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Touring binding advice
Whatsup guys, I'm lookin for a binding that i can ride inbounds every day, but also do some slack country/day treks with that won't kill me because of the weight. I've looked at the marker baron and dukes, and the salomon guardian 16s. From all the reviews I've read, they seem to be a pain in the ass to tour with because they're so bulky. Any suggestions?
DunnersWhatsup guys, I'm lookin for a binding that i can ride inbounds every day, but also do some slack country/day treks with that won't kill me because of the weight. I've looked at the marker baron and dukes, and the salomon guardian 16s. From all the reviews I've read, they seem to be a pain in the ass to tour with because they're so bulky. Any suggestions?
if your boot has pin inserts, then the Salomon/Atomic shift coming out for 18/19 is what you're looking for. rides like an alpine, tours as pin on the up. they're slightly heavier than kingpins but seem well worth it for the downhill performance. Cheaper than kingpin too.
If you need to go for a frame binding (as in you'll be using an alpine style boot) then the marker tour f12 epf is a little lighter than the barons, guardians etc but slightly less burly - its built around the squire binding rather than the griffon
roharaif your boot has pin inserts, then the Salomon/Atomic shift coming out for 18/19 is what you're looking for. rides like an alpine, tours as pin on the up. they're slightly heavier than kingpins but seem well worth it for the downhill performance. Cheaper than kingpin too.
If you need to go for a frame binding (as in you'll be using an alpine style boot) then the marker tour f12 epf is a little lighter than the barons, guardians etc but slightly less burly - its built around the squire binding rather than the griffon
I would be all over the shift if I could get a cheap used pair but 650 is out of my price range considering I'm buying an entire new setup. I did some research on the f12s and saw people saying there was a lot of toe wiggle which worries me
Cast
Cade2Cast
already obsolete.
Daymakers?
Sessionalready obsolete.
Yeah the tech from the shift makes it obsolete. But if you regularly break bindings like some of us do, it is worth the sacrifices you make. Those who use it know it’s limitations
BrawnTrendsDaymakers?
Seem to be too heavy and a bitch to make room for when descending
DunnersI would be all over the shift if I could get a cheap used pair but 650 is out of my price range considering I'm buying an entire new setup. I did some research on the f12s and saw people saying there was a lot of toe wiggle which worries me
Yea fair enough man, touring gear really runs up the price. Hadn't heard that about the F12's- I ride a pair of barons and have never had any issues with them, but your original point about them being a relatively heavy option is still valid. There isn't really that many other options if you're looking for a strong downhill performance, I've heard good things about the fritschi tecton but don't know anything about them so can't really comment. Still uses pins in the toe on downhill though so won't ever feel as strong as something using an alpine style toepiece
roharaYea fair enough man, touring gear really runs up the price. Hadn't heard that about the F12's- I ride a pair of barons and have never had any issues with them, but your original point about them being a relatively heavy option is still valid. There isn't really that many other options if you're looking for a strong downhill performance, I've heard good things about the fritschi tecton but don't know anything about them so can't really comment. Still uses pins in the toe on downhill though so won't ever feel as strong as something using an alpine style toepiece
Just did some more research and I'm starting to lean towards the guardians/trackers. Sure they're a bit heavy but i think the confidence they give in alpine is worth it
**This post was edited on Mar 26th 2018 at 1:11:50pm
Sessionalready obsolete.
I wouldn't call them obsolete, just another option in the market.
If I recall, the weight difference (on your feet) is negligible. Sure, you have to carry toe pieces around, but that's a whatever since it's easy to ditch a few things from a backpack when touring to lose weight. We know CAST is bomb-proof (at least 1st gen, 2nd still has yet to be tested long-term but I can't imagine it'll get worse) but SHIFT is more of an unknown.
Also, "officially" you cannot use CAST-modified boots in the SHIFT binding. That means if you're the kind of person who likes their plug boots or the more consistent flex of a boot w/o a walk-mode, you're shit out of luck. Unofficially it's a different story ;).
It really comes down to cost IMO. If you have P18s, CAST is going to cost ~$350, while SHIFT is closer to $600.
DunnersJust did some more research and I'm starting to lean towards the guardians/trackers. Sure they're a bit heavy but i think the confidence they give in alpine is worth it
**This post was edited on Mar 26th 2018 at 1:11:50pm
Also, OP, I'd go with a CAST set up instead of the Guardians/Trackers. You can find 1st Gen sets on TGR that will open up the options for bindings beyond P18s.
I skied the Trackers for a season and then went over to Kingpins and it was like night and day in terms of quality of touring. The touring efficiency with a toe-pivot point with a pin binding is so much better than what plate bindings offer. It also feels a hell of a lot lighter since you're not carrying extra weight underneath your foot.
.MASSHOLE.Also, "officially" you cannot use CAST-modified boots in the SHIFT binding. That means if you're the kind of person who likes their plug boots or the more consistent flex of a boot w/o a walk-mode, you're shit out of luck. Unofficially it's a different story ;).
