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CoreUPT and Dynastar

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hardboiled
Posts: 7 - Karma: 10

The candide pros:
park:116/81/106
pow:124/92/114

 

Dynastar trouble maker:
116-81-106

dynastar big trouble:
124/92/114

Jun 11 2008 8:24PM
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skifiend
Posts: 2063 - Karma: 13
So is coreupt made in a dynastar factory?  If they are, and the skis are basically the same...that's weak sauce.
Jun 11 2008 8:28PM
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SirFryanator
Posts: 11149 - Karma: 1,415
I severely doubt they're the same flex and same sidecut pattern...
Jun 11 2008 8:29PM
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Caveman.
Posts: 9067 - Karma: 330
interesting. rossi owns dynastar and doesnt rossi own coreUPT as well?
Jun 11 2008 8:30PM
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cobra_commander
Posts: 16909 - Karma: 4,682
those dims are way to simmilar. 
If they are the same length then they will be the same sidecut.
and we have seen stuff like this before with roxy just using rossi and dynastar skies w/ different graphics.
Jun 11 2008 8:32PM
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hardboiled
Posts: 7 - Karma: 10

Sidecut pattern = dimension

Quicksilver = the company that own both Rossignol and Dynastar

Does it really matter anyway.

Jun 11 2008 8:33PM
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SirFryanator
Posts: 11149 - Karma: 1,415
Well then that's kind of retarded. If he's going to rep a company might as well not be fake abouti t.
Jun 11 2008 8:34PM
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SirFryanator
Posts: 11149 - Karma: 1,415
No the sidecut pattern can be different if it's the same length. Longer tail or longer front can make it a totally different ski.
But yeah they are WAY too similar.
Jun 11 2008 8:36PM
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phishfood
Posts: 2542 - Karma: 298
hah
Jun 11 2008 8:39PM
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jca
Posts: 4162 - Karma: 6,261
yeah you can have different radiuses throughout the ski (seths, msps)

i wouldn't be surprised if these were just dynastars
Jun 11 2008 8:39PM
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Caveman.
Posts: 9067 - Karma: 330
Does anyone know prices? It would be interesting to compare the prices of these 4 (or 2) skis..
Jun 11 2008 8:39PM
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DangerToes
Posts: 1042 - Karma: 33
Well Quicksilver owns Candide and Dynastar (they sold Rossignol, why Candide had to find a new ski sponsor) so it makes sense, sell the same skis and market them differently
Jun 11 2008 8:55PM
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dom_uk
Posts: 1560 - Karma: 12
I was about to point out the irony of the word "core" in the brand name. Then it suddenly struck me that this fact had been staring us in the face all along. its a corrUPT core company. I certainly hope that this is just a coincidence, if not, its pretty lame. Deception and clever marketing are to different things as far as im concerned.

Jun 11 2008 9:00PM
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TWoods
Posts: 10014 - Karma: 8,385
but if you use certain set tip/mid/tail dimensions then you have already decided where the skinniest part of the ski will be based on the math. if you use those dimensions and make a different middle of the ski, then you would have some sort of wierd curve that wouldn't be a circle, and either the tip or tail would have more curve than the other. that's not a good idea.
Jun 11 2008 9:07PM
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Literature
Posts: 13673 - Karma: 3,086
Like I've said since this coreUPT nonsense started:

It's just an attempt to try and change their image with us, the consumer. And this is further proof of the stupidity of the whole thing. I actually actively dislike them now, whereas before I didn't have an opinion.
Jun 11 2008 9:12PM
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papasteeze
Posts: 12055 - Karma: 911
You are assuming that all skis have a true radius sidecut from the widest point on the tip to the widest point on the tail.   they often do not!
Jun 11 2008 9:15PM
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alaskakid
Posts: 5540 - Karma: 430
Nice "pro" models candide, I wonder if he changed the flex at least. Really weak though
Jun 11 2008 9:16PM
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Tinga
Posts: 11349 - Karma: 2,333
doesnt quicksilver own them all? yes the answer is yes. we've been over this a few times.
Jun 11 2008 9:19PM
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Literature
Posts: 13673 - Karma: 3,086
So really,


CANDIDE IS BACK ON DYNASTAR!
Jun 11 2008 9:24PM
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Craigskis
Posts: 6648 - Karma: 1,636
Haha, I like how an alias was used to expose this.
Jun 11 2008 9:27PM
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papasteeze
Posts: 12055 - Karma: 911
using the same mold with different laminations would be smart to keep costs down, using the same mold with the same materials just a different top sheet would be stupid.  I don't think ski manufacturers are stupid.


