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Is it possible to poch the summer camps lanes

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mariob
Posts: 1036 - Karma: 36

i was wondering after looking at that article on the main page would it be possible

Jun 29 2007 11:34PM
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tride
Posts: 1038 - Karma: 26
Holy shit, have you been asleep for the last 5 years?

Little wake up for ya;

Turpin rides Scott skis
Abma hasn't been at HN for years, he bought World Mogul 3 years ago but it folded.
Atkinson- rep for Armada
Alex B- ?
Pep- hasn't been at HN for years
Seth- hasn't been at HN for years either
Sven- still kickin
Andy- not there either
Michelle P- injured

So anyways, JP (Armada), Colby (Volkl), Anthony (Armada), Pete O (Salomon), Eric H (4FRNT), Sven, and Dana Flahr (Dynastar) comprise the majority of this years HN coaching staff.

Why don't you tell us again how K2 pays for each of them to work every day.

Where the hell do you get your "facts" from, the toilet store?

And poaching is stealing, period.
Jul 5 2007 9:24PM
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funkdoc
Posts: 1331 - Karma: 474
if your parents are able to pay for it, why would u not able? they have worked for it.. so let go and do the same thing
Jul 5 2007 9:43PM
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Kazabazua
Posts: 3529 - Karma: 1,128
stealing is COOL
Jul 5 2007 10:14PM
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Loach
Posts: 139 - Karma: 10
Some of you guys need to start opening some windows when you wax next time cause the fumes and screwing with your head.

First off, poaching is not only taking money out of the camp's pocket, it's a straight up liability risk. Yeah "one run", well what if in that one run, the kook eats shit, gets wrecked, and then he sues.

Secondly, unless you run a summer camp, you haven't the slightest clue how expensive it really is. I know, I run one. Ski resorts get to ammortize the cost of their park over 6 months, we have to do it in four weeks. We make a enough money to put food on our tables and keep the camp going next summer. I do it cause I love it and well, the free gear is pretty rad to. As for COC doubling in price, the park has doubled in size, so do the math.

Third, every coach is paid, except for the occassional volley trying to get their foot in the door. I don't care how broh brah you are with a pro, he makes his money skiing, so if you want him as a coach, you gotta pay. Rightly so too, it goes both ways. Competition is tight with camps getting pros to coach, so you have to offer good pay and lots of other treats to attract them. Then you have to pay for your sponsors athletes to come shred.

Fourth, Some of Europes hottest skier and riders are on the glacier here in Whistler or Hood. So there goes the idea of free gaciers in Europe being the reason some many Euros are killing it.

As for camp being a rip off? Well thats pretty relative, but if thats how you feel, then just don't go! Stop sounding so bitter and hating on those that do, cause they have a rad time and many keep coming back year after year. Thats says more than enough to me about the value of camp.

So if you want to poach, poach. Heck why not start stealing skis and gear too? I mean why not? Screw trying to give back to an industry who's core members give everything they have back to it for everyones benefit. Also stop talking smack cause you have a freind of a friend that knew a guy who once shared a lift with a guy who knew some one else that dated a girl who slept with a guy who knew someone who may or may not have partied with a guy that worked at a camp for a day a few years ago. If you went to camp and didn't like it, then give us hell. Otherwise listen to those that go, are going or went to camp about whether it's a rip off or not.
Jul 6 2007 3:43AM
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Elijah.
Posts: 9322 - Karma: 76
Word up. Don't hate on the kids just because they got money and you don't.
Jul 6 2007 3:54AM
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Elijah.
Posts: 9322 - Karma: 76
Oh and I can't afford summer camps either.
Jul 6 2007 3:54AM
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heFF
Posts: 5786 - Karma: 4,457
why?
Jul 6 2007 12:09PM
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Kazabazua
Posts: 3529 - Karma: 1,128
cause its like 2000$ for one week, and when your going to university away from home and have to pay for a lot of shit usually you can't afford that working a minimum wage job.
Jul 6 2007 12:31PM
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MattMcGinnis
Posts: 2396 - Karma: 73
did you just try to prove a point with a video featuring the music of Mims? and who the hell is russ henshaw?
Jul 6 2007 12:57PM
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landonn
Posts: 2913 - Karma: 385
all u kids that are commplaining. get a job!!!!!!!!!! or u can just get good at skiing and get a sponsor to pay for it. most kids that go have to pay for atleast half of it.
Jul 6 2007 1:08PM
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johnnypsunami
Posts: 5024 - Karma: 221
nope they are all riding for K2 again and all coaching. trust me I just paid 5 thousand for a week of camp and they all told me that Shane doesnt pay them anything. In fact, JP told me he pays Shane 10 grand a week just to ski on the High North lane cause its just soooooooooooooo good. better than Mammoth in peak season!!!

