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Sauna Thought

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Farmville420
Posts: 4043 - Karma: 50,564
pro skiing isn’t dead, the reason athletes don’t make six figures anymore is because of saturation. Who you gonna pay that money to? Back then there was like 20 dudes going buck wild, now I can name about 200 people who I’ve seen throw dub 16s, and there’s probably a hundred kids who can triple. So many street crews these days, it’s just volume. But it does ultimately hurt the sport, no one gets paid, so who is inspired to break their body anymore? Heard thru the grapevine zahner and Pete retired, not even 30 years old. Shits brutal on ur body, and for some reason 20x the amount of kids are doin it, and gettin paid less. We’re on the border of a renaissance I think, something’s gonna shake up the industry, or rather something has to, right?
Aug 22 2022 9:08PM
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BlueVillain
Posts: 402 - Karma: 2,356
Of course its saturated af now. As for a renaissance I think it's an interesting take but idk how that would happen. Let's see what others think
Aug 22 2022 9:13PM
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mobadis
Posts: 406 - Karma: -3,486
They just have to do the whole zeb Powell le culture is.... CHANGING! marketing angle. No one wants to pour money into a sport that is seen as largely for wealthy white kids in year 2000+22.
Aug 22 2022 9:41PM
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Casey
Posts: 7793 - Karma: 23,600
On some level it’s always going to be a magnet if there’s a pay day and fame on the other end. As that dries up people will stop entering the sport, the ones who remain will eat the cake and so on etc with the cycle of this shit being cool or not
Aug 22 2022 10:01PM
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ReturnToMonkey
Posts: 6206 - Karma: 66,883
Farmville420We’re on the border of a renaissance I think, something’s gonna shake up the industry, or rather something has to, right?

Global warming kills skiing and snowboarding. Skateboarding is on the border of a renaissance
Aug 23 2022 12:09AM
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Farmville420
Posts: 4043 - Karma: 50,564
ReturnToMonkeyGlobal warming kills skiing and snowboarding. Skateboarding is on the border of a renaissance


Some of my fav edits as of late came out of fridge edits so idk
Aug 23 2022 12:58AM
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ReturnToMonkey
Posts: 6206 - Karma: 66,883
Farmville420Some of my fav edits as of late came out of fridge edits so idk


The fridges will collapse with the state. Skateboarding will thrive with the collapse of the state
Aug 23 2022 1:05AM
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Buckleys
Posts: 49 - Karma: 663
threds
Aug 23 2022 1:23AM
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BLandz
Posts: 1578 - Karma: 25,719
I agree.

And skiing will have its renaissance within the next couple years its already starting. Just wait until people realize spinning isnt a trick
Aug 23 2022 6:09AM
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BrownSnow
Posts: 102 - Karma: 606
I'd say a large part of the problem is people who are fans of this activity refuse to pay for online content, ski movies, buy merch to support your favourite crew or something, barely anyone does that so there's no influx och cash into the industry which will also make bigger companies shy away, eitherway freeskiing still has soul and I could care less how popular it is globally or how much money it moves.
Aug 23 2022 8:29AM
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Dlonetti
Posts: 1379 - Karma: 12,682
Zahner and Pete really say their retiring? Would be sad if I dont get to see more urban from them
Aug 23 2022 9:27AM
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prettygood
Posts: 168 - Karma: 433
on a similar note, David Wise should have been marketed as skiings Shaun White and retired with millions in the bank by now. His stats and accomplishments are ridiculous compared to the amount of exposure he got over the years.
Aug 23 2022 9:57AM
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SofaKingSick
Posts: 8960 - Karma: 57,718
prettygoodon a similar note, David Wise should have been marketed as skiings Shaun White and retired with millions in the bank by now. His stats and accomplishments are ridiculous compared to the amount of exposure he got over the years.


i get the feeling from him that he's not interested in that same life/experience. he's a mormon (?) family man, hunter, etc, they're just different dudes (and i like wise a lot more than white, i'll tell ya that)
Aug 23 2022 11:31AM
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GrandThings
Posts: 2954 - Karma: 29,107
SofaKingSicki get the feeling from him that he's not interested in that same life/experience. he's a mormon (?) family man, hunter, etc, they're just different dudes (and i like wise a lot more than white, i'll tell ya that)


Yeah the Olympic coverage did a little spot on him and it seems like he just wants to live off-grid, raise his family... and spread the teachings of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ....