Jun 11 2008 9:38PM
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iggyskier
Posts: 10434 - Karma: 9,753
based upon some trouble makers I have seen cut open, the lamination they use already is incredibly basic.  I was actually surprised to see what was in there.  Can't imagine they would make it that much cheaper.
Jun 11 2008 9:40PM
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StanMcStanson
Posts: 2772 - Karma: 1
Yeah, I love Candide's style, but I hate how he's bitched out on like 5 companies in a row.
Jun 11 2008 10:03PM
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cobra_commander
Posts: 16909 - Karma: 4,682
the variable amount of fiberglass is pretty dope though.
Jun 11 2008 10:04PM
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Shadows
Posts: 8068 - Karma: 42
didnt know a company could own a human being.
Jun 11 2008 10:24PM
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emokiller
Posts: 191 - Karma: 10
once you have the ski dimensions the sidecut is set, there is no hub bub about it, you cant change the math , its set, stiff or soft whatever, the only thing that will alter the radius is length. If the length is the same then they are:
renting molds
bought old molds
made by Dyna etc
whether he owns the molds or not, looks like the same ski to me, sure put a different core in it but overall characteristics are the same.
Jun 12 2008 1:32AM
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i.ski.troll.
Posts: 4692 - Karma: 245
thats funny
i could never ride dynastar/rossi/coreUPT skis
Jun 12 2008 1:36AM
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bobs
Posts: 4801 - Karma: 869
There's alot of unanswered questions surrounding coreUPT
Jun 12 2008 1:38AM
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Gharf
Posts: 1390 - Karma: 983

for those who can speak french, here are some answers.

http://www.skipass.com/articles/saison-07-08/26045-goon-vs-skipass.php

if many people ask and i have the time i ll try to translate.

Correupt is not in anyway owned by dynastar, they just make skis in their factory.

they dont have their own pattern now but they will next year.

stop bitching because the guy who created the brand is a skier (guerlain chicherit), and realy believes in what he does.

just wait and see.

Jun 12 2008 3:10AM
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Literature
Posts: 13673 - Karma: 3,086
Not quite.

As previously mentioned, the center of the sidecut will make a difference. For example, the sidecut on my  Addicts is centered around a mounting point that is true center. However, it could have been shifted back a bit, and the dimensions could be kept the same. Thus the waist would be further back, and the tail would have a quicker radius than the tip. Where the center of the sidecut is matters, not just the dimensions.
Jun 12 2008 3:33AM
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dom_uk
Posts: 1560 - Karma: 12
Ah this is good to hear! if you could translate later for us uneducated folks that would be great! thanks for the heads up
Jun 12 2008 6:17AM
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Gharf
Posts: 1390 - Karma: 983

got a lot of work now, but i ll realy try later

Jun 12 2008 7:11AM
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dom_uk
Posts: 1560 - Karma: 12
ye no worries mate! especially if you've got other stuff to do. to be honest i probably shouldn't be on this bloody thing either, iv got 2 more exams on monday and have hardly started revising for them!this is what newschoolers does to people.
Jun 12 2008 7:23AM
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Oli_jgb
Posts: 985 - Karma: 95
Look at the black crow skis - their "Shape" makes a big difference. Dimensions measure the widest point of the tip, the widest point of the tail, and the narrowest point/centre as far as i am aware. So the shape doesn't come into it. see how they continue to be wide and then suddenly get thinner. Unusual but cool. Their dimensions could still be the same as any other ski that doesn't have this shape. I think i have made my point?!!!!

Black crows
Jun 12 2008 7:27AM
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Oli_jgb
Posts: 985 - Karma: 95
Sorry, just to show my point a bit more, the black crows dimensions are 120-86-108 mm

Which is the same as the ŒDillinger by faction. See how this ski has a different shape!Faction dillinger
Tadaaaa
Jun 12 2008 7:34AM
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Craigskis
Posts: 6648 - Karma: 1,636
I didn't know Guerlain Chicherit was behind the project. He had his own Dynastar pro model a few years back they were like $1200 on sale. I happened to love the trouble makers design and have been riding them since 2004 but am now badly in need of a new pair.
Jun 12 2008 9:47AM
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Craigskis
Posts: 6648 - Karma: 1,636
^ I think they only made 800 pair of that pro-model they looked sick
Jun 12 2008 9:50AM
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bobs
Posts: 4801 - Karma: 869
yes please translate! my highschool french barely helps.

I think  he was explaining the molds and relationship with dynastar and that this year will be similar and in the future they're gonna branch out and do they're own thing?  But i barely understand french and it'd be dope if you sparknoted those for us
Jun 12 2008 10:01AM
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Palardy
Posts: 176 - Karma: 11
They said that their skis are being made in the dynastar factory and that this year they are using the dynastar molds to make the skis so they are not really something new or innovative and they admitted that, but they said that they changed the flex and composition of the skis and that each pro modified their own pro model to what they personally wanted and that is what their company is all about. All their skis are pro model skis made by the pros.

