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Cork vs Bio vs Flat

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pgapro
Posts: 52 - Karma: 297
Trying to make a guide for all the tricks in the Park we try to really figure out the difference between cork, flat and bio. We have tried to make a model to see the differences without any grabs in there making it harder to analyze the movement. To compare we have put the model in a 540 version for all three of them. What we have figured out is as follows: (all for a left spinning person)

Flat: Spin, leaned back and leaned right
Cork: Spin, leaned back and leaned left
Bio: Spin: leaned forwardand leaned left

The third possible version seems not to be possible because leaning forward and right seems to cause a right rotation.

here are some pics of the models (most slightly off axis not extreme)

cork5
Click for larger image

flat5
Click for larger image

bio5
Click for larger image

In how far is the idea we have behind cork, flat and bio correct? Is our description correct?

For switch jumps we had the idea that it just has to be the other way round,

flat: Spin leaned forward and left
cork: Spin leaned forward and right
bio: Spin leaned backward and right

Can that be correct?

here is a picture of a switch cork 5 model tryout

switch cork5
Click for larger image

would be nice to get some feedback / ideas how we can make a good clear guide of what the differences are.
At the same time some advice for grabs fitting best together good with those spins would be great.

Thnx
Jun 6 2013 5:59AM
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Flyon
Posts: 295 - Karma: 331
These are really great, only thing would be to color it so you can easily tell which way he's facing.
Jun 6 2013 6:20AM
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pgapro
Posts: 52 - Karma: 297
fantastic idea to have the model colored, so we have put him a shirt on green on the back and orange on front en this is the result
Click for larger image

would be great to get some feedback if this seems to be correct,

thnx
Jun 6 2013 11:24AM
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Elg
Posts: 2998 - Karma: 3,880
you should make a bigger jump, and go more corked/flat/bio'd. i think that would make it easier to tell the difference.
Jun 6 2013 12:26PM
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rememberscott
Posts: 1291 - Karma: 5,199
this proves that newbs do know something! great thread man this settles alot of the questions in my head... can you do a misty/rodeo diagram as well? +k
Jun 6 2013 12:27PM
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sNaubi
Posts: 1633 - Karma: 2,357
I approve of this thread, it NEEDS to be a sticky.
Jun 6 2013 12:45PM
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pgapro
Posts: 52 - Karma: 297
I can do a misty rodeo later today, ill post it when it is ready
Jun 6 2013 12:47PM
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p-fo
Posts: 9372 - Karma: 6,155
This is actually really sick. Is there any way to put a face on the guy? Or a baseball hat or something? It's still hard for me to tell which way he's facing even after the coloration. And I found the layout to be a bit confusing on that first picture.
Anyway, keep it up! This is awesome! It's way better to show than tell with these things.
Jun 6 2013 2:14PM
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JWoods
Posts: 2369 - Karma: 2,635
This is a really good idea
Jun 6 2013 2:29PM
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DizzyG
Posts: 698 - Karma: 296
Not sure if i'm just reading this wrong but you can do right side and left side flats and corks. This makes it sound like all flats are spun right side and all corks are left side, which is wrong. Flats and corks are different spins.

I've noticed that the game youriding freeski 2 is really good for naming tricks, it's really obvious what a flatspin is when you do one in the game, although i'm not sure if they got the flat 7 vs dub flat right.
Jun 6 2013 2:30PM
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Cleapster
Posts: 622 - Karma: 1,402
This should be stickyed I stamp my approval.
Jun 6 2013 2:43PM
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Rozbrook
Posts: 586 - Karma: 236
He specified that all of these tricks are leftside, so for a flat you're rotating left but leaning right and back.
Jun 6 2013 2:45PM
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At0micski
Posts: 256 - Karma: 169
very nice. i cant wait to see rodeo and misty. this helps a lot.
Jun 6 2013 4:00PM
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JWoods
Posts: 2369 - Karma: 2,635
Whaaattt you can do flatspins? I've never even tried haha
Jun 6 2013 4:32PM
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BChaps1209
Posts: 1350 - Karma: 2,441
your flat 5 looks like a rodeo 5... very interesting though
Jun 6 2013 5:05PM
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pgapro
Posts: 52 - Karma: 297
now this is the first tryout rodeo model, I attached a baseball cap to it, have to make some new with a cap for the other jumps as well, thinking about to make it possible as well to show trick without grab and make at the same time models which grab the ski so it is possible to see how the movement changes or looks different bij adding a grab

