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Scraping & Brushing Skis For Maximum Speed.

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DominatorJacques
Posts: 11247 - Karma: 76,550
Don't overlook good scraping & brushing when you need speed to do what you do!

Here's how I do it. Plus a bunch of other good advice and videos in this thread.

https://www.newschoolers.com/videos/watch/798663/Scraping--amp--Brushing-Skis-Final-Preparation-Of-Ski

**This thread was edited on Oct 22nd 2018 at 1:21:02pm
9 years ago
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brov1
Posts: 1826 - Karma: 8,838
DominatorJacquesThat's a fallacy. Good luck with that.

If you are not totally brushing out the ski, you would be better off not waxing at all.


if you are racing then the incredibly small difference the brushing makes is worth it otherwise it not
9 years ago
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DominatorJacques
Posts: 11247 - Karma: 76,550
brov1i mean i wax skis for a living. i brush all the skis that go out to customers solely for appearance. i have both brushed and not brushed my several pairs of skis and i honestly notice no difference in performance. buffing the ski is a different story if you friction buff the wax into the ski after scraping then there is a very minor improvement. any groomed run will take the miniscule amount of excess right off.


I'm not going to argue with you. I will say I can tell the difference.
9 years ago
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DominatorJacques
Posts: 11247 - Karma: 76,550
Scrape and brush like a demon!
9 years ago
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skidemon22
Posts: 4463 - Karma: 2,049
Solid Video! as another tech and someone who waxes skis daily, there is a lot of information in here.

Scraping and brushing is crucial, i don't know why anyone would argue. I suppose if you are not a racer, looking to eek out those milliseconds on the course, then you don't need to do a brass, nylon and then a horse hair brushing regiment. BUT after you do a solid scrape job, at the very least use a nylon brush. But doing a few passes with a brass brush will really cut down the time it takes to get that wax out of the structure.

What is your opinion on using a roto brush tool for a drill?
9 years ago
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onenerdykid
Posts: 6744 - Karma: 11,760
brov1i mean i wax skis for a living. i brush all the skis that go out to customers solely for appearance.


No doubt a well polished base looks better than a base that is simply scraped, but it will also be faster. And you will notice this in super super cold conditions and super super warm conditions. A non-scraped base will leave trace amounts of wax on the surface which ultimately slows the ski down. In these extreme cold and extreme warm conditions, it is imperative to have the base's structure clean because this will prevent ice crystals from digging in (during extreme cold temps) and it will prevent suction from occurring (during extreme warm temps). It will be in these extremes that it is most obvious.

Additionally, I would bet dollars to donuts that if you had a sintered base that had a temperature/condition appropriate base grind, matching wax treatment, proper scrape, and proper brushing that it would be tangibly & noticeably better compared to the same sintered base that had an all-condition base grind, universal wax treatment, proper scrape but improper brushing. Both skied back to back on the same slope. These small changes would amount to a very noticeable difference on hill.
9 years ago
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DominatorJacques
Posts: 11247 - Karma: 76,550
onenerdykidNo doubt a well polished base looks better than a base that is simply scraped, but it will also be faster. And you will notice this in super super cold conditions and super super warm conditions. A non-scraped base will leave trace amounts of wax on the surface which ultimately slows the ski down. In these extreme cold and extreme warm conditions, it is imperative to have the base's structure clean because this will prevent ice crystals from digging in (during extreme cold temps) and it will prevent suction from occurring (during extreme warm temps). It will be in these extremes that it is most obvious.

Additionally, I would bet dollars to donuts that if you had a sintered base that had a temperature/condition appropriate base grind, matching wax treatment, proper scrape, and proper brushing that it would be tangibly & noticeably better compared to the same sintered base that had an all-condition base grind, universal wax treatment, proper scrape but improper brushing. Both skied back to back on the same slope. These small changes would amount to a very noticeable difference on hill.


Karma bump to you Kid! Very well said indeed!