I wonder if he's seen Zootspace.
Aug 23 2022 11:38AM
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BradFiAusNzCoCa
Posts: 6653 - Karma: 57,334
Dude I went to a sauna the other day in a gym in my parents hometown. It was DISGUSTING. People coming in with their sweaty clothes on and shoes. Couldn’t throw water on the coals, and the ceiling was dirty (aka they never cleaned it). Worst sauna I’ve ever been to hands down. I hope you are in the much cleaner and more relaxing Sauna.

I do think Saturation an issue. Instagram means everyone throws up edits and just takes flow (and sometimes not even that - I know people who pay for skis and then say they’re sponsored) because they don’t need the money. It’s an overstimulation of skiing. The entire distribution network/cash flow has totally changed. The reality is that brands get more ROI flowing a kid skis and then sharing his post on Instagram. Back in the day, you had to wait for premieres and the team was limited. AMs didn’t get the coverage they do today. Hell, I hardly can tell the difference between pro and am anymore. It used to be a big thing to go pro (I think some snowboarders still celebrate it but it’s very few).

There were layers that kept the profit structure in place and gate kept, in a way. Same thing happened with online brokerages like Robinhood. People have easy access now so many brokerages can’t charge exorbitant fees anymore.

I think the money is still there, it’s just way more spread out than before. Gone are the days of putting $300k into Mason Aguirre for him to take acid the day of a Mammoth Pipe contest.
Aug 23 2022 11:54AM
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Farmville420
Posts: 4043 - Karma: 50,564
DlonettiZahner and Pete really say their retiring? Would be sad if I dont get to see more urban from them


I heard they picked up full time jobs in software or coding or something like that, maybe not retiring but no more winters off to film street 24/7, could be complete BS but one thing I know about street crews who film heavy shit with intense builds is that they don’t normally like it lol
Aug 23 2022 11:55AM
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Farmville420
Posts: 4043 - Karma: 50,564
BradFiAusNzCoCaI think the money is still there, it’s just way more spread out than before. Gone are the days of putting $300k into Mason Aguirre for him to take acid the day of a Mammoth Pipe contest.

Exactly. Back in the day it was just harder to be an am/pro. You couldn’t just drop edits, you had to constantly be traveling and filming and entering every possible contest. Now it’s so “easy” (You still obviously have to be disgustingly good) to pick up sponsors so the value of being sponsored is just way lower. Also why give someone a few checks and 20 pairs of skis when you can give 20 Instagram kids 1 pair of skis and no money and get the exact same brand exposure. There’s still money, but only the elite will ever see it, which I guess really hasn’t changed. I mean 10 years ago there was that sponsorship site where you would basically post your video and get these like microsponsorships, they would let you say you’re sponsored and all you would get is like a beanie or a case of monster or small crumbs like that, anyone remember that site I can’t think of the name
Aug 23 2022 12:06PM
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saucemastrscotty
Posts: 139 - Karma: 783
Money is always going to be a secondary thing with skiing, at the end of the day people are getting to that point because they are enjoying it not because they're trying to get paid. Skiing for your own enjoyment will always be what skiing is about, getting paid just isn't a part of it for 99% of us and that's ok. As for content it does suck that people put so much work into some amazing projects that don't really get recognized at least financially. But I think that the real value is putting something out that like minded people can appreciate, whether you make money off it or not shouldn't change your enjoyment/motivation to ski and make videos. My main point is that skiing is fun af and it being as fun as it is at least imo makes the whole no money thing not really matter as much.
Aug 23 2022 1:25PM
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asparagus
Posts: 2457 - Karma: 27,864
Skiings also not cool enough to draw large brand sponsorships hoping to appeal to the public. If a random large company associates itself with skateboarding, there is a large demographic that views skateboarding as something interesting. Most people wouldn’t care if they saw Henrik Harlaut or Tanner Hall in a Walmart commercial.
Aug 23 2022 1:59PM
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Hometownerz
Posts: 183 - Karma: 1,069
The sport is definitely super polarized right now. In skateboarding it seems like there are pros who are competing in the olympics etc. and there are "real" street skaters. Both are getting paid. Skiing's issue right now is that companies wont sponsor the street skater equivalent/ self made skier. They just want to throw money at kids who have spent their whole life in a freestyle program. I think part of this is on us, the consumers. You look at a board company like fa/hockey and they are able pay their team just like a bigger, more comp focused company because kids buy their boards and watch their videos. Vishnu is never gonna pay any of their riders as much as say volkl because they just don't have the audience.

