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Hmm been skating longer than skiing and having a hard time imagining what you mean. In that last little back truck revert on a half cab I feel like it’s my legs doing all the work and my shoulders just naturally come around
KaicenglishIf you skate you can kind of think about it like when you do a half cab and pivot around on the back wheels. Mostly turning your shoulders all the way though i think
Sorry i meant more like doing the revert to help bring it around if it doesn’t go all the way, but the shoulders should lead it and you’ll bring it around all right. Sorry if this doesn’t make sense lol
DesertStixHmm been skating longer than skiing and having a hard time imagining what you mean. In that last little back truck revert on a half cab I feel like it’s my legs doing all the work and my shoulders just naturally come around
betzAre those moment wildcats? I try practicing butters on my 184 wildcat 108's but even my heavy 6'1" ass has trouble getting them to flex much. Like I have to lean super far forward. Or is that just with any ski and buttering.
Like it looks like you did a nice butter there but I don't see the ski flexing much. The cats are on the stiff side for sure though
They're actually Reckoner 122s. I was trying them out at the SIA On Snow demo two years ago. There was a bunch of fresh snow so I didn't need to put a ton of energy into that butter. I remember the skis feeling pretty damp and stable. Which I like, but it does come at the expense of playfulness.
Dr.ZorkoThey're actually Reckoner 122s. I was trying them out at the SIA On Snow demo two years ago. There was a bunch of fresh snow so I didn't need to put a ton of energy into that butter. I remember the skis feeling pretty damp and stable. Which I like, but it does come at the expense of playfulness.
Nice haha, looks like the same color blue as the 2020 wildcat 108 bases. I imagine the wildcats are still a tad stiffer. Maybe I'll try some butters in soft snow! My 2012 bent chetler 183s would be better at it I think.
Word I think I understand where you’re going. Maybe my problem is how to go from leaning forward in a nose butter to whipping that around back to regular with pop all while moving down hill. My brain has a disconnect after leaning forward switch like what’s next
KaicenglishSorry i meant more like doing the revert to help bring it around if it doesn’t go all the way, but the shoulders should lead it and you’ll bring it around all right. Sorry if this doesn’t make sense lol
DesertStixWord I think I understand where you’re going. Maybe my problem is how to go from leaning forward in a nose butter to whipping that around back to regular with pop all while moving down hill. My brain has a disconnect after leaning forward switch like what’s next
It should be one fluid movement for a nose but 3/5/7 and so on.
if you watch any of the nose but 3s here you can see most people get pretty far backseat when they bring it around.
I think that’s part of my problem. My brain breaks it up into two motions. Am I essentially setting a flat ground 360 while just grossly leaning over my tips?
ajbskiIt should be one fluid movement for a nose but 3/5/7 and so on.
if you watch any of the nose but 3s here you can see most people get pretty far backseat when they bring it around.
DesertStixI think that’s part of my problem. My brain breaks it up into two motions. Am I essentially setting a flat ground 360 while just grossly leaning over my tips?
pretty much, flat ground cork 3.
just like corks, the more off axis you get the cooler (imo). a knuckle or roller helps with the nose press part.
butters are still a pretty open ended trick, people do them a lot of different ways. depends on how you are trying to make it look.
DesertStixHmm been skating longer than skiing and having a hard time imagining what you mean. In that last little back truck revert on a half cab I feel like it’s my legs doing all the work and my shoulders just naturally come around
Ok here goes....
Butters are a lot more than just tossing your weight around. They are a series of controlled movements that work best when you bring momentum and a decent amount of speed into the equation. One of the things I never hear people talk about when trying to describe how to do Butters, is the fact that you need to have speed when you're coming into the trick to help initialize the skis flexing.
The initiation of the butter is the most important part of the entire trick. Every butter no matter how big of a spin, happens at 180. Your goal is to smoothly load up the tips of your skis as you press forward and rotate into 180 to get to the point where you snap at 180 and initiate the rest of the spin. Your pop point is always at 180 so hitting that is critical to being successful for the rest of the trick. That being said, 540s definitely work better than 360s in my experience if you are doing the snap correctly. To initiate the butter, I would recommend making a large s carve into the roller (which is the easiest feature to do it on), where the s-curve ends in the direction that you would like to butter. One of the trickiest parts of buttering (at least how I do them, which I think is relatively the proper way to do it), is to keep your inside edges in the snow and your outer edges out so that they don't hang up when you initiate onto the noses and start to spin around, and I do that by bending both knees to one side while keeping your feet under you and your feet relatively together as seen in the video embedded here.