I'm just trying to help the children! Kinda' like Woo Tang baby! Be good!
9 years ago
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DominatorJacques
Posts: 11247 - Karma: 76,550
skidemon22Solid Video! as another tech and someone who waxes skis daily, there is a lot of information in here.

Scraping and brushing is crucial, i don't know why anyone would argue. I suppose if you are not a racer, looking to eek out those milliseconds on the course, then you don't need to do a brass, nylon and then a horse hair brushing regiment. BUT after you do a solid scrape job, at the very least use a nylon brush. But doing a few passes with a brass brush will really cut down the time it takes to get that wax out of the structure.

What is your opinion on using a roto brush tool for a drill?


Funny, I did not see your question prior.
The vast majority of racing techs on the WC circuit and most fine tuners use hand brushing only.
If the ski is scraped well, then the brush work goes pretty fast. The ski gets faster for whatever grind or structure it has the more it is brushed and waxed. ie; For wet or for dry.
Roto's are used by those who need to service tons of skis at a time as a time saver.
If used improperly they can burnish or burn the base.
If not scraped well, then you get a ton of dust to breath as it goes all over the place.
Also then you need the drill, the brushes etc.
Purest believe that a hand brushes used correctly create a faster ski and I am from that camp.
A rotating round brush just is not doing what a sweet flat brush in good hands can do.
Also, although many may say for post waxing all you need is a nylon and horse hair, that's not true. Do not be afraid to use any steel, copper, brass, or bronze brushes after waxing. Like I said in the video, If the snow is wet, do not even use nylon or horse hair at all. Save those for dry snow. Polish for dry. Do not polish for wet.
It get's deep, but little thing make a big difference.
Little things like never waxing dirt and pollen back into the base. Always using some anti-static whit your waxes, or using one that has that built in.

Here, I will throw you another video on waxing for spring slush.
https://www.newschoolers.com/videos/watch/803770/Dominator-Butter--How-To-Apply--Budget-Overlay-For-Old-Wet-Snow--Ski-waxing


Here is another way.
https://www.newschoolers.com/videos/watch/803771/Waxing-Skis--Dominator-4x4-System--How-To-For-Old-Wet-Slushy-Snow
9 years ago
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DominatorJacques
Posts: 11247 - Karma: 76,550
Are you gliding faster now? Is your base extruded or sintered? Do you even know?
If it is sintered and looking white and abraded you may need to do this!

https://www.newschoolers.com/videos/watch/781970/How-To-Renew-A-Sintered-Base-Ski-and-Fix-Base-Burn
9 years ago
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DominatorJacques
Posts: 11247 - Karma: 76,550
RiceNo, I doubt it's people downvoting u haha. When comments in the thread get downvoted it also affects the rating of the thread.

Interesting that u use a metal scraper. I personally use a sharp plastic scraper, as u might damage the base. Is suppose metal is faster, to each it's own.


Going back to metal scrapers. The ones I use for wax removal are not 'sharp'.
Here is where you use a 'sharp' one!
https://www.newschoolers.com/videos/watch/781970/How-To-Renew-A-Sintered-Base-Ski-and-Fix-Base-Burn
9 years ago
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slamdunk
Posts: 186 - Karma: 857
Thanks for the video Jaques, I've been paying more attention the last few seasons to brushing and I think I can notice a difference. It could just be placebo but I'm certain my skis are gliding better, most noticeable on flats where I won't have to pole and glide past people who are slowing down and having to pole, very satisfying :) Will look into getting a couple more brushes.
9 years ago
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DominatorJacques
Posts: 11247 - Karma: 76,550
slamdunkThanks for the video Jaques, I've been paying more attention the last few seasons to brushing and I think I can notice a difference. It could just be placebo but I'm certain my skis are gliding better, most noticeable on flats where I won't have to pole and glide past people who are slowing down and having to pole, very satisfying :) Will look into getting a couple more brushes.