ahahahaha what this place is a joke. I'm spending my 2 grand this year to go to Spain for 2 weeks.

PS everyone, keep poaching. its what all the cool kids are doing. I might do it again next summer just to piss these kids off. ahaha
Jul 6 2007 3:13PM
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khyber.pass
Posts: 519 - Karma: 13
It's not that hard to poach a lane once or twice on the Blackcomb Glacier but to do it all day, you're just going to get caught. COC is on lockdown and HN and Momentum are smaller and run tight lanes. They also have their own t-bar, so forget it. You'll get chased off and then everyone will recognise you and that's it. Considering you're pissing off world-class coaches and campers and staff, if you want to get IN to the NS world this is NOT the way to do it. I was at HN this year and over the week there were about half a dozen would-be poachers. The best were the snowboarders, as they were really, really stupid (these are SKI camps).

Yah, camps are getting expensive.  But I saved up. Get a job, work hard, become a digger, email the camps, get employed, move there, live in the back of a truck, whatever. Whistler is a very fucking expensive place to live, a world class resort, and ALL prices in Whistler have doubled in the past 5 years. The 2010 Olympics are going to be there. Vancouver is routinely as expensive for housing as San Francisco and Whistler is like Manhattan. Most of you are from the Nowhere US where shit is cheap. Whistler is NOT like that. It is BIG money, BIG investment, and places like HN are somewhat relics of previous eras. It's a miracle HN and Momentum continue to exist with the spirit they have considering what is happening to Whistler itself. Mourn the day Whistler lost the Boot Pub. Where's the titties?

HN is probably going to have to undergo radical changes to make money and pay the coaches what they deserve. Evidence of all that already this year.
Jul 6 2007 3:25PM
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dmc12380
Posts: 3545 - Karma: 792
the first time i went to windells i got lost from my group and wandered into HCSC and all the snowboarders just started bitching and yelling at me.
Jul 6 2007 3:38PM
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Rez4frederick
Posts: 4740 - Karma: 40
Dude, I dont really understand why coaches think they need to get paid a shit ton of money at a camp.  For one, They get a free place to stay for up to as long as they want.  Free Skiing, food.  All they have to do is get themselves there.  Then they get a free, elite place to practice jibbing for the upcoming season.  so they get to ski, promote their sponsors etc., practice tricks for upcoming season so they can hopefully win competitions (which is where the money is for pro atheletes)  So they get a huge advantage as far as being really comfortable on their skis for the winter season and on the first day in the park they will be doing switch cork 9's while most people will just be trying to get their 360's back.  I dunno, if I was ever offered to be a coach at a camp, I would not be worried about getting paid. That is why I work the rest of the year to save up money for blowing money on vacations. 
Now im not saying that camps shouldnt adjust their prices as needed, but just know that the higher it goes up, the less people you will have.  There are alot of other things to do besides skiing in the summer.
With that said, I have been to a couple summer camps and it was the time of my life.  But I have also taken a trip on my own and skied at my own camp for alot cheaper and it was just as sweet but without all the people.  All the people do make it fun, but this way was just more affordable for me.
Jul 6 2007 3:50PM
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johnnypsunami
Posts: 5024 - Karma: 221
wow, someone who understands what this thread is all about. give yourself a pat on the back.
Jul 6 2007 4:44PM
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dmc12380
Posts: 3545 - Karma: 792
yea, same thing with me. I went to windells in '04 and '05 when i was 15 and 16 and paid for all of the camp, plane tickets, and spending money from just working part time in the summer. Its not that hard to do.

