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Greatest President Ever

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skiierman
Posts: 28699 - Karma: -5,563
Well with all the Bush bashing threads, I figured it'd be nice to have a change of pace and say who you think was the best president ever. I say Clinton because he was a pimp... and he helped out the national debt a lot. But mostly because he was a pimp.
May 11 2007 2:29PM
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Quinn
Posts: 1428 - Karma: 16
Well that's one of the most retarded things i've heard/read in awhile. Congratulations.
First of all, you say slaves weren't freed until AFTER his death and the passing of 14th Amendment....When Johnson took over after Lincoln was assassinated, he carried out Lincoln's wishes in Reconstruction--and obviously freeing the slaves.
And you talk about suspending the constitution in the 1860's compared to the fucking Patriot Act in 2001? Our country was divided, and former citizens were killing eachother by the hundreds of thousands. NO SHIT the border state were compromised in their freedoms. To compare that to the Patriot Act right now has got to be one of the worst comparisons i've ever heard.
And also, just to plan in advance, dont call me some stupid shit who doesnt know anything. I got a 5 on the US AP Test, so don't claim I dont know anything about history.

And just for a quote about the emancipation proclamation...I can't believe you said it had no impact...
"From the first days of the Civil War, slaves had acted to secure their own liberty. The Emancipation Proclamation confirmed their insistence that the war for the Union must become a war for freedom. It added moral force to the Union cause and strengthened the Union both militarily and politically. As a milestone along the road to slavery's final destruction, the Emancipation Proclamation has assumed a place among the great documents of human freedom."
May 11 2007 5:45PM
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Von
Posts: 4869 - Karma: 21
What about the liberty of those in the border states who would be jailed, just for suspected support of the south, in the states where the constitution was all but abolished. And what about how Lincoln absolutely destroyed the idea of states rights. I'm not saying that slavery was a good thing at all, but if you really study the civil war, you'll see that Lincoln did a number of horrible things and should never be placed among the ranks of the great presidents. I also scored a 5 on the AP US history test back in high school, its not that hard to do you just have to be able to write good coherent essays.