Truth. Remember that the base type and structure vs snow temps. and conditions have a lot to do with glide as well. That said always scrape and brush like crazy and they will run as best as possible for the givens.
9 years ago
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HAMNATION
Posts: 814 - Karma: 1,722
what do you think about gypsy shit for super slushy snow IE zardoz or rain ex or silicone spray applied before each run? I also have had some luck mixing molybdenum sulfide concentrate with warm wax.. I just wana go fast as a mofo on slush nam sayin what do you recommend??
9 years ago
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skidemon22
Posts: 4463 - Karma: 2,049
HAMNATIONwhat do you think about gypsy shit for super slushy snow IE zardoz or rain ex or silicone spray applied before each run? I also have had some luck mixing molybdenum sulfide concentrate with warm wax.. I just wana go fast as a mofo on slush nam sayin what do you recommend??


i can't really answer your question on the wax, but what sort or structure do you have/ when was the last time you had the skis structured?
9 years ago
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onenerdykid
Posts: 6744 - Karma: 11,760
HAMNATIONwhat do you think about gypsy shit for super slushy snow IE zardoz or rain ex or silicone spray applied before each run? I also have had some luck mixing molybdenum sulfide concentrate with warm wax.. I just wana go fast as a mofo on slush nam sayin what do you recommend??


skidemon22i can't really answer your question on the wax, but what sort or structure do you have/ when was the last time you had the skis structured?


Before launching into experimental alchemy, make sure you 1) have a sintered base and 2) have the proper base structure for warm conditions. Without either, or both of these, your alchemy project won't matter.

And honestly, if you used normal hydrocarbon or fluorinated warm temperature wax with the proper base pattern/structure and proper scraping & brushing, you will be gliding very well and not needing to do anything in between runs.
9 years ago
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skidemon22
Posts: 4463 - Karma: 2,049
onenerdykidBefore launching into experimental alchemy, make sure you 1) have a sintered base and 2) have the proper base structure for warm conditions. Without either, or both of these, your alchemy project won't matter.

And honestly, if you used normal hydrocarbon or fluorinated warm temperature wax with the proper base pattern/structure and proper scraping & brushing, you will be gliding very well and not needing to do anything in between runs.


This is some pretty good talk, if your skis aren't structured, the waxing you use is going to be much less effective
9 years ago
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HAMNATION
Posts: 814 - Karma: 1,722
skidemon22This is some pretty good talk, if your skis aren't structured, the waxing you use is going to be much less effective


yea i got a winterstiger wet snow base grind I was just asking about aditional things on top of that and yellow swix.. zardoz seems fast as shit on the wet and that makes since considering it is a liquid fluropolomer base lube. Iv had limited sucess with rain ex being fast as a motherfucker for a little while for things like a pond skim where that is all you need for success. Iv used dawn dish soap on the in run for a backcountry jump in july to make it faster as well.
9 years ago
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DominatorJacques
Posts: 11247 - Karma: 76,550
HAMNATIONwhat do you think about gypsy shit for super slushy snow IE zardoz or rain ex or silicone spray applied before each run? I also have had some luck mixing molybdenum sulfide concentrate with warm wax.. I just wana go fast as a mofo on slush nam sayin what do you recommend??


All the talk about structure and proper scraping and brushing is truth.

That said Zardoz Not Wax will run good in slush, but apply only over a well waxed base.
If not it will eventually clog up the base and then it will get slower.

Dominator Butter is sort of the same. Only apply over a well waxed ski. It won't last very long, but it won't clog up the base as much.

After using HF waxes or Butter etc. I like to use the Swix Glide Wax Cleaner.
I have used it for a long time now and I swear by it. I use it instead of hot scraping even if i used no fluoro waxes.

https://www.newschoolers.com/videos/watch/798668/How--and-Why-to-use-Swix-Glide-Wax-Cleaner
9 years ago
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DominatorJacques
Posts: 11247 - Karma: 76,550
Bump time, because this is important. I offer you years of experience in my tuning and waxing videos and it's all free!

Go to the top and go through the whole thread. Watch my videos in the entirety. If you skip any at all, you may miss some crucial information.