Click for larger image

is de rodeo correct?
Jun 6 2013 5:24PM
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I_Am_Mod
Posts: 13214 - Karma: 3,753
threads
Jun 6 2013 5:31PM
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TristonHall
Posts: 194 - Karma: 564
Rodeo seems to be on point, I really want to see misty.
Jun 6 2013 5:32PM
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MattyCraw
Posts: 74 - Karma: 254
if you dont know. you suck. figure it out

Jun 6 2013 5:33PM
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I_Am_Mod
Posts: 13214 - Karma: 3,753
yeah, nice constructive response you got there, i bet you knew the difference between these 3 before you ever even touched a ski, where can i line up to get your autograph ?
Jun 6 2013 5:47PM
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pgapro
Posts: 52 - Karma: 297
this has to be the misty if I am correct

Click for larger image
Jun 6 2013 5:48PM
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pgapro
Posts: 52 - Karma: 297
think something looks strange in there, have to check misty again :(
Jun 6 2013 5:51PM
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I_Am_Mod
Posts: 13214 - Karma: 3,753
^^yeah, looks very close tough...
Cork, bio and flat looked good!
Jun 6 2013 5:58PM
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pgapro
Posts: 52 - Karma: 297
now this has to be the correct one now

Click for larger image
Jun 6 2013 6:06PM
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pgapro
Posts: 52 - Karma: 297
So thats it for today, try to add switch misty and rodeo tomorrow and make a complete overview of al 10 variations
Jun 6 2013 6:31PM
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hail.vivid
Posts: 51 - Karma: 83
Threads this is awesome!!
Jun 6 2013 11:27PM
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Toaster-Tony
Posts: 3531 - Karma: 5,850
Awesome thread, nice work.


I guarantee there will still be reposts on it though..
Jun 6 2013 11:34PM
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rememberscott
Posts: 1291 - Karma: 5,199
keep it up man this is legit. How bout you up to it flat7, misty 7, bio 7 etc...
Jun 6 2013 11:34PM
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MACK.
Posts: 1230 - Karma: 1,892
THREADS this is sick!!!!!
Jun 7 2013 12:33AM
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pgapro
Posts: 52 - Karma: 297
first try out with a grab, so this is flat 5 mute

Click for larger image

so the plan is to make the model for the following tricks

cork 3, 5, 7 & switch cork 5
flat 3, 5, 7 & switch flat 5
bio 5 & switch bio 5

rodeo 5,7 & switch rodeo 5
misty 5,7 & switch misty 5

without grabs and with 2-4 standard grabs to compare

any tips for the best grabs to fit the different tricks?

(japan fits flat nice, double safety with cork 3 for example)


Jun 7 2013 3:25AM
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p-fo
Posts: 9372 - Karma: 6,155
Fifth model in the sequence should be facing the other way. Fix that and you got it.
And for the rodeo model you posted earlier, it's not quite right either. It should be the flatspin but feet go fully above the head. It's a fuzzy line, and most people don't make the distinction any more. The start is good, but the 4th model should be directly bases pointed at the "camera", then the next ones coming around from that to switch.
Thing with these rotations is that there is a lot of variation in how they're actually thrown. But the flat 5 mute is perfect as far as I'm concerned. That is the rotation I want in my rode/flat 5s. So ill.
Jun 7 2013 3:55AM
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pgapro
Posts: 52 - Karma: 297
thnx a lot for the feedback, going to try to change the models to get the correct rodeo/misty and post them again later
Jun 7 2013 4:09AM
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pgapro
Posts: 52 - Karma: 297
thnx a lot for the feedback, going to try to change the models to get the correct rodeo/misty and post them again later
Jun 7 2013 4:09AM
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MLJ
Posts: 1849 - Karma: 3,649
Dude this is sick +K