It really comes down to cost IMO. If you have P18s, CAST is going to cost ~$350, while SHIFT is closer to $600.
You can actually. The shift conversion only works for the way up so does not work with kingpin but would with shift as you only use the pins for the way up.
Honestly having skied the shift it really does kind of make the cast system obsolete.
I ended up scooping a super cheap set of look XMs which is the same binding as the guardian/tracker. I've never tried any touring so i think itll work out as a beginner to some basic side country off piste and then i can transition into some shifts when I get more money
tomPietrowskiYou can actually. The shift conversion only works for the way up so does not work with kingpin but would with shift as you only use the pins for the way up.
Honestly having skied the shift it really does kind of make the cast system obsolete.
I meant legally, not in actuality ;). You ski a CAST-modified boot and get hurt on the SHIFT because of a gear failure, there's no option for legal recourse. If it happens with a Lupo, QST, Hawk XTD, etc., you do.
I still think there's a place for CAST. Smaller than it was, for sure, but it's still there. I don't think you'll ever seen guys like Sam
Anthamatten, Johnny Collinson, Jeremy Heitz, etc. skiing the big lines they ski on the SHIFT, especially given the newness of the system. It could change in the future, but as of right now I don't think so. But that's me.
.MASSHOLE.I don't think you'll ever seen guys like Sam Anthamatten, Johnny Collinson, Jeremy Heitz, etc. skiing the big lines they ski on the SHIFT, especially given the newness of the system. It could change in the future, but as of right now I don't think so. But that's me.
Tm hit Chad's with them
https://www.instagram.com/p/BgoYSjahssE/?hl=en&taken-by=timdurtschi
JahAndNicoteneTm hit Chad's with them
https://www.instagram.com/p/BgoYSjahssE/?hl=en&taken-by=timdurtschi
Different landing on that than landing in crud, chunder, windbuff, and other shit you find in the alps.
I'm not saying you won't get some of them to convert, but there still will be a place for CAST.
.MASSHOLE.Different landing on that than landing in crud, chunder, windbuff, and other shit you find in the alps.
I'm not saying you won't get some of them to convert, but there still will be a place for CAST.
Oh for sure I was just pointing out that the SHIFT is going through some tough testing.
I'm a Daymaker + FKS guy myself.
JahAndNicoteneOh for sure I was just pointing out that the SHIFT is going through some tough testing.
I'm a Daymaker + FKS guy myself.
How do you like your daymakers? I've heard the blind spot they make is pretty uncomfortable and they add quite a bit of weight to your ascend
.MASSHOLE.I meant legally, not in actuality ;). You ski a CAST-modified boot and get hurt on the SHIFT because of a gear failure, there's no option for legal recourse. If it happens with a Lupo, QST, Hawk XTD, etc., you do.
I still think there's a place for CAST. Smaller than it was, for sure, but it's still there. I don't think you'll ever seen guys like Sam
Anthamatten, Johnny Collinson, Jeremy Heitz, etc. skiing the big lines they ski on the SHIFT, especially given the newness of the system. It could change in the future, but as of right now I don't think so. But that's me.
I would think if you hurt yourself in your nose that's on you rather then the binding haha. You will have the toe locked so it's not like your real sing anyway. If anything the cast conversion may actually save you if the pins rip out.
Honestly for touring this this is the best there is. It's not as good as a sth16 or a pivot 18 but considering how light and how good it is there is nothing else close to it.
DunnersHow do you like your daymakers? I've heard the blind spot they make is pretty uncomfortable and they add quite a bit of weight to your ascend
Yeah they're heavy and they take up room in your pack. But the trade off is that you have super solid equipment that is less likely to break when you're out in the middle of nowhere. And you get to use alpine bindings which are safe. And last but not least, you can tour on whichever skis you want, you don't have to get all new bindings. So those reasons, to me, are worth the weight and space sacrifice.
What do you mean by blind spot? I haven't had that many days on them this season so maybe I can't speak for them fully
JahAndNicoteneYeah they're heavy and they take up room in your pack. But the trade off is that you have super solid equipment that is less likely to break when you're out in the middle of nowhere. And you get to use alpine bindings which are safe. And last but not least, you can tour on whichever skis you want, you don't have to get all new bindings. So those reasons, to me, are worth the weight and space sacrifice.
What do you mean by blind spot? I haven't had that many days on them this season so maybe I can't speak for them fully
A lot of people complain that since you're elevated so high off your skis, you tend to have blind spots at the waist of your skis depending on the situation
roharaYea fair enough man, touring gear really runs up the price. Hadn't heard that about the F12's- I ride a pair of barons and have never had any issues with them, but your original point about them being a relatively heavy option is still valid. There isn't really that many other options if you're looking for a strong downhill performance, I've heard good things about the fritschi tecton but don't know anything about them so can't really comment. Still uses pins in the toe on downhill though so won't ever feel as strong as something using an alpine style toepiece
You have any opinions on the marker kingpins on their downhill performance?
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