May 11 2007 5:58PM
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Von
Posts: 4869 - Karma: 21
Clintons economic boom and the balanced budget wasn't Clinton's doing, it was Newt Gingrich's.
May 11 2007 6:00PM
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gnustreetfool
Posts: 2595 - Karma: 51
clinton was a badass muther fucker
and who ever was the one who got stuck in a bath tub. what a bitchass
May 11 2007 6:05PM
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Mr_Papageorgio
Posts: 1271 - Karma: 117
taft
May 11 2007 6:12PM
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Capt.Flannel
Posts: 10928 - Karma: 36
Reagan.
May 11 2007 6:52PM
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Gavajabra2
Posts: 1259 - Karma: 13
Communism was a national scare, any president at that time would try to stop communism if he wanted the approval from the american public. Was it right? Of course not, but the fear of communism drove MANY innocent people getting killed, their lives ruined, and many imprisioned. Have you seen "Good Night and Good Luck"? Hell the fear of Castro with nukes nearly caused a nuclear war, which was missed very very narrowly. Again, it wasn't right, but he did it to not only stop the spread of communism but to please the American public.
May 11 2007 9:00PM
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Quinn
Posts: 1428 - Karma: 16
Well considering state's rights is one of the main issues involved in the civil war, even more so than slavery, isn't it logical that he wanted to abolish the notion? And its not to say state's were helpless following the civil war...it varies president to president as well as the supreme court cases of the times....and the condition of state's rights during the civil war is not really indicative of state's rights now....a lot has happened since.
May 11 2007 9:04PM
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Joe_
Posts: 648 - Karma: 14
after reading this line and realizing that you are serious, i immediately disregarded the rest of your post because you have absolutely no clue. by the way, you couldn't be more wrong
May 11 2007 10:06PM
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Wis_Skier_23
Posts: 2263 - Karma: 245
ok Clinton was terrible.....if he wasnt the president he would be going to jail for treason.....he gave away nuclear secrets to the Chinese....what a dumbass.....IMO Reagan blew the competition away and especially if we are talking about the economy....our economy was in the shit hole and then he turned it around and made it one of the best in the world
May 11 2007 10:58PM
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Nicholas.
Posts: 10905 - Karma: 60
jfk stopped the world from nuclear war.
May 11 2007 11:15PM
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Gavajabra2
Posts: 1259 - Karma: 13
During Clintons last 2 years of presidency we were out of debt and actually making profit those 2 years, yeah he fucked the economy. And I believe Carter and Reagan took the economy out of the shitter in the late 70's early 80's. You're probably an idiot if you think Clinton just gave the chinese nuclear secrets that easily, he didnt just call them up and say "Hey, want to make a nuclear bomb? I'll teach ya".
May 11 2007 11:18PM
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dowalibeast
Posts: 3339 - Karma: 207
don't use national debt as a reason for a president being good, because we'll never be out of it anyway and a couple billion dollars here and there isn't going to matter.
May 11 2007 11:21PM
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Gavajabra2
Posts: 1259 - Karma: 13
Well if we slowly begin repaying debts and dont go to any wars we'll be out of in sooner or later.. preferably sooner.
May 11 2007 11:22PM
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Von
Posts: 4869 - Karma: 21
So you think that Lincoln did a good thing by stamping out states rights? And since the civil war states have really lost a significant amount of power, you think that this centralized over controlling system that we have now, is better then a true federalist system? I'm a Political Science major, with a minor in History, so if you think you are smarter then me about issues like this, think again.
May 12 2007 2:46AM
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Von
Posts: 4869 - Karma: 21
I do have a clue, i promise you I've studied this so much more then you have. Why do you just naturally assume that Lincoln was a great president, because thats what you learned in grade school?
May 12 2007 2:48AM
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Commonwealth
Posts: 3729 - Karma: 11
i agree 99% with your list, that is how it is. Mi(Scra)tch, i respectfully disagree with you on this, but i see your point.

mine would go:
FDR- the New Deal reform period didn't do much as far as getting us out of the Depression, but he was way ahead of his time period. you can thank him for Social Security
Eisenhower- American hero, helped stop the spread of communism
TR- he was just fantastic.
then Lincoln, Jefferson, Washington, Reagan.
May 12 2007 9:26AM
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Gavajabra2
Posts: 1259 - Karma: 13
Lincoln - Freed slaves
Eisenhower - stopped communism by inserting a worse gov't for other countrys, wow I don't understand that at ALL.
May 12 2007 9:31AM
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MitchPee
Posts: 8871 - Karma: 1,510
Eisenhower didn't stop communism. Communism stopped itself. I don't know if you haven't realized, but all communist nations are in the shit hole now and have either changed or just stayed communist and lost a lot of global power.

Do you have any idea how the US would react if a foreign country came in and bullied us around and changed our government? Then when it becomes a problem, they just turn their heads and leave. I'm sorry, but that's just a shitty presidential job.
May 12 2007 9:57AM
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MitchPee
Posts: 8871 - Karma: 1,510
Read my above post...why would you disagree with me? Communism stopped on its own. Because of Eisenhower, Hundreds of thousands of people were killed. How can that be a good president?

Also, he had many innocent people thrown in jail because of suspicions.

Do you guys think the judge who condemned people as witches at the Salem Witch Trials was a good man too?
May 12 2007 10:00AM
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Gavajabra2
Posts: 1259 - Karma: 13
Stalin killed MILLIONS of his own people, which is exactly what Eisenhower was trying to prevent, more governments like his.
May 12 2007 10:07AM
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Quinn
Posts: 1428 - Karma: 16
Actually...that's pretty fucking surprising that you have a poli sci major, cause you'd think with that you would realize your opinion isn't the only opinion that exists...or maybe you go to a school that teaches that whatever you think is 100% correct, so fuck everybody else! Cause I mean, it's not like history is open to interpretation or anything. Good job man, you really impressed me with that shit!
May 12 2007 4:34PM
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MitchPee
Posts: 8871 - Karma: 1,510
Uh, let's take a look at China, how many of their own people are killed? They had that run in at Tienanmen square and that's about it. It was completely unnecessary to overthrow those governments, they were peaceful and didn't want anything to do with our assistance, but we forced it on them.