BTW what program did you use for this?
Jun 7 2013 5:58AM
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pgapro
Posts: 52 - Karma: 297
I use sketch up to make those models, the actual version is 8, it is actually a free program because the functions in the pro version you don't need for this work here
Jun 7 2013 7:35AM
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pgapro
Posts: 52 - Karma: 297
this should be cork 7 now ungrabbed, made the kicker bigger so there is a little bit more space between the sequences, got the model carving a little bit on the kicker

Click for larger image
Jun 7 2013 7:52AM
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pgapro
Posts: 52 - Karma: 297
this is the mute grab version cork 7

Click for larger image
Jun 7 2013 8:17AM
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-Robert
Posts: 2000 - Karma: 1,492
Awesome thread. This will help alot.
Jun 7 2013 9:54AM
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1337
Posts: 31039 - Karma: 29,013
Wow this is awesome! Great guide, you should get all the photos for all the tricks you listed together in a clean thread when you get them all down!
Jun 7 2013 10:10AM
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pgapro
Posts: 52 - Karma: 297
great idea,when I have those all done and checked I am going to put all those in one clean thread.

what is quite interesting is how much the trick looks different when using a tail grab, the grab posture isn't the best one, just did it quickly to see how it looks changing from mute to a tail position

cork 7 tail

Click for larger image
Jun 7 2013 10:16AM
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TristonHall
Posts: 194 - Karma: 564
Perfection, this is going to be super helpful
Jun 7 2013 10:37AM
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DBowden
Posts: 169 - Karma: 241
This in a cleaner thread when your done would be a dope sticky. Also this could be added to the guide in the trampoline cult along with the descriptions. either way, threads and nice work
Jun 7 2013 11:28AM
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Stickity
Posts: 7750 - Karma: 769
make gifs
Jun 7 2013 11:39AM
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pgapro
Posts: 52 - Karma: 297
we wanne add some more grabs, but want to make sure what grabs there are and what are the correct names, therefore we made a second thread with grabs


when we get this done as well we can make a new clean thread with an overview of the most important jump tricks off axis, grabs and so on

so if for grabs there are suggestions feel free to add them to the grab thread

ill get some new spins finished for this one here today in the evening for sure
Jun 7 2013 11:44AM
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pgapro
Posts: 52 - Karma: 297
making animated gif's would be a good idea, but the problem is that we wanne make a printable pdf version of the guide as well and I think it is more easy to see the difference in stills
Jun 7 2013 11:47AM
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redking
Posts: 148 - Karma: 437
Is it just me or is this very similar to an underflip, could you do a diagram for an underflip please?
Jun 7 2013 11:52AM
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pgapro
Posts: 52 - Karma: 297
Would love to do that, but to be perfectly honest can't find the definition of underflip in the forum, but if you give me a short description ill make a model for sure (might be one of the tricks i am still hardly missing in the guide)
Jun 7 2013 11:57AM
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redking
Posts: 148 - Karma: 437
its kinda like: turn 90 degrees
                     then lincoln (sideflip)
                     then another 90 rotation to finish it off

Jun 7 2013 12:00PM
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redking
Posts: 148 - Karma: 437
Here's a great example
Jun 7 2013 12:03PM
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pgapro
Posts: 52 - Karma: 297
Okay, ill try that out
Jun 7 2013 12:03PM
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Turkelton
Posts: 2829 - Karma: 8,558
I would like to see this exact style cork sev in real life, it looks styley
Jun 7 2013 12:11PM
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