Plus does anyone who went there in 2005 remember Fajailburg Swerdlowe. That kid is the epitome of a stuck up rich kid, although he was one of the funniest kids i ever met. His parents paid for like 5 sessions and i think he went up to the mountain like twice and barely went skating. The counslers just let him sleep in till like noon everyday.
Jul 6 2007 5:39PM
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DANETRON
Posts: 6671 - Karma: 137
ya when you are 15 or 16 its not that hard to pay for seeing as you have zero other expenses, but when you dont live at home and have other shit to pay for its real hard to pay all you have to pay and not go into debt
Jul 6 2007 6:22PM
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Elijah.
Posts: 9322 - Karma: 76
Because I have to spend the money I make for my job for my food? Plus I'm saving for a car.
Jul 6 2007 6:26PM
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fillup
Posts: 4904 - Karma: 568
turpin rides 4frnt
sven is on atomic
peter isnt a coach
Jul 6 2007 6:29PM
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DANETRON
Posts: 6671 - Karma: 137

wait isnt gore freeskier mario? didnt you just go out there to camp or something like that

Jul 6 2007 6:37PM
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mariob
Posts: 1036 - Karma: 36
yeah i prolly should tell everyone im going to camp on july 26 to windells but i didnt also before u all go hatin i worked for every penny to go to camp so there.
Jul 6 2007 10:10PM
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Loach
Posts: 139 - Karma: 10
Asking a pro skier to ski for free is like asking a cook to cook for free. A garbage man to collect garbage for free. A pilot to fly for free. Skiing is what puts their food on the table and a roof over the head. It may be a shit load more fun than collecting garbage, but it's how they make a living regardless.

As for skiing being about poaching, I thought it was about having fun with your friends. To each his own I guess. Keep biting the hand that feeds you, cause Karma always catches up to you, just ask Earl.
Jul 7 2007 3:23AM
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J.D.
Posts: 21362 - Karma: 5,141
Some of you people make me absolutely embarrassed to care about this sport. Just unbelievable how selfish you can be. I hope all ski theft happens to people like you guys, because that'd be karma at work.
Next summer I offer any camp the following suggestion: hire a bouncer and have a couple of these idiots arrested and fined. See how many people poach after that news gets around.
Jul 7 2007 3:53AM
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mariob
Posts: 1036 - Karma: 36
^im pretty sure I care about the sport not because of the people that are involved in it u care about it because it is fun as all hell
Jul 7 2007 10:55AM
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Trennon
Posts: 75 - Karma: 806
Wow, sweet thread guys.

Here is our perspective:

At Momentum, we do work very hard to try and give the best possible experience for our campers. This goes for all of the camps on the glacier, they are all run by great, hardworking people, who bust their ass to create parks in some very challenging condiditons. Part of the experience that the campers pay for, is having a private lane. Anyone who poaches our lane is taking away from the campers who have, in many cases, worked their asses off to earn the money to come to our camp. Also, there is an insurance issue, safety considerations, etc.

I'm not sure why people think that we wouldn't pay our coaches?? Does anyone like working for free? The job title says it all: coach. They are not up there on their own, skiing around without a care in the world. They are actively COACHING the campers, working with a different group every day. And this is not only on-hill, but also during afternoon activities, evening video review sessions, trampoline, etc. Yes, it is a great job, however it also involves obligations, responsibilities, and commitments, like all jobs do.

We love our coaching crew, and so do our campers. Having TJ Schiller teach you a switch take-off, or Rory Bushfield take you off one of his crazy rock gap creations, is a huge part of the experience that we provide. In fact, most of our coaches are former campers themselves, who obviously found some value in the experience. Asking them to work for free, or expecting Salomon to pay Bibby's expenses and wage, would be pretty rude on our part.

Try as you may, you will have a hard time convincing John, Shane, Ken, etc. that you have the right to poach what they have spent considerable effort, time, and money creating.

As for the guys who actually build and maintain the camp lanes, like Doug, Steve, Myles, myself, I'd just like to point out one thing: It is so incredibly rude when someone poaches, and then acts like we are the a-holes when we ask them to respect our campers, diggers, and coaches, by staying off our private lanes.

Someone in this thread said "poaching is skiing". Personally I think that poaching is scamming other skiers. "Skiing" for me, has a much more positive definition.

