considering my current hiatus from social media). It may have saved my life.
Oct 14 2020 12:10AM 7 0
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Troy.
Posts: 5066 - Karma: 12,449
Hey all, I'm going to also use this thread as a running logbook of how BD/Pieps/CLARUS handles this nightmare so we are all looped in.

This AM (little before 930 MDT) Pieps sent out a vauge/shitty boilerplate email to myself, and the same email to all of my friends who had reached out to BD/Pieps/CLARUS. Posted below:


Pieps Info (Unsigned Email)Hi Troy –

Thank you for your correspondence.

In response to inquiries we have received about the Pieps DSP Sport and DSP Pro avalanche beacons, PIEPS has performed significant additional testing on specific customer beacons in comparison to a random sample set of DSP beacons in new condition, used DSP beacons, damaged DSP beacons, and competitor beacons currently available on the market. Our testing concludes the Pieps DSP Sport switch mechanism is not defective by design.

Additionally, the Pieps DSP Sport and DSP Pro avalanche beacons have undergone vigorous third-party testing and exceed all certification standards. They have been sold globally since 2014 and have been used by countless backcountry users ever since.

A reminder that beacons are personal safety tools which must be properly used and maintained. Any misuse may compromise its functionality. Please refer to this video on how to inspect your beacon.

Your safety in the backcountry is our top priority. If you have further questions, concerns, or would like our team to check if your beacon has been compromised, please call Black Diamond Equipment in North America at our customer service line: 1-800-775-5552. Please note that we are currently experiencing a network outage at our headquarters, which has temporarily shut off our phones. We are hoping to get these back up and running as soon as possible.

Respectfully,

The Team at Black Diamond Equipment/Pieps


This is bullshit. This will kill our friends. I do not say this lightly.

We, the community, have tested the product and this is Pieps digging in their heels to try and avoid a PR Nightmare or having to give away free beacons because they designed a garbage product.

More CarFacts:
- Yellowstone Ski Patrol outfitted their team with DSP Pro. At least 7 patrollers have confirmed to have had this issue
- Mt. Hood Meadows Ski Patrol outfitted their team with DSP Pro. Multiple confirmed patrollers had the issue, Ski Patrol got rid of DSP Pro and swapped to BCA.

Please keep the heat up.
Oct 14 2020 12:22PM 11 0
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DeebieSkeebies
Posts: 29684 - Karma: 30,980
the fact that online retailers are still selling the beacons too is a little concerning as well.....Might not be a bad idea to reach out to Backcountry/EVO/etc. customer relations or someone in charge there.
Oct 14 2020 1:01PM 4 0
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finder
Posts: 1606 - Karma: 3,838
https://www.instagram.com/p/CGT6EzAlgLn/

Time to boycott BD? Sorry embed wouldn't work

**This post was edited on Oct 14th 2020 at 7:18:18pm
Oct 14 2020 1:21PM 3 0
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TheWeaz
Posts: 713 - Karma: 1,288
They just posted an instagram about is and the dude literally turns it off without touching the lock switch using just his hand and a little bit of force. what does he think getting dragged through a tree by an avalanche is going to do?
Oct 14 2020 1:38PM 9 0
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Troy.
Posts: 5066 - Karma: 12,449
finderhttps://www.instagram.com/p/CGT6EzAlgLn/?igshid=16agxg3v7o2ml

Time to boycott BD? Sorry embed wouldn't work

**This post was edited on Oct 14th 2020 at 1:23:34pm



Really sick that they are:
A) refusing to acknowledge a proven defect
B) are directing folks to call disconnected phone lines
C) generally being a prick with wanton disregard for our safety

**This post was edited on Oct 14th 2020 at 1:52:28pm
Oct 14 2020 1:51PM 8 0
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artrud
Posts: 591 - Karma: 1,384
artrudGoing into my third winter with my DPS Sport. Initially I thought the sliding piece seemed strange, it's a bit exposed and probably at risk to breaking if hit at the right angle and hard enough...but anything breaks with a large enough impact. Decided to purchase it because the security/quality of the sleeve you place it in plus I was sold on the interface and it's ease of use in case of emergency. Additionally knowing several others who use and recommend it (friends, pro athletes, etc.). Mine still seems secure after two seasons, but after reading these stories and how common failure is I've reached out to PIEPS to understand what they're doing to address this and if my 5-year warranty applies for a new and better designed beacon. I really hope they do the right thing here and put people over profit.

support@pieps.com


Troy.Hey all, I'm going to also use this thread as a running logbook of how BD/Pieps/CLARUS handles this nightmare so we are all looped in.

