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September, 2024

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Killington Backcountry Drama

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WoFIowz
Posts: 9788 - Karma: 72,405
Can anyone clarify about this recent story of 23 people getting lost after venturing out of bounds at Killington?

I saw today that an employee was also fired for being part of the group. The fucking SAR team had to save them lol wtf and there were numerous kids. Could have ended a lot worse.

Side note: I think it's crazy that people venture off trails in winter or summer without the supplies or knowledge to survive multiple days in the wilderness.

https://unofficialnetworks.com/2024/01/23/killington-employee-fired/amp/

**This thread was edited on Jan 24th 2024 at 3:21:59pm
Jan 24 2024 3:21PM
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isaacwrong
Posts: 2255 - Karma: 17,246
I remember this happening at least half a dozen times per year when I was living in Rut over a decade ago. Never this number of people tho, normally it was 2-4
Jan 24 2024 3:38PM
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Benchhitter
Posts: 144 - Karma: 1,323
These type of people are the reason there needs to be a “do not eat” warning on the little silica packs in beef jerky
Jan 24 2024 3:43PM
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theabortionator
Posts: 51496 - Karma: 160,743
Im curious as well. I've only been to Killington in the spring and not super familiar.

Gore has a lot of glades and would run into this sometimes. A few SAR and one time a bunch of instructors went out to deep and spent the night, made a fire.

Was this similar going deep in a glade or did they just head into the wood and yolo?
Jan 24 2024 3:49PM
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dwt802
Posts: 3208 - Karma: 31,543
I was dumbfounded how that happened… Off Glades aka North ridge going to coopers cabin and following the ridge there is a giant orange line with signs indicating there is no return. All that is in place because of how many people used to get lost there. At coopers cabin there is an opening for the long trail with a sign clearly stating how desolate it is past there. In the southern side there is no real way any idiot would easily go off let alone 23 people…

An artical from outside mag says they went off the backside of snowdon, said they skied some gully that I’ve never heard of and I’ve skied there for 18 years. Going off the backside of snowdon is incredibly dumb and obviously doesn’t lead back in bounds let alone to any development for a while. There is orange tape and signs there too if I’m not mistaken… dumbasses either way glad they were okay. Feel bad for all who had to “rescue” them as they all could walk out…

https://www.outsideonline.com/outdoor-adventure/snow-sports/why-the-hell-did-23-skiers-require-rescue-near-killington-resort/




The sign at the opening at coops for the AT/LT

**This post was edited on Jan 25th 2024 at 2:58:13am
Jan 25 2024 2:56AM
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skierman
Posts: 8279 - Karma: 7,388
Good job, ski industry. Keep on normalizing backcountry skiing and promoting touring to jackasses who can barely ski down blue groomers. Its working out great!
Jan 25 2024 6:10AM
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Lemuel
Posts: 14480 - Karma: 10,550
If the boundary truest is clearly marked, then I have no sympathy for these people. It’s incidents like this that ruin good things for responsible skiers.
Jan 25 2024 6:47AM
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hi_vis360
Posts: 4852 - Karma: 49,000
Don’t worry kids. I’ve seen every episode of the fifty, we got this!!
Jan 25 2024 7:20AM
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Brule.
Posts: 3907 - Karma: 6,148
I’m still trying to wrap my head around how they managed to ski to the Bucklin Trail on the backside of Killington from Snowdon. It would make more sense if they kept skiing down to there from North Ridge via Cooper’s Cabin but even there the signs are obviously posted.


I really hope the person leading the crew was fired, and I really hope they don’t demolish Cooper’s Cabin over this.
Jan 25 2024 8:39AM
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Goretex_Vidal
Posts: 698 - Karma: 9,662
hi_vis360Don’t worry kids. I’ve seen every episode of the fifty, we got this!!


I watched a Stomp It Tutorials playlist on my phone while I was driving to the mountain; I'm good!
Jan 25 2024 9:52AM
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s.j.mitchell
Posts: 409 - Karma: 2,202
theabortionatorIm curious as well. I've only been to Killington in the spring and not super familiar.

Gore has a lot of glades and would run into this sometimes. A few SAR and one time a bunch of instructors went out to deep and spent the night, made a fire.