Peace
Jul 7 2007 5:16PM
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M+M
Posts: 7935 - Karma: 25
high north beat a niggas ass this year for doing that strraight up dont fuck on their lanes
Jul 7 2007 6:01PM
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M+M
Posts: 7935 - Karma: 25
dude you got owned on your k2 facts, who chooses spain over whistler, prolly the dumbest idea ever
Jul 7 2007 6:03PM
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AhrenStein
Posts: 1941 - Karma: 177
why the fuck are you hating on kids with rich parents. their parents worked their asses off to be rich so let them reap the benifits. stop bitching that their parents are smarter than yours...

and to the people that work for their week at camp - you are the shit.
Jul 7 2007 7:01PM
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skifree919
Posts: 5842 - Karma: 35
haha.. umm id rather go to spain than whistler.
Jul 7 2007 7:05PM
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johnnypsunami
Posts: 5024 - Karma: 221
ahahaha thanks for the life tips, but ive been to whistler enough thanks, especially for shitty summer skiing.

ever heard of ibiza? you probably enjoy video games more than girls, so im wasting my time here. have fun playing amped 3.
Jul 7 2007 9:18PM
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Barmski
Posts: 4342 - Karma: 811
THANK YOU !!! exactly what im tryin to say here!
Jul 8 2007 10:49AM
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Barmski
Posts: 4342 - Karma: 811
so part of the 2000 dollar experience your paying for is the coaches salaries huh? Maybe part of the experience should be making it more affordtable so more people can enjoy it. I wana see the profit margins on what you guys make from putting these so called "camps" up. All I kno is when i was at COC I never got any of this instruction even offered to me which is quite a rip off if you ask me. I bet it is interesting to see these margins...
Jul 8 2007 10:57AM
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mariob
Posts: 1036 - Karma: 36
i believe poaching is part of skiing and it puts some adventure and fun into it. this mainly with trails and stuff. 
Jul 8 2007 5:31PM
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Trennon
Posts: 75 - Karma: 806
Well, if you were never offered coaching, or instruction, I sympathise. Maybe not all camps operate the same. I suppose I can only comment on our particular camp.

If you ask anyone who has been to our camp about the quality of coaching and instruction, I would expect that they have a very different outlook. Our coaches ski with a different group of campers every day, teaching all morning, and do video review with them every day as well. Instruction is an integral part of our camp. In fact I would say that the biggest asset of our camp, is our crew of coaches and the different styles of teaching that they all have.

As for the margins, I am simply a contracted worker, and can't answer that for you (although I do admit that sometimes I'm curious myself). While I'm sure they all do pretty well, I will say that I don't see any of the camp owners driving Ferraris, but I certainly see them working extremely hard.
Jul 8 2007 9:04PM
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Barmski
Posts: 4342 - Karma: 811
pretty sure anyone would work hard in paradise if they had the chance and opportunity too.
Jul 8 2007 11:25PM
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mariob
Posts: 1036 - Karma: 36
well i better learn while im at camp or ill be pissed thats the main reason y im going.
Jul 8 2007 11:37PM
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Adrenaline
Posts: 1264 - Karma: 552
wow.  just wow.  poaching isn't skiing,  it's stealing from people that work hard to put out a product.  All you kids are also the same kids bitching when you get your passes pulled during the season for ducking ropes into areas you shouldn't be in, so you've got no sympathy from me.  I respect people trying to make a living out of something they are passionate about.  If you know people, or can get into a camp legit for free one day, good on ya.  but these people aren't in this sport for the money.  they are in it for the passion.  My Hyperlite rep put it very well way back when I was running a shop, he said that by the time he pays his expenses, and pays for the roof over his family and food on their table, he has no money at all.  He got a boat at cost from malibu, even then they didn't just give it to him.  He did it because he grew up on lakes and that was what he was passionate about.  The same goes for skiing.  We all do what we do because we love the sport and the friendships we make from the sport.  It is trying to make a living at something you love, not making a living at something that you can pay all your bills with.
Jul 8 2007 11:55PM
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-Schmitty-
Posts: 414 - Karma: 11
haaaaaaaaaa... not so much dogg im going to camp but i paid for all of it... your a fucking moron
Jul 9 2007 12:30AM
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ThaLetterM.
Posts: 8609 - Karma: 1,612
but mommmm all the cool kids are doing it!
Jul 9 2007 12:31AM
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tBatt
Posts: 9632 - Karma: 580
hahhahahhaahahahahahahahahahaahaahahahahahahahahah

mario b gon' keep it reealll bitchessss
Jul 9 2007 12:34AM
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khyber.pass
Posts: 519 - Karma: 13
 You are evidently not old enough to worry about paying taxes or retiring. Professional ski careers only last so long -- until major injury or aging knees and back take their toll. Coaches need to be paid, so they can live, pay their mortgages, raise their kids, and so on. Yes, this IS one of those things you will understand once the taxman cometh for you, and once you move out of your parent's basement, and try living in somewhere like Whistler, where sh*t is hella expensive.

