Why Do My Skis Break So Damn Fast

Well it's just whats happening to the skis, I don't know the durability of those skis. Maybe it's just you sending it too hard, but don't stop doing that.

Are there many ditches at your home resort just out of interest?

Thread is useless without pictures. And if I remember correctly from the last thread, you didn’t detune properly.

Have you had this problem with other skis? My stingers lasted 150ish days with only three edge cracks before the edge was falling out too much to ski.

Bases dimple when you get a lot of edge cracks. You get a lot of edge cracks when you hit a lot of rails.

Julius_SteezerAre there many ditches at your home resort just out of interest?

Ditches with no snow? Nope. My home resort has no tree skiing / rocks on hill, and always has a solidly deep base of snow.

LemuelThread is useless without pictures. And if I remember correctly from the last thread, you didn’t detune properly.

Have you had this problem with other skis? My stingers lasted 150ish days with only three edge cracks before the edge was falling out too much to ski.

Bases dimple when you get a lot of edge cracks. You get a lot of edge cracks when you hit a lot of rails.

Yeah, I messed up the original detune, but caught it quick and fixed it with an angle grinder. Been detuning my skis the same way for many years now and haven’t had this issue til recently, and only with the 2 pairs of skis I’ve been on this season, but I guess that’s because I’m skiing harder than ever now.

Update: for some reason not everything I typed into the OP got posted, so probably gonna start a new thread or something and fix that.

SweetbreadBenMaybe it's just you sending it too hard, but don't stop doing that.

One of the things cutoff from OP was my instagram. @skimanseanyp if you want an idea of what these skis are going through.

SteezMcGeeOne of the things cutoff from OP was my instagram. @skimanseanyp if you want an idea of what these skis are going through.

Cheeky advertising, I'll check it out later

SweetbreadBenCheeky advertising, I'll check it out later

They say all publicity is good publicity haha

Heres the science on edge cracks:

Its caused by heat stress by the metal on metal friction, heating a section of the rail, then getting quenched by the cold snow. Do it enough times and the inter-granular bonding breaks down in the steel, causing it to warp and crack. The edge begins to pull out from the friction of the steel-steel contact because of the resistance force pulling the edge in the backward direction.

The best way to help with cracking is to round out the edge as smoothly as possible. The first reason is sharp corners gather more heat faster because of lack of surface area and are more brittle than dull surfaces. Rounding out the edge will increase the surface area of contact and dissipate the heat over a wider area. It will also make the edge stronger overall.

Sure, it sounds bad. But thats why you should have a pair of park skis and a pair of turn skis. Your turn skis should never ride a box or rail until it retires. Keep the turn skis super tuned and keep the park skis detuned and waxed.

Now to deal with core rot. Depending on the topsheet material and base, they do crack over time. Around the screws of the bindings, snow can accumulate, melt and seep into the core. Do you leave your skis in the car all winter long outside? Congrats! you did the best thing to kill a ski. Cars are bad for humidity and the melt occurs as you drive home. Leave it in the car overnight and the water freezes in the ski; destroying the core. Same goes with cracked edges. Store your skis indoors all the time in a dark, dry location and it will be fine. Wood cores are prone to root due to the nature of wood. Keep them dry!

Hope this helps in the future.

^ legend

freestyler540Heres the science on edge cracks:

Its caused by heat stress by the metal on metal friction, heating a section of the rail, then getting quenched by the cold snow. Do it enough times and the inter-granular bonding breaks down in the steel, causing it to warp and crack. The edge begins to pull out from the friction of the steel-steel contact because of the resistance force pulling the edge in the backward direction.

The best way to help with cracking is to round out the edge as smoothly as possible. The first reason is sharp corners gather more heat faster because of lack of surface area and are more brittle than dull surfaces. Rounding out the edge will increase the surface area of contact and dissipate the heat over a wider area. It will also make the edge stronger overall.

Sure, it sounds bad. But thats why you should have a pair of park skis and a pair of turn skis. Your turn skis should never ride a box or rail until it retires. Keep the turn skis super tuned and keep the park skis detuned and waxed.

Now to deal with core rot. Depending on the topsheet material and base, they do crack over time. Around the screws of the bindings, snow can accumulate, melt and seep into the core. Do you leave your skis in the car all winter long outside? Congrats! you did the best thing to kill a ski. Cars are bad for humidity and the melt occurs as you drive home. Leave it in the car overnight and the water freezes in the ski; destroying the core. Same goes with cracked edges. Store your skis indoors all the time in a dark, dry location and it will be fine. Wood cores are prone to root due to the nature of wood. Keep them dry!

Hope this helps in the future.

Up until recently always thought dulling the edge was just for not catching... learned that the hard way. As far as storing the ski, already doing that. Thanks for the science behind it though, I’ll use that in the future for sure!