Was this similar going deep in a glade or did they just head into the wood and yolo?


Definitely a yolo moment by all logical reasoning. There isn't much crazy side country to ski at killington, and definitely none in the area they allegedly went off. There are a few places one can traverse too far and get off track, but not on the main mountain. its very obvious that anything off the backside on the main mountain doesn't lead back onto the resort once you go in, if you have any sense of direction at all. No way they didn't think they'd have to hike out.
Jan 25 2024 12:53PM
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SofaKingSick
Posts: 9188 - Karma: 59,882
skiermanGood job, ski industry. Keep on normalizing backcountry skiing and promoting touring to jackasses who can barely ski down blue groomers. Its working out great!


2024, when "normalizing backcountry skiing" is an actual fucking sentence, and a group of dickheads getting lost on a ski mtn is somehow the industry's fault. who tf upvotes this shit lmao
Jan 25 2024 1:14PM
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Dani-B
Posts: 214 - Karma: 1,864
Not to mention there's no touring gear that I can see in the picture with the group...
Jan 25 2024 2:17PM
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skierman
Posts: 8279 - Karma: 7,388
Dani-BNot to mention there's no touring gear that I can see in the picture with the group...


They burnt it for warmth.
Jan 25 2024 3:00PM
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SteezyYeeter
Posts: 3470 - Karma: -11,717
lol how do people still not know to not ski on the back of killy??

although i don't get why you can't ski down and then just follow your tracks back up.
Jan 25 2024 4:29PM
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Juviticus
Posts: 348 - Karma: 1,814
SofaKingSick2024, when "normalizing backcountry skiing" is an actual fucking sentence, and a group of dickheads getting lost on a ski mtn is somehow the industry's fault. who tf upvotes this shit lmao

I can't believe I'm coming to the defense of skierman but he has a point. I actually made a point of telling store staff at the beginning of the year to avoid selling touring stuff to people just learning blue runs. Glade skiing is risky already when at that level at least on the west coast, so backcountry is an even worse idea. It's not the industries fault persay but when they make it more accessible more jerry's will buy that stuff and then this happens
Jan 25 2024 4:51PM
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Benchhitter
Posts: 144 - Karma: 1,323
JuviticusI can't believe I'm coming to the defense of skierman but he has a point. I actually made a point of telling store staff at the beginning of the year to avoid selling touring stuff to people just learning blue runs. Glade skiing is risky already when at that level at least on the west coast, so backcountry is an even worse idea. It's not the industries fault persay but when they make it more accessible more jerry's will buy that stuff and then this happens


Yeah I get what he’s saying too but fuck are you doing marching into stores and telling them not to sell people touring gear . That’s not how this works. Besides the fact that jerrys buying touring setups is a non-issue, great skiers can be as much of a liability in the backcountry as beginners. Ability to carve hard is so far down the list of factors. You need to get to know the breadth of the community that recreates in the backcountry better. You can’t preach an abstinence approach to backcountry safety, it won’t work.
Jan 25 2024 6:46PM
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theabortionator
Posts: 51496 - Karma: 160,743
skiermanThey burnt it for warmth.


A+
Jan 25 2024 7:13PM
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Juviticus
Posts: 348 - Karma: 1,814
BenchhitterYeah I get what he’s saying too but fuck are you doing marching into stores and telling them not to sell people touring gear . That’s not how this works. Besides the fact that jerrys buying touring setups is a non-issue, great skiers can be as much of a liability in the backcountry as beginners. Ability to carve hard is so far down the list of factors. You need to get to know the breadth of the community that recreates in the backcountry better. You can’t preach an abstinence approach to backcountry safety, it won’t work.

I worded that poorly, I work in a shop managing the ski section so it was a part of my preseason meeting with staff. And of course great skiiers with no backcountry knowledge will be more of a liability. But if that the case, imagine how much a liability a beginner or intermediate skiier with no backcountry experience will be. I think the point I'm trying to make is that being comfortable skiing off-piste in all conditions should be considered a prerequisite before hitting backcountry, simply as risk reduction
Jan 25 2024 10:09PM
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SteezyYeeter
Posts: 3470 - Karma: -11,717
grainy, but go figure
Jan 25 2024 10:40PM
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aflightlessbird
Posts: 509 - Karma: 498
Classic case of it's all good until it's not.