Be good all, Jacques AKA Dominator Jacques
8 years ago
1 0
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DominatorJacques
Posts: 11247 - Karma: 76,550
Huge bump because our time is near in the northern hemisphere!
DominatorJacquesDon't overlook good scraping & brushing when you need speed to do what you do!

Here's how I do it.

https://www.newschoolers.com/videos/watch/798663/Scraping--amp--Brushing-Skis-Final-Preparation-Of-Ski
7 years ago
2 0
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DominatorJacques
Posts: 11247 - Karma: 76,550
jackdonovanhow should i rail tune? i usually just use a file, diamond stone, and gummy stone, and try to round the edge out

It is important to do a "long" base bevel for rails. That's when you bevel at least to 1 degree until you get into the base plastic a bit.
Only round edges just before the binding if you cross your skis when jumping so you don't gouge the ski sidewalls and topsheet
(not shown in this video)

Do round edges AFTER the widest point tip and tail. That's in the video.


I cover that in this "Worlds Longest Ski Tuning Video" Claim! You gonna need to poke around right here!
Oh BTW you can speed up a YouTube video. I would say you can use 1.5 times here. Go faster and the audio gets too hard to understand.

https://www.newschoolers.com/videos/watch/849783/Ski-Tuning-How-To-By-Hand-Park-Special

**This post was edited on Oct 12th 2018 at 6:39:06pm

**This post was edited on Oct 12th 2018 at 6:42:18pm
7 years ago
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HypeBeast
Posts: 10050 - Karma: 76,058
This thread needs stickied.
7 years ago
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DominatorJacques
Posts: 11247 - Karma: 76,550
IsitWinterYet17This thread needs stickied.


Yes, just like to help the people understand what many don't.
If you want the GO, you need to KNOW!
7 years ago
1 0
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dietcoke.man
Posts: 250 - Karma: 1,395
Knewnewsor just take a run and let the snow do it


I did this with my race sticks a few times last season

Don't do this man

Just fucking scrape your skis
7 years ago
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DominatorJacques
Posts: 11247 - Karma: 76,550
shittyswrvskierI did this with my race sticks a few times last season

Don't do this man

Just fucking scrape your skis

Fact. If the wax comes off the easy, your wax job sucks. Make sure your bases are clean before you wax. That helps.
Then brush them too!
Excellent comment ^ in reference to NOT scraping above.

https://www.newschoolers.com/videos/watch/863154/Swix-Glide-Wax-Cleaner-Grease-Cleaning-Test

**This post was edited on Oct 17th 2018 at 3:01:33pm
7 years ago
2 0
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DominatorJacques
Posts: 11247 - Karma: 76,550
Scrape and brush like a demon! BUMP! Once you go, you never go back.

https://www.newschoolers.com/videos/watch/798663/Scraping--amp--Brushing-Skis-Final-Preparation-Of-Ski
7 years ago
1 0
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freestyler540
Posts: 13223 - Karma: 20,301
I cant see any of the videos. The internet at work restricts videos due to low bandwidth problems.

However, you dont need anything fancy to wax a pair of skis. The most expensive part is buying the 3 type of waxes.
Then I use a pain clothes iron, an old credit card (I invested in a stainless scraper) and a dish rag. As long as I wipe the ski in the same direction (up and down) without interruptions; skis work awesome.
7 years ago
1 0
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DominatorJacques
Posts: 11247 - Karma: 76,550
freestyler540I cant see any of the videos. The internet at work restricts videos due to low bandwidth problems.

However, you dont need anything fancy to wax a pair of skis. The most expensive part is buying the 3 type of waxes.
Then I use a pain clothes iron, an old credit card (I invested in a stainless scraper) and a dish rag. As long as I wipe the ski in the same direction (up and down) without interruptions; skis work awesome.

You need some ski brushes. After scraping you brush the snot out of them.
7 years ago
2 0
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DominatorJacques
Posts: 11247 - Karma: 76,550
It's that time of year again. I will give a bump here, because having the speed to do the deed separates the goats from the turtles. You don't want speed controlled skis. You want skis where you need to control the speed.
5 years ago
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