Exclusively using an angle grinder to de-tune your skis is probably going to do more harm than good unless you polished your edges with a gummi stone or fine stone file afterwards. An angle grinder will remove that crisp 90 degree edge on your new skis, but its also gunna remove more than what is naturally necessary and it's likely to leave your edges cover with small striations that are more prone to edge cracks.

Keeping your skis warm and dry post-shred to mitigate any moisture penetrating into the core and then freezing/expanding will seriously increase the length of your skis life, even if they do have edge cracks or base damage. On that note; using epoxy or strong glue to cover/seal any chips or splits, even if its not a permanent fix, with slow the penetration of water.

If you are a beginner-intermediate skier you are bound to be less graceful on your skis, so your skis are going to take more of a beating getting onto rails, scissoring rails, or even just knocking/catching on each other when doing tricks and falling.

I'm not saying all of this exclusively applies to you OP, but they're just tips that I have come to know over years of taking care of my own equipment and working at a shop.

steezy.stewExclusively using an angle grinder to de-tune your skis is probably going to do more harm than good unless you polished your edges with a gummi stone or fine stone file afterwards. An angle grinder will remove that crisp 90 degree edge on your new skis, but its also gunna remove more than what is naturally necessary and it's likely to leave your edges cover with small striations that are more prone to edge cracks.

Keeping your skis warm and dry post-shred to mitigate any moisture penetrating into the core and then freezing/expanding will seriously increase the length of your skis life, even if they do have edge cracks or base damage. On that note; using epoxy or strong glue to cover/seal any chips or splits, even if its not a permanent fix, with slow the penetration of water.

If you are a beginner-intermediate skier you are bound to be less graceful on your skis, so your skis are going to take more of a beating getting onto rails, scissoring rails, or even just knocking/catching on each other when doing tricks and falling.

I'm not saying all of this exclusively applies to you OP, but they're just tips that I have come to know over years of taking care of my own equipment and working at a shop.

Yep, I diamond stone filed them after grinding. Also one of the things cut off from my original typing was my epoxy use. I’ve epoxied them at least in 6 different spots, and the epoxy application began as soon as I caught the problems, which was day 1 on the skis. And yeah my skis knock a lot, nature of the game I guess.

freestyler540Heres the science on edge cracks:

Its caused by heat stress by the metal on metal friction, heating a section of the rail, then getting quenched by the cold snow. Do it enough times and the inter-granular bonding breaks down in the steel, causing it to warp and crack. The edge begins to pull out from the friction of the steel-steel contact because of the resistance force pulling the edge in the backward direction.

The best way to help with cracking is to round out the edge as smoothly as possible. The first reason is sharp corners gather more heat faster because of lack of surface area and are more brittle than dull surfaces. Rounding out the edge will increase the surface area of contact and dissipate the heat over a wider area. It will also make the edge stronger overall.

Sure, it sounds bad. But thats why you should have a pair of park skis and a pair of turn skis. Your turn skis should never ride a box or rail until it retires. Keep the turn skis super tuned and keep the park skis detuned and waxed.

Now to deal with core rot. Depending on the topsheet material and base, they do crack over time. Around the screws of the bindings, snow can accumulate, melt and seep into the core. Do you leave your skis in the car all winter long outside? Congrats! you did the best thing to kill a ski. Cars are bad for humidity and the melt occurs as you drive home. Leave it in the car overnight and the water freezes in the ski; destroying the core. Same goes with cracked edges. Store your skis indoors all the time in a dark, dry location and it will be fine. Wood cores are prone to root due to the nature of wood. Keep them dry!

Hope this helps in the future.

I know some company's like liberty skis, use softer edges for their park skis. I've always thought that they do it because harder steel is more brittle than softer steel. However I don't know if this is totally true and I don't know if this is the reason why they do it. Also I'd assume that softer steel detunes quicker on rails. So do you know why they do it?

freestyler540Heres the science on edge cracks:

Its caused by heat stress by the metal on metal friction, heating a section of the rail, then getting quenched by the cold snow. Do it enough times and the inter-granular bonding breaks down in the steel, causing it to warp and crack. The edge begins to pull out from the friction of the steel-steel contact because of the resistance force pulling the edge in the backward direction.

The best way to help with cracking is to round out the edge as smoothly as possible. The first reason is sharp corners gather more heat faster because of lack of surface area and are more brittle than dull surfaces. Rounding out the edge will increase the surface area of contact and dissipate the heat over a wider area. It will also make the edge stronger overall.

Sure, it sounds bad. But thats why you should have a pair of park skis and a pair of turn skis. Your turn skis should never ride a box or rail until it retires. Keep the turn skis super tuned and keep the park skis detuned and waxed.