Personally, I am thankful for growing up around Jackson and rural Wyoming where these stories are too common. Someone gets killed at least once a year from something like this. When I returned home in 2018 some guy got separated from his group and skied off the backside of Rock Springs bowl into the wilderness. SAR couldn't go in because of a storm. Dude survived by hiking back up his tracks all night long... I blame the group leader for not doing a body check and waiting for everyone periodically. Just reckless.
When I was around 16 my friend and I hiked out to 4 pines with no gear, straight dumbasses, and got properly scolded by dudes out there. I mean roasted. "What the fuck are you little shits doing out here risking your lives and ours? You think this is game? You think one of us is gonna save you if it goes wrong? You should turn back and hike back to the resort you dumbass mfs!!!" We still skied down (stupid) but it put some fear in me.
Guy was harsh but I thank him for those words. BC even side country deserves the upmost respect. Not only are you risking your life, but your friends you lead out there, and SAR if they come after you.
Jan 26 2024 12:30AM
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Benchhitter
Posts: 144 - Karma: 1,323
JuviticusI worded that poorly, I work in a shop managing the ski section so it was a part of my preseason meeting with staff. And of course great skiiers with no backcountry knowledge will be more of a liability. But if that the case, imagine how much a liability a beginner or intermediate skiier with no backcountry experience will be. I think the point I'm trying to make is that being comfortable skiing off-piste in all conditions should be considered a prerequisite before hitting backcountry, simply as risk reduction

I used to work on the floor in ski hardgoods. So I get it. Now I still have dealings and side jobs with the retail side of the industry, but I work in public avalanche safety/forecasting and SAR for a large national park. I’ve never had an issue with people who can’t rip well enough on touring skis be an issue. Most of our skiing related ops are experienced and trained backcountry skiiers. A lot of people learn to ski in the backcountry, you’d be surprised. Most backcountry skiiers outside of the general NS demographic aren’t skiiers, you feel. Harm reduction is accessibility, in our opinion.
Jan 26 2024 2:28AM
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Juviticus
Posts: 348 - Karma: 1,814
BenchhitterMost backcountry skiiers outside of the general NS demographic aren’t skiiers, you feel. Harm reduction is accessibility, in our opinion.

That makes a lot of sense. Would you say that accessibility requires someone with the type of experience you have to be there? For that entry level rider
Jan 26 2024 3:29AM
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Boyer
Posts: 1 - Karma: 33
Returning from a 20 year hiatus from this site. Very cool it's still kickin'.

I have been one of the idiots that missed the "can't miss orange rope" but off the back of Pico. A local was with me and explained the orange rope, we headed through the glades together and they were thick enough that we lost site of each other and that was that... knee deep freshies in ski boots/thick brush. Not fun. Debated leaving my skis and getting them in the summer.

We had no water, just had a couple beers (made dehydration worse), and as soon as we realized we were lost we had zero cell signal for GPS/communication with the rest of the party. Ending up finding a buddy that was with me and we did the logical thing. Go DOWNHILL and pick a course and stick to it. Worst case we'd end up in Rutland. We eventually could hear cars on Rt 4 and met up with the Long Trail, and used part of that to walk back to Pico without needing to hitchhike on Rt 4.

Eating snow helped but was not sufficient.
Jan 26 2024 6:59AM
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SofaKingSick
Posts: 9188 - Karma: 59,882
JuviticusI can't believe I'm coming to the defense of skierman but he has a point. I actually made a point of telling store staff at the beginning of the year to avoid selling touring stuff to people just learning blue runs. Glade skiing is risky already when at that level at least on the west coast, so backcountry is an even worse idea. It's not the industries fault persay but when they make it more accessible more jerry's will buy that stuff and then this happens


we all pretty much agree noobs have been encouraged to go into the BC and tour etc from the industry and from the gear getting better and more accessible

but blaming the industry and ""normalizing backcountry skiing"" for a bunch of idiot gapers doing idiot gaper stuff at killington is silly. i doubt the group even had touring gear, it sounds much more like your typical gaper resort skiers thinking theyre at disney world
Jan 26 2024 9:15AM
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michael_bc
Posts: 1358 - Karma: 608
“These were all front-side resort skiers,” Clymer said. “We were rescuing skiers in the backcountry, but that doesn’t mean they were backcountry skiers.”

