Welcome to the Newschoolers forums! You may read the forums as a guest, however you must be a registered member to post.
Register to become a member today!
WARRANTY !!! Here is what you should expect...
I have noticed quite a few threads this season complaining about companies warranty policies (mostly on skis). I have been blown away by the expectations of a lot of NS members as to what they think they deserve or what a warranty should be. So here are a few industry standards as well as guidelines on how to ensure you get your skis replaced in the event that you do deserve a warranty!
1. DON'T SLIDE RAILS! I don't know of a single ski/snowboard brand that will warranty for rail damage.
However if you have cracked edges and your tip delam's don't mention the edge issues.... some companies will overlook rail damage to take care of an issue that is not impact related!
2. KEEP YOUR RECEIPT. If you cannot prove you paid for it and that you are the original owner then the company has no liability to replace your equipment!
SIDENOTE: if you are receiving some type of discount or Pro-Form from the company you generally do not receive any type of warranty with your purchase.
3. IMPACT RELATED DAMAGE again most companies will not warranty for impact related damage. generally that means when your ski comes in contact with anything other that snow and something is damaged.. Core shots, edge crack/dents , delams, sidewall blowouts, binding rip outs, ETC...
BUT could also apply to any type of more than "average" abuse to a ski.. (big cliffs + hard landings or over/underotating causing you to land tip/tail heavy.
4. TOPSHEET CHIPPING is not the same as a topsheet delam and is an impact related damage generally caused by your sharp metal edge coming in contact with your soft plastic topsheet.. keep your skis apart!
5. TALKING WITH THE WARRANTY DEPARTMENT if you approach someone pissed off guns blazing making demands your going to put the person on the other side of the line on defense right off the bat!
Be calm, cool, and explain the situation and ask what they can do to help you out.. Be prepared to send pictures of the damage and most likely be ready to ship your skis back for evaluation. ( you will be responsible for the shipping costs)
ALSO this process with many companies can take several weeks so be patient!
Rather you think it is fair or not these are VERY common demands that a company will make in order to replace your product!
6. BUYING GEAR ONLINE FROM A DIFFERENT COUNTRY
If you live in (for example) Canada and you buy your gear from a website or shop in another country, do not expect the gear to be covered. Sure the warranty policies will cover the same damage but that sweet deal you got did not support the division/distributor/retailer of the company in any way so don't be surprised when they say "no dice".
Hahaha this should be stickied.
7. GO TO THE SHOP YOU PURCHASED FROM FIRST: Most companies don't like to deal with the customer directly, they'd rather deal with the shops, it's mostly a numbers game, they sell hundreds of skis all over the world (assuming a large company), it's easier to deal with the shops than the consumer. Also, by going to a shop first you'll get a better idea of what to expect for your warranty and more personal service. This also means, buying from a local shop is more helpful than online in the long run, as well as buying from a smaller "legit" shop would be more helpful, and if you shop their often, then may even be able to help you out more.
and he should be given a gold star lol
All this is true, one thing, sparknotes.
are you that fucking autistic?
apparently. dont be lazy, just read it. in fact all of it is common sense that a lot of the members on this site lack.
anyways, this should be sticked. good post.
This is a good list. Point #5 is really worth paying attention to. I work in a shop and help people with warranty issues through out the season. My interest is in helping you get your problem fixed as quickly as possible. If you come in pissed off and blaming everyone in the world but yourself, you can fuck right off. Your equipment will be denied warranty coverage.
Also go to the retailer you bought the equipment from. We have experience interacting with companies, and can use this to help insure a successful claim. We can also tell you when it is a lost cause, so you don't lose any more money and time on the claim. Most local stores will work to help their customers out in these cases.
Well put... Glad this made it up! STICKIE!!!!!
Sticky this. Too many kids thing they can warranty anything and everything and then when the company says no, the get pissed and make a thread in GT about how they hate that company.
Alright sticked! good list bro
Yeah, I messaged MacMahoooon and asked to get this stickied.
THANK YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! this will elliminate all those stupid "can this be warrantied" and "why wouldnt they warranty my skis?" threads!!!
If your sending in skis for problems other than edge cracks, acknowledge that the edge cracks aren't what you are sending them in for. I messages surface because my notimes got hella rockered, included pictures, and stated that I knew that the edge ripout was my fault and they said that since I wasn't an idiot and realized that rails fuck up edges they sent me new skis. Not saying that this works in every situation, but it worked out for me pretty well :)
here is something i truly do not understand and i have posted this before.
if a company makes a park ski, it is going to be used in the park. its not going to casually glide down groomers and rip through waste deep pow. it is going to hit rails, jumps, wood whatever else you can throw in a park. why is that when a PARK ski breaks because of edge damage to a rail, they wont warranty it? the skis main purpose is to get the rider through the park as smoothly as possible no matter how hard the skier rides. and if a ski that your company produced doesnt do that, then you have put out a sub par product and should warranty the ski becuase your ski wasnt able to handle what it was designed for. i havent heard of a single company who has ever done this. and i dont get why the skier is at fault for taking his park ski into the park and sliding a rail. buying a ski is an investment for 2-3 years depending upon the rider. and when you have to go through warranty issue, it can eat up a good 3 weeks of skiing. those are precious fucking days lost of skiing.