There's no way you can ever say those countries would have killed their own people. I still don't understand why you are defending Eisenhower. All he did was corrupt countries and kill people, he never solved or prevented anything.

Oh and communism had nothing to do with killing his own people, he wasn't even a real communist more of a dictator.
May 12 2007 4:40PM
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EnemySki
Posts: 471 - Karma: 10
Ronald Regan
May 12 2007 5:27PM
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Gavajabra2
Posts: 1259 - Karma: 13
I'm not defending anybody I'm helping you understand the fears our country had against commies back in the 50's.
May 12 2007 5:30PM
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almostaskier
Posts: 13809 - Karma: 93
whoa whoa whoa...

are you not counting the 60 million people who died under communist rule with Mao, with the civil war and all that, as part of the current government?

Communism in China has killed more people than anywhere else...
May 12 2007 5:33PM
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MitchPee
Posts: 8871 - Karma: 1,510
Yeah you're right, but the way Stalin and Mao interperetated communism was sooo much different. Mao didn't try to spread it anywhere but China.
May 12 2007 5:40PM
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MitchPee
Posts: 8871 - Karma: 1,510
I know exactly what they were, and I'm saying they were total bullshit and Eisenhower set up oppressive governments and influenced mass killings for no reason...that's why he's a bad president.
May 12 2007 5:41PM
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lushlaxstr
Posts: 3063 - Karma: 41
bush
May 12 2007 5:48PM
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almostaskier
Posts: 13809 - Karma: 93
Stalin didn't either, really. His whole spiel was "Communism in One Country", WWII let him take over territory lost in WWI and more stuff to accentuate his power. That communism spread was a mere perk to that, he wasn't actively searching to spread it, it just came with the army.

Agreed both of their views were very different though, Mao was more of a true communist ideal, Stalin a mere dictatorship of his own self. Communist theory didn't play much for him so much as power, and seeing as he had such influence, he could do whatever he wanted and justify it later in terms of socialism...

But yeah, the whole domino effect feared by Eisenhower, Truman, LBJ, everyone, was grossly over-exaggerated and used to justify a lot of wrong doing and errors. Much like today and "terrorism".
May 12 2007 5:50PM
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Fintendo
Posts: 846 - Karma: 15
Nixon was really good.
May 12 2007 5:51PM
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*monsterskier*
Posts: 2671 - Karma: 61
lincoln,jfk,fdr...but wat bad thing did clinton do? ppl say he was involved in some sort of scandal..(or was that reagan?)
May 12 2007 6:15PM
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almostaskier
Posts: 13809 - Karma: 93
please please pleaaaaaase be kidding.
May 12 2007 6:27PM
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Gavajabra2
Posts: 1259 - Karma: 13
Bahahaha.

In history we just went over watergate and my teacher was like "Ok what similaritys are there between Nixons scandal and Clintons" and some kid raised his hand and said "Deep throat"
May 12 2007 6:31PM
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Von
Posts: 4869 - Karma: 21
I don't have a Poli Sci major yet, but thats what i'm majoring in. And where did i say that my opinion that existed? It would be ridiculous to think that every other opinion is worthless, and i don't. I know that history is open to interpretation, you just disagree with the way that i interpret it, so you're resorting to fickle name calling.

and ps don't cuss it makes you sound extremely immature
May 12 2007 6:46PM
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gregor
Posts: 1069 - Karma: 83
Amin.
May 12 2007 7:01PM
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Krush
Posts: 1312 - Karma: 12
.
May 12 2007 7:02PM
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Jamesl48
Posts: 547 - Karma: 10
Learn some economics before you go crediting Reagan, Clinton, or most presidents with solving our economic woes.