Jul 9 2007 1:02PM
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khyber.pass
Posts: 519 - Karma: 13
It's evident at HN there isn't much profit margin. And if you went to COC and didn't get instruction, that says either a lot about you (you didn't seek it out) or COC. Anyone from COC care to respond? Doesn't COC include team coaching in the morning (with a pro coach), then video in the afternoon and later video review, like HN and Momentum? Something tells me it does.
Jul 9 2007 1:05PM
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Fattwins
Posts: 253 - Karma: 10
Seriously grow up people if you dont pay then you have no right to be there. If you get caught the police should be involved. In fact if this is a problem then the camps will have to hire gaurds or policemen, thus driving up the cost of the camp even more.

Stealing is stealing people fact.
Jul 9 2007 8:50PM
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jKutcher
Posts: 3936 - Karma: 4,260
all you people saying poaching isnt stealing are seriuosly retarded. these kids pay alot of money to go ride that lane and get coached by the pros and you think that you can just roll up and ski it without paying for it without consiquence? open your eyes. if you dont have the money dont ski the lane. its as simple as that. DONT BE LAZY AND GET YOURSELF A JOB! it isnt that hard to make the money for camp.
Jul 9 2007 9:19PM
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mariob
Posts: 1036 - Karma: 36
im pretty sure we all realize the consequences of poaching the lanes, yes. I understand prices would go up, yes makes perfect sense to me. But the one thing i desagree with people saying poaching takes away from the sport, yes maybe if its summer camp. But when ur at a hill pay for ur pass i dont think its a crime. i mean ur putting ur self manly at risk thats all maybe the ski patrol if they have to come and save u but no one else. i would also like to mention that some of my best days skiing happen poaching cliffs and lines. poaching in away has almost push the sport put people were not supposed to ski raising the bar. I also have to say it is a little stupid but not a huge deal.
Jul 9 2007 9:42PM
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papasteeze
Posts: 12055 - Karma: 911

Nipples' mother and I paid for his camp at COC the previous 2 years. He really sucked at school this year and I told him if he did not get his grades up he would not be going to camp. 

He got a job mowing grass.  He is working to pay for his camp. At 13 years old he will earn enough to pay for week plus plane fare with plenty left over.  Get a job kids.

Jul 9 2007 10:01PM
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Kazabazua
Posts: 3529 - Karma: 1,128
^ how does mowing lawns get like 3000$? I want in on this job mowing these lawns, cause i work 4 days a week as a golf instructor for kids and probably couldnt save the money to go out there. I mean I make 380$ a week, thats pretty shitty pay, 380x8=3080$ which for me paying for all my other shit like skis, food, and other shit is absolutely impossible.
Jul 9 2007 10:25PM
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landonn
Posts: 2913 - Karma: 385
u dont pay for anything once u get there and u prolly already have all ur own stuff.
Jul 9 2007 10:38PM
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Kazabazua
Posts: 3529 - Karma: 1,128
^ you dont realize that I have to pay for shit while im saving up my money, making it impossible to go at the end of summer to coc because i will probably only have 1500 or so even if i do save up, which is simply not enough. And yes I have 3 pairs of skis but they are all FUCKED up
Jul 9 2007 10:43PM
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Barmski
Posts: 4342 - Karma: 811
^ wow im a golf pro too man. actually studying to be a teaching pga pro but i have to say you getting shitty money. I get 70 an hour when I do my lessons and of course I dont get 40 hours of those a week its just included in the job. If i were you I would request for me money thats shityt pay for teaching golf. And yes i would like to kno what lawns this kid is mowing. Seriously....
Jul 9 2007 11:42PM
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