Now to deal with core rot. Depending on the topsheet material and base, they do crack over time. Around the screws of the bindings, snow can accumulate, melt and seep into the core. Do you leave your skis in the car all winter long outside? Congrats! you did the best thing to kill a ski. Cars are bad for humidity and the melt occurs as you drive home. Leave it in the car overnight and the water freezes in the ski; destroying the core. Same goes with cracked edges. Store your skis indoors all the time in a dark, dry location and it will be fine. Wood cores are prone to root due to the nature of wood. Keep them dry!

Hope this helps in the future.

Fuck, I leave my skis in the car all the time.

Nickc88I know some company's like liberty skis, use softer edges for their park skis. I've always thought that they do it because harder steel is more brittle than softer steel.

That is correct.
To elaborate on the answer, soft (mild or low carbon) steel can spread heat faster than higher carbon steel. It has the added advantage of being less brittle and be less subject to thermal stresses from thermal shock. It has to do with expansion coefficients. Carbon and Iron expand at 2 different rates when applied the same amount of heat. As the steel heats, the metal expands in some places, but doesnt in others; if the stresses are too great between the 2, the edge cracks. As steel is heated, some of the trapped carbon moves within the grains; creating weakness on a microscopic view. As the edge hits the snow, the iron re-traps the carbon (poorly remixed on quenching) and creating internal fissures and microscopic warping. So having less carbon in the steel is a good way to go to stretch the life out of the product.

The down side is soft steel is really prone to rusting. The steel is alloyed with other metals to improve certain qualities of the edge. Most mixtures are company secrets.

freestyler540Heres the science on edge cracks:

Its caused by heat stress by the metal on metal friction, heating a section of the rail, then getting quenched by the cold snow. Do it enough times and the inter-granular bonding breaks down in the steel, causing it to warp and crack. The edge begins to pull out from the friction of the steel-steel contact because of the resistance force pulling the edge in the backward direction.

The best way to help with cracking is to round out the edge as smoothly as possible. The first reason is sharp corners gather more heat faster because of lack of surface area and are more brittle than dull surfaces. Rounding out the edge will increase the surface area of contact and dissipate the heat over a wider area. It will also make the edge stronger overall.

Sure, it sounds bad. But thats why you should have a pair of park skis and a pair of turn skis. Your turn skis should never ride a box or rail until it retires. Keep the turn skis super tuned and keep the park skis detuned and waxed.

Now to deal with core rot. Depending on the topsheet material and base, they do crack over time. Around the screws of the bindings, snow can accumulate, melt and seep into the core. Do you leave your skis in the car all winter long outside? Congrats! you did the best thing to kill a ski. Cars are bad for humidity and the melt occurs as you drive home. Leave it in the car overnight and the water freezes in the ski; destroying the core. Same goes with cracked edges. Store your skis indoors all the time in a dark, dry location and it will be fine. Wood cores are prone to root due to the nature of wood. Keep them dry!

Hope this helps in the future.

Source? This seems to be written purely on speculation without any actually scientific testing.

How hot does an edge get when you slide a rail?
How hot does an edge need to be to warp?
How much of a temperature difference is need for steel to exhibit significantly reduced bond strength?

Does steel work harden? Some metals do, some don't.
If steel work hardens could the edge cracking not be from the increase in brittleness?
Does steel need a temperature change to work harden?

Temperature might have nothing to do with it and simply the forces being put on the edges cause it to work harden and become more brittle and crack. Obviously heat is produced in this process, but is heat just an insignificant byproduct or is heat the whole reason it's happening?

Edges are hardened to some extent already, is the amount of heating/cooling that does happens to them when you slide a rail enough to harden them more or does it actually cause them to loose their temper and become softer?


So many questions to be answered about this. I don't believe your explanation can be said as fact without actually doing testing.



Then you say lack of surface area means more heat? Only if the surface area that is touching has a friction coefficient is high enough to compensate for the smaller surface area. If the friction coefficient is the same (it should be similar, being that it's the same material) then less surface area means less heat. Does angle affect friction coefficient? Actually I'm thinking given all things equal if an edge is sharp with less surface area touching the rail vs dull with more, there will be the exact same amount of heat generated. The heat dissipation makes sense.

Does the shape of the edge actually make a difference in how brittle it is? I wouldn't think so.


Also if your bindings are properly mounted with some glue or whatever to seal the screw hole then leaving them wet or dry will make no difference (so long as it is properly sealed with something that isn't broken down by moisture). If water can't get to your core it can't rot your core.

Also foam cores rot too.



Not trying to be a dick, just this is how misinformation is spread. It just seems a little too wishy-washy to be from an actual study and seems like it's entirely conjecture. If you have a primary source I would love to read it.

Detune your edges. Also make sure to talk to your skis. Think of them like a horse, you don't just jump on it and tell it to go. You caress it, you speak to it softly. You let it know how you feel, prepare it for the journey and then jump on for the ride.