You look at snowboarding or skateboarding and they can funnel money to riders people actually want to see because they aren't a niche within a niche. Skiing as we like it isn't gonna have a renaissance until we can convince the majority of skiers that they should be watching freestyle/freeride over racing.
Aug 23 2022 2:05PM
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AngryGramps
Posts: 242 - Karma: 701
In skiing- look at what sells skis. Ten years ago, it was park edits. Today, it is adventure content, touring, accessible stuff. Even flow programs have been cut massively for park etc. A lot of the people that are buying skis these days just dont respond to athletes the way that people used to, so money gets put into other stuff. Just look at how many pro models have been cut in the last five years if you need proof of how much impact big brands think that big name pros have.

There is an interesting story floating around of an olympic medalist in slopestyle getting totally disrespected by his (big, race based brand) ski sponsor, immediately after getting his medal, literally the week after. That was when the hype was arguably at the max for slopestyle- that should tell you how much some of these culture vulture brands REALLY care about freeskiing. Their race programs literally cost 10x their freeski programs in some cases. I'll let you guess which one sells more skis in north america....
Aug 23 2022 2:06PM
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GayWolf420
Posts: 36767 - Karma: 111,465
OP....be honest. Did you play some sauna golum with the boys????
Aug 23 2022 4:02PM
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J-Dunn
Posts: 1107 - Karma: 1,850
Don't know what this could be but it certainly sounds like aomeone is getting there butthole touched
DeebieSkeebiesOP....be honest. Did you play some sauna golum with the boys????
Aug 24 2022 8:20AM
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b0ss
Posts: 778 - Karma: 6,108
A lot of people can only ski and they do it incredibly well.
but there are more people than ever who are semi talented but really just have a role in the sport because they can do other things like look for new creative outlets to share skiing and get involved in management.
Athletes don't even get paid for their raw ability lol its all about reach.
learn several skills and focus on where those skills intersect. You are much less likely to fall victim to saturation when you know two combined skills ie. skiing and teaching(big bux lol), skiing and biking(year round resort opportunities.

there is more room than ever for people who see more to life than just skiing ability. Its not the sport thats concentrated. Its u.
Aug 24 2022 1:33PM
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-Dan
Posts: 7097 - Karma: 50,714
b0ssA lot of people can only ski and they do it incredibly well.
but there are more people than ever who are semi talented but really just have a role in the sport because they can do other things like look for new creative outlets to share skiing and get involved in management.
Athletes don't even get paid for their raw ability lol its all about reach.
learn several skills and focus on where those skills intersect. You are much less likely to fall victim to saturation when you know two combined skills ie. skiing and teaching(big bux lol), skiing and biking(year round resort opportunities.

there is more room than ever for people who see more to life than just skiing ability. Its not the sport thats concentrated. Its u.

Def the best take in this thread. Dope perspective
Aug 24 2022 2:05PM
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AndrewGravesSV
Posts: 3069 - Karma: 14,913
I think a big part of the issue is that the money freeskiers spend needs to stay within freeskiing specifically. As a demographic freestyle skiers are hard to pin down; street skiers, park skiers, and big mountain freeriders are all under the same umbrella of freeskiing but have different gear interests/ cultures. There's also certain level of gatekeeping/ required knowledge to join the group of "freestyle skiers" whether that is real or just perceived by outsiders. This all relates to how new folks get interested in being a freestyle skier and what brands/ gear they'll buy.

Many ski companies are owned by conglomerates looking for profits or ski companies whose big cash flows are from their racing teams as far as I can tell which means money going to them isn't staying solidly in the freesking sphere. That's not to say that some brands don't give back and invest in the culture (Line sponsoring the TAFT comes to mind), but this is the general feeling i have. I think NS itself has a great opportunity to leverage its popularity by having an affiliate store where NS can take a cut of sales from bigger brands to sustain itself and keep handing out cash to creators/ events. Combine this with also stocking the store with smaller skier owned brands that are for the culture outright (NS would get less of a cut depending on brand size/ coreness) means that NS can be a hub for the money in freestyle skiing where buyers can feel confident it will be recycled into our niche. Maybe the affiliate marketing would wreck NS's integrity as a news/ community source and introduce bias but im spitballing here.

TLDR: Newschoolers should start an affiliate store/ retailer
Aug 24 2022 2:23PM
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jakeordie
Posts: 654 - Karma: 3,242
AndrewGravesSVI think a big part of the issue is that the money freeskiers spend needs to stay within freeskiing specifically. As a demographic freestyle skiers are hard to pin down; street skiers, park skiers, and big mountain freeriders are all under the same umbrella of freeskiing but have different gear interests/ cultures. There's also certain level of gatekeeping/ required knowledge to join the group of "freestyle skiers" whether that is real or just perceived by outsiders. This all relates to how new folks get interested in being a freestyle skier and what brands/ gear they'll buy.