This AM (little before 930 MDT) Pieps sent out a vauge/shitty boilerplate email to myself, and the same email to all of my friends who had reached out to BD/Pieps/CLARUS. Posted below:




This is bullshit. This will kill our friends. I do not say this lightly.

We, the community, have tested the product and this is Pieps digging in their heels to try and avoid a PR Nightmare or having to give away free beacons because they designed a garbage product.

More CarFacts:
- Yellowstone Ski Patrol outfitted their team with DSP Pro. At least 7 patrollers have confirmed to have had this issue
- Mt. Hood Meadows Ski Patrol outfitted their team with DSP Pro. Multiple confirmed patrollers had the issue, Ski Patrol got rid of DSP Pro and swapped to BCA.

Please keep the heat up.


The lawyers at Pieps are working extra hard this week. They're only protecting themselves and dodging any responsibility with this weak generic message. If they publicly admit the plastic lock is defective, subpar, or requires a recall then they open themselves up to wrongful death and injury lawsuits. And if they honestly think the beacon is up to standards after all their "testing" then they're dreaming.

Guess we need to add them to the boycott list along with Backcountry.com
Oct 14 2020 5:10PM 4 0
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r00kie
Posts: 1090 - Karma: 5,863
Pieps instagram post was pretty shot. Literally showed the flawed design but then blamed the user anyway.
Oct 14 2020 6:57PM 7 0
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DeebieSkeebies
Posts: 29684 - Karma: 30,980
r00kiePieps instagram post was pretty shot. Literally showed the flawed design but then blamed the user anyway.

retailers like EVO are/maybe sending out canned responses too, which i get, seeing as they want people to talk to BD/Pieps instead and not get involved but idk, whatever. i got an email back from their customer relations earlier tellling them to look into the matter and if i could get a refund and wasnt offered one do retailers want people to reach out to the companies or something for it?

**This post was edited on Oct 14th 2020 at 8:08:23pm

**This post was edited on Oct 14th 2020 at 8:14:56pm
Oct 14 2020 8:07PM 2 0
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Troy.
Posts: 5066 - Karma: 12,449
Hey all, not entirely sure where this tracks just yet, but in an effort to get a consolidated view of just how many devices are affected, I've built this form. If you, or folks you know, have had your DSP Pro or Sport act janky, please log your experience.

https://forms.gle/e98MK2B3n2SQg7yw9
Oct 14 2020 8:54PM 1 0
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BigPurpleSkiSuit
Posts: 4795 - Karma: 19,266
freestyler540Why is http://www.pieps.com is down?


Someone must have accidentally bumped the lock switch on their server with a moderate amount of force.
Oct 15 2020 12:35AM 8 0
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Horsefacekillah
Posts: 867 - Karma: 877
FUCKIN THIS

didn’t read but do it
Oct 15 2020 1:19AM 1 1
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chris.goodhue
Posts: 930 - Karma: 5,813
I literally had this same thing happen to my Pieps Beacon, obviously I didn't have any life threatening experience in the BC thankfully, but I definitely stopped using it. Going to try and getting it exchanged
Oct 15 2020 9:47AM 7 0
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RIP_leos_shack
Posts: 474 - Karma: 962
My sailing coach from university was killed in an avalanche because his Pieps DPS beacon failed in the same way. When his widow tried to bring up the issue, she was stifled by Black Diamond who threatened to sue her if she went public to the media. Hopefully someone with a greater profile and social media presence can bring about some real change. In the meantime, I'm calling for a total boycott of Black Diamond.
Oct 16 2020 2:04PM 13 0
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safarisam
Posts: 8155 - Karma: 17,957
I’m in my iPhone, but here is an IG link from Corey Lynam’s widow about her experience with BD:
https://www.instagram.com/p/CGZKBALhHGp/?igshid=lvubhi93qn6z
Oct 16 2020 2:24PM 7 0
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