Keeping both feet together the entire time during the trick is one of the most important things for maintaining stability and also creating pop at the correct time during the execution of the trick. Keeping your feet together during the whole trick will allow you to get the most energy out of the ski, and really push into it to get the flex and pop you're looking for. Loading up the tips of your skis doesn't have to happen instantly either, focus on being smooth and transferring your weight forward strongly and confidently during the last part of the S carve so that you swing around on the balance point of the tips of your skis.
The balance point is another very important part of buttering, the balance point of every ski is different both in where it is from tip to the middle of the ski as well as how wide it is and how forward it back you can lean and press the ski without going too far and slipping out, or staying on the ground entirely. You can feel this out on your skis by just standing on the flat ground and leaning forward to feel where you're balanced while still pressing so the back of your skis is off the snow and in the air a decent amount.
After you've done the S carve, leaned in, initiated, gone 180, and popped the trick, you want to focus on spotting your landing and leading the rest of the spin with your upper body. Like I said before, 540 works better if done properly.
Let me know if you have any questions, and analyze the video carefully.
Butters are a lot more than just tossing your weight around. They are a series of controlled movements that work best when you bring momentum and a decent amount of speed into the equation. One of the things I never hear people talk about when trying to describe how to do Butters, is the fact that you need to have speed when you're coming into the trick to help initialize the skis flexing.
The initiation of the butter is the most important part of the entire trick. Every butter no matter how big of a spin, happens at 180. Your goal is to smoothly load up the tips of your skis as you press forward and rotate into 180 to get to the point where you snap at 180 and initiate the rest of the spin. Your pop point is always at 180 so hitting that is critical to being successful for the rest of the trick. That being said, 540s definitely work better than 360s in my experience if you are doing the snap correctly. To initiate the butter, I would recommend making a large s carve into the roller (which is the easiest feature to do it on), where the s-curve ends in the direction that you would like to butter. One of the trickiest parts of buttering (at least how I do them, which I think is relatively the proper way to do it), is to keep your inside edges in the snow and your outer edges out so that they don't hang up when you initiate onto the noses and start to spin around, and I do that by bending both knees to one side while keeping your feet under you and your feet relatively together as seen in the video embedded here.
Keeping both feet together the entire time during the trick is one of the most important things for maintaining stability and also creating pop at the correct time during the execution of the trick. Keeping your feet together during the whole trick will allow you to get the most energy out of the ski, and really push into it to get the flex and pop you're looking for. Loading up the tips of your skis doesn't have to happen instantly either, focus on being smooth and transferring your weight forward strongly and confidently during the last part of the S carve so that you swing around on the balance point of the tips of your skis.
The balance point is another very important part of buttering, the balance point of every ski is different both in where it is from tip to the middle of the ski as well as how wide it is and how forward it back you can lean and press the ski without going too far and slipping out, or staying on the ground entirely. You can feel this out on your skis by just standing on the flat ground and leaning forward to feel where you're balanced while still pressing so the back of your skis is off the snow and in the air a decent amount.
After you've done the S carve, leaned in, initiated, gone 180, and popped the trick, you want to focus on spotting your landing and leading the rest of the spin with your upper body. Like I said before, 540 works better if done properly.
Let me know if you have any questions, and analyze the video carefully.
**This post was edited on Nov 18th 2021 at 4:46:52pm
This is a more thorough explanation of what i was trying to say. Well said! I was just trusting your skis and putting more weight on the tips is the first key to cleaning up butters
I am far from a peak athlete. I 6.2 250 and I can butter and half bad at skiing. If anything My chonk makes it easier. It's just finding the new balance point and rotating with it as you manipulate your edges.
Now that I wrote it out it does sound complicated
Shit
Jemsim not half bad at skiing I just can't do it. I like to think people with peak athleticism are the only ones who can do real ass butters.