Skis are no different. Think of how your skis feel if you just yank them out of your car, throw them in the cold snow, and shove your boots into them. Think about their feelings, and be a friend to your skis. Chat with them while you put on your boots, take them to breakfast, maybe even store them in your bed. Treat your skis with the respect they deserve and they will treat you well and stick around for a while.

Be kind to your skis!

VinnieFSource? This seems to be written purely on speculation without any actually scientific testing.

How hot does an edge get when you slide a rail?
How hot does an edge need to be to warp?
How much of a temperature difference is need for steel to exhibit significantly reduced bond strength?

Does steel work harden? Some metals do, some don't.
If steel work hardens could the edge cracking not be from the increase in brittleness?
Does steel need a temperature change to work harden?

Temperature might have nothing to do with it and simply the forces being put on the edges cause it to work harden and become more brittle and crack. Obviously heat is produced in this process, but is heat just an insignificant byproduct or is heat the whole reason it's happening?

Edges are hardened to some extent already, is the amount of heating/cooling that does happens to them when you slide a rail enough to harden them more or does it actually cause them to loose their temper and become softer?


So many questions to be answered about this. I don't believe your explanation can be said as fact without actually doing testing.



Then you say lack of surface area means more heat? Only if the surface area that is touching has a friction coefficient is high enough to compensate for the smaller surface area. If the friction coefficient is the same (it should be similar, being that it's the same material) then less surface area means less heat. Does angle affect friction coefficient? Actually I'm thinking given all things equal if an edge is sharp with less surface area touching the rail vs dull with more, there will be the exact same amount of heat generated. The heat dissipation makes sense.

Does the shape of the edge actually make a difference in how brittle it is? I wouldn't think so.


Also if your bindings are properly mounted with some glue or whatever to seal the screw hole then leaving them wet or dry will make no difference (so long as it is properly sealed with something that isn't broken down by moisture). If water can't get to your core it can't rot your core.

Also foam cores rot too.



Not trying to be a dick, just this is how misinformation is spread. It just seems a little too wishy-washy to be from an actual study and seems like it's entirely conjecture. If you have a primary source I would love to read it.

Holy fuck Vinnie, Im not a metallurgist here. Im a marine engineer for crying out loud. This answer was not in any means a research paper on metallurgy of steel and thermodynamics to apply to the strength of materials. I manipulate steel and use engineering principles all the time at work, not write papers about skiing.

I had to omit a lot. Some from not knowing exact numbers and formulae, some is so abstract you have to have taken 2 semesters of strength of materials, 1 semester of applied mechanics and 4 semesters of thermodynamics. I just briefly summed up my theoretical knowledge to a explain a phenomenon. Did it make sense to you? yeah? great! My explanation passed the first critical thinking test. Still completely confused? I may have written this out poorly. Im an engineer, not an author.

A lot of your post just cant be answered in a post. But you did bring up case hardening. I can dive into that a little bit. Quenching is a process that leads to case hardening. In depth, in means you are turning the ferridic steel into a pearlitic or cementetic form on the quenched surface( all it means is higher concentration carbon will change the shape of the steel grains and their boundaries). The carbon migrates from the surrounding to sit on the surface when it is red hot and then gets locked into the surface of the steel. Higher the carbon content, higher the brittleness in steel. However, its not the impact forces on and off the rails that cause the cracking; its all about thermal stress. So yes, you are case hardening the edge every time you ride a rail. However, the carbon % is really low so not too many carbons move.

Yes, foam cores get moldy too. Anything gets moldy in humidity and lack of light. Its the decay of the wood that kills a wood core. Its the humidity in the foam that expands, cracks and warps the ski, or breaks the bonding of the foam. Mold just keeps the humidity where the spores wanna grow.

The referenced post has been removed.

I may be taking a few too many tries at the 140 footer... and I'm at Louis just about every Sat and Sun, and of course I've seen you there, we all have haha

theabortionatorDetune your edges. Also make sure to talk to your skis. Think of them like a horse, you don't just jump on it and tell it to go. You caress it, you speak to it softly. You let it know how you feel, prepare it for the journey and then jump on for the ride.

Skis are no different. Think of how your skis feel if you just yank them out of your car, throw them in the cold snow, and shove your boots into them. Think about their feelings, and be a friend to your skis. Chat with them while you put on your boots, take them to breakfast, maybe even store them in your bed. Treat your skis with the respect they deserve and they will treat you well and stick around for a while.

Be kind to your skis!

My instagram bio says "abuse skis not women"... might have to go change that.

Couldn't post pics on original post because it was on mobile. Here's pics:

The referenced post has been removed.

I've been wanting to come up there someday for a while, you guys have big rails and it's only like 5 hrs