Many ski companies are owned by conglomerates looking for profits or ski companies whose big cash flows are from their racing teams as far as I can tell which means money going to them isn't staying solidly in the freesking sphere. That's not to say that some brands don't give back and invest in the culture (Line sponsoring the TAFT comes to mind), but this is the general feeling i have.

I wonder if the "freeskier" market has ever made a profit. Seems there was a time when the companies could write off whatever it cost them as a marketing expense, like if some kid watched the X-games and wanted Armada skis then the family would likely get geared up at an Amer retailer. But when the time came for those freeski brands to break even on their own, they couldn't do it.

It's shortsighted, but in an industry that won't have boomers or snow in the foreseeable future I get why they're calling it.
Aug 24 2022 4:38PM
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2GANGSTA
Posts: 17 - Karma: 105
pros/cons

+outdoors
+gear is available to anyone who can afford (china* cough cough)
+people who genuinely ski will tend to see the importance of not polluting the shit out of everything
+chairlifts and gondolas are fun to ride
+upper elevation training (8000+)
+exercise
+ski patrol
+longterm planning for epic powder trips (i'm 30, so i've probably got a few in the bag over the course of the next 70+ years)
+after-bang
+never been on a legit skinning mission
+hanging out with fellow skiers
+laying an edge


cons
-male dominated
-expensive as fuck
-people
-ego driven social dilemmas
-rich people
-"locals"
-injuries
-toxic competition
-collisions
-ski patrol
-travel intensive
-avalanches
-driving with idiots who flip their rigs
-where the ladies at?
-shin bang
-foggy goggles
-taking a dump while wearing full gear
-only hanging out with other skiers
-ski racers
Aug 24 2022 8:00PM
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skrubnick
Posts: 3 - Karma: 19
Farmville420Exactly. Back in the day it was just harder to be an am/pro. You couldn’t just drop edits, you had to constantly be traveling and filming and entering every possible contest. Now it’s so “easy” (You still obviously have to be disgustingly good) to pick up sponsors so the value of being sponsored is just way lower. Also why give someone a few checks and 20 pairs of skis when you can give 20 Instagram kids 1 pair of skis and no money and get the exact same brand exposure. There’s still money, but only the elite will ever see it, which I guess really hasn’t changed. I mean 10 years ago there was that sponsorship site where you would basically post your video and get these like microsponsorships, they would let you say you’re sponsored and all you would get is like a beanie or a case of monster or small crumbs like that, anyone remember that site I can’t think of the name

Still not sponsored
Aug 25 2022 7:29AM
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207
Posts: 8969 - Karma: 3,846
There’s no renaissance coming my dude, this shit is dying and quick. Not saying the sport ain’t fun, but park skiing is dead. Nobody builds parks anymore, nobody puts out good content anymore, instead it’s just Bruce Oldham mashing up him looking stupid in a selfie with the tik tok voice with his average skiing.

Shits dead, no more movie premieres, no more OG crews, it’s dead dawg, there ain’t no renaissance coming.
Aug 25 2022 11:16AM
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Farmville420
Posts: 4043 - Karma: 50,564
207There’s no renaissance coming my dude, this shit is dying and quick. Not saying the sport ain’t fun, but park skiing is dead. Nobody builds parks anymore, nobody puts out good content anymore, instead it’s just Bruce Oldham mashing up him looking stupid in a selfie with the tik tok voice with his average skiing.

Shits dead, no more movie premieres, no more OG crews, it’s dead dawg, there ain’t no renaissance coming.


Damn that’s crazy cuz last fall was arguably the best lineup of street movies in freeskiing a history, going to two movie premieres next month in denver and that’s just for level 1 alone, I feel like you’re just out of touch man, did you not buy slim to none or watch most gutter or something? That golden age shit is definitely still alive, as is an influx of new age shit, it’s honestly probably the highest volume of good ski content we’ve ever seen
Aug 25 2022 11:38AM
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207
Posts: 8969 - Karma: 3,846
lol i figured this would come up I probably shoulda clarified. Back in the day you had Matchsticks, Poor Boyz, Level 1, Stept, 4bi9, the list goes on and on premiering. Skiers were rockstars. Nowadays, yeah they got that level 1 premiere tour that’s all indie instagram kids, cool I guess, but c’mon don’t try and tell me the culture is the same, there were like 7 film companies on top of their game in the late 2000s early 2010s.