Credit for solving the stagflation crisis of the late 70s is usually given to the Federal Reserve Board and its chairman Paul Volcker (who assumed that position during the administration of Jimmy Carter.)

The fed tightened money supply, created the worst recession since the great depression (unemployment hit double digits), but we emerged without the massive inflation that had been crippling us previously.

The Fed, not Reagan, set up the economy for success in the 1980s.
May 12 2007 7:08PM
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MitchPee
Posts: 8871 - Karma: 1,510
Yep, exactly why I said a president doesn't have much control over the economy. The FED does all the number crunching and placement.
May 12 2007 7:12PM
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RudyGarmisch
Posts: 25443 - Karma: 13,844
SHIT, I'm twelve.
May 12 2007 7:18PM
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jp_draves
Posts: 1866 - Karma: 37
i lol'd cuz i thought about a family guy episode with him. sort of funny.
May 12 2007 7:43PM
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Von
Posts: 4869 - Karma: 21
no you aren't

May 12 2007 7:45PM
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j3Di
Posts: 1188 - Karma: 13
Lincoln, Reagan, Clinton
May 12 2007 7:46PM
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Commonwealth
Posts: 3729 - Karma: 11
dang, didnt know china was in a shit hole right now...its not like they are building cities the size of NYC every year..

Iran? no shit hole there
North Korea? if you consider firing practice nuclear missles into the Pacific something that a shit hole nation would do, then they ARE a shit hole.

you're right.
May 13 2007 12:22AM
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DANETRON
Posts: 6671 - Karma: 137

KILLA BILLY

May 13 2007 12:44AM
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Wis_Skier_23
Posts: 2263 - Karma: 245
your right he didnt just call em up and say that, but he still gave away critical info for nuclear secrets......and if you are the frickin president why cant you control your sexual desires to masturbation until you get out, and if your going to hit up some chick make sure she is hot..
May 13 2007 1:09AM
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kingarthurs
Posts: 1126 - Karma: 10
woah woah woah, hold on there. mao had pratically no political ideologies. during the revolution in china, when china was controlled by warlords mao actually joined the nationalist party for a brief period of time, and moscaw backed his desicion because they wanted to give money to the group that could take the country. then the nationalits came into control, and decided they no longer needed moscow, and so moscow went back to endorsing the communist party. when the communist party was fighting the nationalists, mao took over peng's army, who controlled a seperate red army from mao, so he could have more power. mao killed tens of thousands of loyal jiangxi red army soldiers because it meant he would look good in the eyes of moscow. mao had practically no political idealogies in the beliefs of communism until he came into power as the leader of china, and even then i would say he was much more of a dictator than communist idealist. mao was an opportunist dictator
May 13 2007 1:26AM
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Quinn
Posts: 1428 - Karma: 16
"And where did i say that my opinion that existed?"
I think its clear you think your opinion exists...if that's what you were trying to say, cause your response was near incoherent.

And ps, dont tell me not to curse, mother. Cause in you trying to sound all big and mature by telling OTHERS not to curse, you, in fact, sound like a big douche muffin.
May 13 2007 2:15AM
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MitchPee
Posts: 8871 - Karma: 1,510
I was saying in the past, but they are still in a shit hole. Just because they are building big cities doesn't mean they are not a shit hole. Indonesia for example.

you're a fucking moron and you know nothing about North Korea. The people there are extremely poor and just because they launched a prehistoric missile doesn't mean they are a shit hole.

How is Iran not a shithole? The quality of life there is horrible.

I don't know what you're smoking, but I want some.
May 13 2007 2:18AM
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MitchPee
Posts: 8871 - Karma: 1,510
doesn't mean they aren't* a shit hole.

May 13 2007 2:22AM
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