IMO to me its all bullshit, if my park ski breaks becuase i was in the park i just dont see how that is my fault that your sub par product broke after a few runs.
No ski can take being beaten with a metal bar. Do you expect one to?
Rails are fucking gay anyway.
after time no, but not within the first month of riding.
like i said the system is all bullshit anyway. its pretty easy to lie to a company and say you ripped the edge out not sliding a rail. seen it done many times.
Well it depends how much you hit them. Give me a brand new pair of skis, and with enough metal on metal blunt force I can have those edges nice and fucked up in a day.
believe me, companies can tell.
you may tell them you werent' sliding a rail but it's pretty obvious that you hit something regardless of what it was.
if companies wanted to make a ski that would unconditionally hold up in the park they would make it without an edge all together. thin steel edge vs. thick steel rail = rail wins everytime!
manufacturers do their best to create a product that will stand up to the abuse that park skiing puts on it but at the end of the day, if you smoke your sidewall off a rail, it's your fault. i happen to personally know that ski companies warranty more twin tips than anything and give the skier the benefit of the doubt for the most part.
I see your point completely! However you can only design a ski for park so much.. There is no better construction method, you cant get a stronger edge material than what most companies use, you cannot replace the wood, plastic, and fiberglass with some magical bombproof material! As shitty as it is unfortunately that's the way it is.
Would you prefer that no company build/market "Park skis"? because nobody can possibly build a ski that will undoubtedly hold up to the abuse of the average season pass holding park skier!
And for every person that says I have ridden (insert brand here) and never had an issue.. there are many people that have had an issue!
And vice versa every person that says I rode ( insert brand here) and destroyed them in a certain low number of days there are many others that have ridden them without problems!
Everyone skis differently and are harder on equipment in certain ways.. A solid smooth rail skier will take much longer to crack edges than someone doing the same tricks but weighting their edges unevenly.
yeah i understand that there truly is no indestructable ski out there and after time a ski will eventually experience enough wear and tear where the edges will rip out or delam.
it is really hard to get the point across that im trying to make becuase there is no perfect science to it. the company has no idea how many days you have ridden on your skis or how hard you ride so its almost impossible to judge how long the ski is actually going to last. but if a ski breaks your 3rd time riding preseason boxes/rails, i dont see that being your fault if there is another pair of skis out there that gets you through the enitre season with minor topsheet damage.
im not saying that it is all of the manufacturers fault, as the rider is at fault too if they dont pick the ski that best suits their needs/want. but i just think that there should be a more fair way to warranty to park ski and that if you hit a rail then a warranty is out of the question. i know that it most likely wont happen but i would truly love to see it because i see it pop up so much in GT.
It is a shitty situation for both parties... The last thing a ski company (especially the smaller independant brands) want to do is have to tell a valued customer no and leave them with a sour taste for the brand! But the expense of warrantying every ski with rail damage would be absurd...
And just as you said there is no exact science to know who is deserving and who is not, For the exact reason of people altering the truth of their story to try and get what they want/ think they deserve!
Why don't you just stop hitting rails? I have not had a single edge problem since I realized that skiing is not about sliding down a rail that is perpendicular to my skis.
well i mean i ski park in new york...that is like telling me to just quit skiing.
Why does it matter to you what he enjoys while skiing?
#69: DONT BE RETARDED AND EXPECT COMPANIES TO BOW TO YOUR HOLY BEING BECAUSE YOU SNAPPED YOUR SKI IN HALF. THEY ARE NOT JUST GOING TO GIVE YOU NEW SHIT RIGHT AWAY. THATS NOT HOW IT WORKS.
That's like asking a skateboard company to warranty snapped decks.
The skateboard manufacturer designs the decks to be as beneficial as possible to people riding them, but there are physical limitations to what it can do, and as far as warranties go, it is assumed that any rider inflicted damage is not covered.