I will give it to you that Most Gutter and Slim to None were most definitely the best movies since HG skis Eat The Guts, but as you said Strictly is likely done...

Classics were getting dropped yearly, skiers were rockstars, parks were built big, edits were the name of the game, there was way more money, there were comps other than X games and cool events like Salomon Jib Academy, Orange Masters, this website was fucking poppin, not every 12 year old with a little bit of money and free time could dub 12, it will never be the same. If u were in that era it was untouchable. Like I said skiing is still fun as fuck but the culture is fucked these days. If you’re tryna tell yourself skiing park in 2022 feels the same as skiing park in 2012 youre lying to yourself.


Go out there and do your thing coz this shits still the funnest thing i’ve ever found and i still ski as much as I can
Farmville420Damn that’s crazy cuz last fall was arguably the best lineup of street movies in freeskiing a history, going to two movie premieres next month in denver and that’s just for level 1 alone, I feel like you’re just out of touch man, did you not buy slim to none or watch most gutter or something? That golden age shit is definitely still alive, as is an influx of new age shit, it’s honestly probably the highest volume of good ski content we’ve ever seen
Aug 25 2022 11:48AM
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mobadis
Posts: 406 - Karma: -3,486
207lol i figured this would come up I probably shoulda clarified. Back in the day you had Matchsticks, Poor Boyz, Level 1, Stept, 4bi9, the list goes on and on premiering. Skiers were rockstars. Nowadays, yeah they got that level 1 premiere tour that’s all indie instagram kids, cool I guess, but c’mon don’t try and tell me the culture is the same, there were like 7 film companies on top of their game in the late 2000s early 2010s.

I will give it to you that Most Gutter and Slim to None were most definitely the best movies since HG skis Eat The Guts, but as you said Strictly is likely done...

Classics were getting dropped yearly, skiers were rockstars, parks were built big, edits were the name of the game, there was way more money, there were comps other than X games and cool events like Salomon Jib Academy, Orange Masters, this website was fucking poppin, not every 12 year old with a little bit of money and free time could dub 12, it will never be the same. If u were in that era it was untouchable. Like I said skiing is still fun as fuck but the culture is fucked these days. If you’re tryna tell yourself skiing park in 2022 feels the same as skiing park in 2012 youre lying to yourself.


Go out there and do your thing coz this shits still the funnest thing i’ve ever found and i still ski as much as I can

Like with a lot of things in this day and age, things are moving away from being concentrated and centralized. That’s arguably a good thing. Sure there may no longer be 5 different sugar caffeine beverage goyslop™ world tours any more, but who really cares because television is dying, and rightfully so. That’s not to insinuate social media skiing is any better, but I’m hopeful that something good will arise from these times. The future is bright with brands like Jskis, on3p, Vishnu, jetcringe, 1000, twoot, etc. The days of line and armada being the top dogs are gone.
Aug 25 2022 5:25PM
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Farmville420
Posts: 4043 - Karma: 50,564
207lol i figured this would come up I probably shoulda clarified. Back in the day you had Matchsticks, Poor Boyz, Level 1, Stept, 4bi9, the list goes on and on premiering. Skiers were rockstars. Nowadays, yeah they got that level 1 premiere tour that’s all indie instagram kids, cool I guess, but c’mon don’t try and tell me the culture is the same, there were like 7 film companies on top of their game in the late 2000s early 2010s.

I will give it to you that Most Gutter and Slim to None were most definitely the best movies since HG skis Eat The Guts, but as you said Strictly is likely done...

Classics were getting dropped yearly, skiers were rockstars, parks were built big, edits were the name of the game, there was way more money, there were comps other than X games and cool events like Salomon Jib Academy, Orange Masters, this website was fucking poppin, not every 12 year old with a little bit of money and free time could dub 12, it will never be the same. If u were in that era it was untouchable. Like I said skiing is still fun as fuck but the culture is fucked these days. If you’re tryna tell yourself skiing park in 2022 feels the same as skiing park in 2012 youre lying to yourself.


Go out there and do your thing coz this shits still the funnest thing i’ve ever found and i still ski as much as I can

Not even trying to be snarky but let me ask you a real question: Do you yourself treat pros like superstars?
Aug 25 2022 7:25PM
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skiguy04
Posts: 1574 - Karma: 1,033
Walls of text but yeah like my friend said /\/\/\

..spinning not a trick. But we doing that Olympic judging shit all day
Aug 26 2022 2:12PM
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