They said that by next year they hope to be making some prototypes and getting some new molds to branch out from the dynastar ones and then they will start having different skis, but for now they are a new company and they are relying on dynastars existing molds to help get them started.
Jun 12 2008 12:14PM
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emokiller
Posts: 191 - Karma: 10
"As previously mentioned, the center of the sidecut will make a difference. For example, the sidecut on my Addicts is centered around a mounting point that is true center. However, it could have been shifted back a bit, and the dimensions could be kept the same. Thus the waist would be further back, and the tail would have a quicker radius than the tip. Where the center of the sidecut is matters, not just the dimensions. "
WRONG!
your Addicts have the same sidecut, moving your binding just changes the way the ski feel and performs underfoot, but the sidecut stays the same, once a ski is pressed and the dimensions are set the sidecut DOES NOtˇ change get it.
Because you say you can alter your sidecut by moving your binding back and forth tells me you have no clue what you are talking about, the sidecut is the same no matter where your binding is, jeez.
Jun 12 2008 12:29PM
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papasteeze
Posts: 12055 - Karma: 911
Why are you assuming that all skis have a true radius side cut?
Jun 12 2008 12:54PM
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Literature
Posts: 13673 - Karma: 3,086
Please read carefully. I said that the "the sidecut on my  Addicts is centered around a mounting point."

When skis are build, and shapes are designed, the Recommended mounting point is used when making the sidecut, as the narrowest point, the waist, is where the midsole mark on the should be put.

I never suggested moving my bindings. I suggested changing the whole sidecut during design. Please read before you decide to call people out, because, believe it or not, they may know a tad more about building skis than you might.  Thank you.
Jun 12 2008 1:24PM
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bobs
Posts: 4801 - Karma: 869
ummmmm...... he wasn't suggesting to move the bindings, i think you might have misread what he was saying. 

He was pointing out like you mentioned addicts have their turn radius positioned around the center while  others have their turn radius centered somewhere around -8cm.  All he was saying is that in the design phase by moving the center of radius (which effects suggested mount point)  forward or back you can have two skis with similar dimensions but completely different shapes
Jun 12 2008 4:13PM
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quebecfreestyler
Posts: 13040 - Karma: 1,418

It's logical for any worker to try finding the best contract to make sure he makes enought money for the rest of their life.

I wouldnt blame Candide.


I think most pro models in skiing dosnt makes senses anyway but I'd have to say that this is the weirdest case of a pro model I,ve seen in a while.

Jun 12 2008 4:15PM
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Lemuel
Posts: 14477 - Karma: 10,515
kid u r dumb as fuck. moving the narrowest part of the ski forward or back does not mean moving the binding or the sidecut being changed based on binding placement. a ski will ski very differently if the narrowest part is moved, especially on a symmetrical ski. please read before u try to make yourself look like tough shit
Jun 12 2008 4:53PM
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Rosbif
Posts: 2543 - Karma: 930
I can't understand the videos very well, but I don't think Chcherit started the brand, he's just on the team. In his words (his blog) 'without being the Chef of the cooking, I play the game in the receipe'.

I have no inside info, but I do think it's a little suspect that a new ski brand signs two of the biggest names in French skiing, from Dynastar and Rossignol respectively, then builds rebadged skis in the Dynastar factory and claims not to be related to the Quiksilver group!?
Jun 12 2008 5:16PM
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tandan83
Posts: 2783 - Karma: 141
exactly.  how about the invaders, anthems or seths (from a few years ago).  they all have variable sidecuts.... aka a sharper turn radius at the tip and tail and more mellow under foot.
Jun 12 2008 5:48PM
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emokiller
Posts: 191 - Karma: 10
!!skis can have a similar dimensions but not exact,exact dimensions and length will equal the same sidecut,, it wont change, no matter what you do to it.
But I am thinking of real skis not some make believe bull shit and I
was speaking of these two Dyna skis, they are the same dimensions and length as(whatever models they are) then they are the same and have the same sidecut and dimensions which will give the skis the exact same turn radius.
If you dont mount your Addicts center then your an idiot.
You can theoretically move the mounting position or waste of the ski but the sidecut will still be the same,
the dimensions dictate the sidecut not the mounting position or waste, you can say narrow point this or that, but it means nothing.



PS .I am not a kid,

Jun 12 2008 10:04PM
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hemlockjibber8
Posts: 5955 - Karma: 3,455
are you saying if the narrowest part of the ski was 12 inches back from the tip, it would carve the same as if the narrowest part was 12 inches from the tail?!

or, same ski same size, but it doesnt even have a circular side cut. salomon has a snow board that uses three straight lines, rather than a parabola
Jun 12 2008 10:51PM
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jca
Posts: 4162 - Karma: 6,261

i dont think you get it

if the center of the sidecut (narrowest point of the ski) is changed then even with the same dimensions the ski will have different radiuses in the tip and tail.

They are not talking about where the ski is mounted, they are talking about where the center of the sidecut is.

The seths, msps and kungfujas's all have different sidecuts throughout the skis.

Jun 12 2008 10:53PM
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