If your ski falls apart for absolutely no reason while skiing down a groomer, thats a defect, but if you put metal to metal, or you exert extreme sudden forces on your skis that they cannot handle, that is your fault, not the manufacturers. They design the skis to be as rugged as possible and aid you in skiing park, but it is your responsibility if you push the ski past it's limits.
i know and the point i made still really isnt clear but what i was just trying to say was that if a ski breaks early, like preseason early, then there has to be a quality issue somewhere along the lines. but like i said before, no exact science to judge who is at fault.
i guess this is the only example i can give. my friend and i ride for three days. i ride 10/11 armada thalls, he rides 10/11 salomon suspects. after 3 days of riding the same features, same tricks, same level of skiing my thalls are good to go and he has an inch of edge missing.
idk if that made any difference in how you saw my opinion but that is just how i see it. i just think that there should be a better way to determine who is at fault, even though like i previously stated before that will proabably never happen.
what don't you get?
there are no set standards to building skis. this is what makes every manufacturer unique. different designs will have different outcomes.
also, there are a ton of variables that come into play. different impact angles, weight of skier, etc...
at the end of the day, you hit rails, jumps, etc... expect your shit to break eventually; could be tomorrow, could be in two years. deal with it and hope that a the company will help you out. if they don't, pick a sport with less stress on the equipment.
if you ski park hard and a lot expect to go through skis. its part of the sport. theres nothing wrong with sliding rails and its really fun, despite what some other posters are saying, just expect it to thrash your skis.
the biggest tip i can give you is to not buy the brand new model of skis because they are going to be expensive and will break just as fast as a ski from two years ago. park skis are all essentially the same. the 11/12 $600 ski will stomp the same tricks as the $200 08/09 ski. skiing park doesnt require the top of the line equipment. save your money for a good pow ski or something where it really helps to have the top of the line stuff.
just my opinion from trying a bunch of different skis and weighing enough to go through 3-4 pairs a season.
i was about to buy skis but now i know, thanks
for sure dude, don't buy skis now.
snowboards have much better warranties.
i hear surface has great warrantees.
The simple fact is that if park skis were built to withstand the abuse from rails and jumps for forever no one would want to ski them. They would have to be much thicker with many times thicker edges and bases and would then be muuuuuch stiffer, but everyone wants a super lightweight ski that is buttery. There just aren't any materials out there that can do that since it is physically impossible to create a ski that will not take damage from slamming into something repeatedly with 200+ lbs of force.
I wouldn't ram my car into another car and try to warranty my bumper because it is made for "bumping into things."
a car isnt made for bumping into things...
I am not sure of the OPs statement about pro-form purchases not falling under warranty. I have always seen "non-returnable" on pro-forms, but never "no warranty". and yes, they are different.
Can anyone else back this up? I feel like getting pro-form with no warranty is worse.
Neither are skis. They are made to slide on snow.
no one ever has the idea of buying a park ski and saying to themselves "boy im never ever gonna hit a rail with these skis"
The thing is though that all products will wear. Metal will wear out other metal depending on how much force and the frequency of impacts on it. If metal didn't wear out we would never have to do maintenance on cars, etc. I am just confused as to how you feel that taking a ski and slamming it onto a rail repeatedly should be warrantied. Yes, I understand that in certain circumstances one ski will blow up before another brand or ski would but that is the risk you take when skiing park and subjected your skis to the abuse a park ski will take.
I know I keep going back to car analogies, but they seem to be the easiest for me to relate to. Just because a Jeep Rubicon is meant to drive offroad doesn't mean that if you drive it mudding for a weekend there is 0 chance of you breaking an axle or a drive component or something. Shit happens when you use products and they can be destroyed just with their normal use even, but that doesn't mean that it was a manufacturing defect.
Sure if the topsheet was physically put on incorrectly or if you are just cruising around and a ski starts to delam yeah that is a warranty, but they can't warranty every ski that gets damaged, so the line starts when you physically make a choice or do something to your ski that has the potential to damage it.
yeah but you ski at stevens where you have other things to do besides lap the park. i ski on that east coast hardcore stuff. if i were to not hit rails/boxes i would be hitting a total of maybe 6 jumps all year.
7. - If you have to mount bindings on your skis get them to a shop. Any damage to the binding or the ski can only be warranted if it is done by a certified technician at a certified shop.
wrong again! I ski at Big Sky. I have seven pairs of skis. I teach on park skis because they are soft, almost center mounted, and have enough sidecut to functionally demo skiing skills at various speeds, and in different terrain.
That being said, I have another pair of park skis that are only used for park. I slide rails, hit jumps, etc. I also lend them out to friends so they get pretty thrashed. But since I was planning on using them in the park, I bought K2 silencers for 80 bucks, and beveled the underfoot edge, and I keep them waxed, and I take care of things before they get worse. If they do ever break, I won't care.
Sparknotes? Don't spend 400+ dollars on a park ski if you plan on destroying it...
Regular maintenance is pretty key when it comes to park ski longevity.
Skiing is however you define it. Many people would argue skiing isn't about floating above powder, or dropping cliffs; It's about carving hard on groomers.
Very true, but people need to know that if their definition of skiing involves rails then their definition of skiing does not come with a warranty.
All times are Eastern (-4)