“In total, 21 skiers and snowboarders were down there together—six were children.”


While I agree that ski movies tend to nudge skiing enthusiasts towards the backcountry without warning about the risks involved and the expertise needed...

...this event speaks more to the sheer stupidity of people.

**This post was edited on Jan 26th 2024 at 10:29:37am
Jan 26 2024 10:29AM
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yungspliffy
Posts: 194 - Karma: 1,905
Casual skiers’ obliviousness never ceases to amaze me. Earlier this season I saw ski patrol doing a rescue off rim trail (killebrew canyon heavenly) where a group of out of towners had skied quite literally in between two trees with signs that said “no return” and underneath a rope. Mind you this is off of a traverse track which is so obviously the only way back to the resort if you have the navigational skills of a child. But that’s not even the most smooth-brained part, with how low the snow is this year you can see where it turns to dirt, so who would drop that anyways? Oh yeah and you can see a couple thousand feet straight fucking down to bone dry Carson valley NV which is clearly not where you started. Needless to say I had a good laugh with the patrollers as I passed them

**This post was edited on Jan 26th 2024 at 2:17:46pm
Jan 26 2024 2:15PM
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Benchhitter
Posts: 144 - Karma: 1,323
JuviticusThat makes a lot of sense. Would you say that accessibility requires someone with the type of experience you have to be there? For that entry level rider

No we’re hands off. W parks were out most days in public backcountry hitting study plots and we host a lot of public safety related events. I also have taught a lot of ASTs. So a lot of the job is just talking to the public. But i don’t hold hands. It’s important to make people understand that they’re solely responsible for themselves. The biggest thing we’ve done to navigate the new interest in the BC is make people feel welcome and valid to participate. Ex anyone can submit to the Mountain Information Network and are encouraged to. People are more likely to be safe and seek more education when we make them feel like they belong .
SAR calls on the other hand are usually experienced backcountry riders who made a mistake at some point. Which we all do. No judgement from me. Beginners generally self manage and stick to high traffic straightforward and simple terrain areas.

Resorts, case in point this thread, can be a diff story. gives people a risk taking mindset and a false sense of security. Usually ski patrol can handle them.
Jan 26 2024 2:23PM
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Juviticus
Posts: 348 - Karma: 1,814
BenchhitterNo we’re hands off. W parks were out most days in public backcountry hitting study plots and we host a lot of public safety related events. I also have taught a lot of ASTs. So a lot of the job is just talking to the public. But i don’t hold hands. It’s important to make people understand that they’re solely responsible for themselves. The biggest thing we’ve done to navigate the new interest in the BC is make people feel welcome and valid to participate. Ex anyone can submit to the Mountain Information Network and are encouraged to. People are more likely to be safe and seek more education when we make them feel like they belong .
SAR calls on the other hand are usually experienced backcountry riders who made a mistake at some point. Which we all do. No judgement from me. Beginners generally self manage and stick to high traffic straightforward and simple terrain areas.

Resorts, case in point this thread, can be a diff story. gives people a risk taking mindset and a false sense of security. Usually ski patrol can handle them.

Yeah i guess I'm definitely thinking about situations I've put myself in to entry level riders who would never do that stuff. Like last year I had a super close call in Revy inbounds where I was probably about a foot from a full inverted tree well burial. Lucky I stopped sliding just in time but yeah I doubt (hopefully) any blue rider would've been skiing glades with the 30cm of snow that fell the night before
Jan 26 2024 4:44PM
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GayWolf420
Posts: 37243 - Karma: 117,532
Was this guy an instructor and took a huge group out there?

last season we busted ski school building kickers beyond the boundary. Some people just don't understand how gnarly shit can get and that once you're beyond the boundary, its not a simple call to ski patrol, its 911.

**This post was edited on Jan 26th 2024 at 5:49:01pm
Jan 26 2024 5:48PM
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