Liberty image

i am certain that we could have a much nicer logo than three red stars, if you guys have any ideas just post them

I dont think that we can go away from the stars as they are our logo, a company has to stick to the logo, and its important to the company, but we can certainly play around with it, and I agree with the main idea of your email.

im with you 110% man, spinks and i have been throwing around alot of ideas with this as well...nothing against the head boys at the company, but they are somewhat conservative...i think that there have been alot of sick ideas going around, and i would love to see some of them happen. I think that the skis turned out great this year, and that is what is most important, however if you look at any other small company, the ad work, logos, softgoods etc are miles ahead..that is what makes the difference between the companies. I dont think that anyone will buy plain softgoods with liberty logos on them, simple as that. They are perfect for giving away schwag, but im almost certain that they arent really generating sales. The skis are dope, now what the company needs is a makeover with its image, and this is defanitely doable. Yikes sorry for the rant here, but i think that this is something that needs to have some serious consideration.

What you (a lot of you actually) are forgetting is that the ski market is bigger than the urban rail scene or the park. Although that is a large aspect, and the fastest growing area, of skiing, it is not the one with the most money. I am as much involved with the park as anyone here, but what you also have to remember is that park skiers represent just a fraction of the market. A picture of a backflip, although not as appealing to the younger jib generation, is far more appealing to the generation with the money than an urban rail shot. If you think about your parents, they do not care about sliding rails, they don't understand it and don't really think its good for anything other than wrecking edges. They will, however, interpret the backflip scene as something that has been a part of skiing for a long time and transitions better to their needs. The problem with the new freeride scene is that, although its growing fast, everyone in the scene believes that they should be sponsored in some way. This means that "jibbers" are not really spending that much money, they are trying to squeeze into the "free" aspect of it. The money in skiing is still with the older generation, the people who amount to 90% of the skiers on the hill. I like the idea of the different and upgraded swag, but such things come in time. Liberty is here to sell skis, you don't need a sweet hat to have a good ski, you need a variety of athletes, all good in their respective aspects of skiing, who are willing to stop people on the hill and talk to them about the product. It is far more important that the visiting family from Denver think that you are a good representative of Liberty than it is that your bros at home think you have some dope swag.

Charlie, I would totally agree with you if 1 thing was different: the target audience. If we were advertising in Skiing, Powder or a mag like that, you would be right, but we are not. therefore, I have to agree 100% with Justin and Witt.

I'd like to expand on what Charlie has already pointed out, and further I think we need to settle a bit into our own places.

First of all, we appreciate your imput and suggestions, however you must understand that all of us (myself included) are athletes that have been chosen by the company to better represent what the company is all about and provide inspiration back to them.

Also, there is a lot more to running this company than trying to come up with new "cool" products that you as a rider expect to get for free. Calling the executives conservative or anything like that is inappropriate because they have all sacrificed their own lives, thier own money, and their time to work hard and run a ski company. You may have different ideas about company direction, but realize that the reason you have free skis this year is because of the decisions made to build this company. Let’s be careful not to bite the hand that feeds. The execs of Liberty are stoked on all of us representing the company, that's why they chose us and give us free stuff!

I really wish that I had a billion dollars to be able to make everything that is considered cool and just take over the world, but I live in the real world too. I am stoked on the idea of getting New Era to print us some hats, but in reality it is not a priority because right now things are crazy with shipping skis out to shops, shipping skis to all of us, taking orders, finishing softgoods for this year (I haven’t seen all of them, but they will be sick) and many other complicated business related tasks.

A note about the ad's-I'm sure you all would rather see a sick urban rail or park shot, but that isn't what the ad was exposing! The Ad with Ryan Moore throwing the massive flip off a cliff that would make all of us (me included) piss our pants is a great outlet for the C-Note ski. We have other skis besides the park skis! This is another reason you are all here. The company hooks up a roots team because it is great exposure and the chance of getting new marketing materials and ideas. If you get a super sick photo that fits the theme we’re working on it will be used! Also, seriously, that photo doesn’t really show how big Ryan Moore is going, that cliff is huge and he isn’t landing in a nice fluffy perfect landing, there are some serious consequences to that thing, it’s crazy!

This may sound strange, but Liberty is not Armada or 4frnt, we are more like Dynastar or Volkl in the sense that yea, we make some sick park skis but we focus on sick skis for every type of skier out there. This company was started near Vail, Colorado where we have a great park, but we also have about 4500 acres of mountain outside of the park to ski.

Basically what I'm trying to say is the park/pipe/urban/youth culture is important, but not our only focus. We’re really glad all of you are so excited and eager to share your ideas, but remember, the company is sponsoring you because of your skiing, so go skiing and have fun!

***In the future, discussions of this nature should not be in this forum, but rather taken straight to the executives themselves.***

well said.

yea, Liberty team is made up of jibbers mostly, i dont really remember the last time i did a back X... if the image we are going for is for powder, all mountain riders who go into the park and dont like all this new gangstaness, we are set, and I am ready to go represent... but i think the jib market is a bigger, better market. I think the 06 skis are good for that market, we got 2 good jib skis and a dope Big Mtn twin... now we just need to get the image too... I think we need something like Armada, but not like their art... still unique, just something like that. Like their art, it looks sick, its unique, and its still modern and new. Same with K2... and the little sketches, we need something in that element, but different. I personally think the star is fine, because Liberty = Stars and ... but maybe a re do of the logo, or maybe make some crazier designs or colors using the star? I have been rocking the skis now for 2 weeks, and I love them and people like the skis and how they look and ski, the only bad thing that anyone has said since I got on is about the image of Back Flip iron crosses...

spinks i want you to know that was meant with no disrespect, that is just a term that has been put out in previous discussions by others than my self, and i simply threw it in their. James and Dan have done an incredible job with this company in a market that is no walk in the park. Starting a succesfull company and producing a product at the level that Liberty does is no small feat, and i have nothing but respect for everyone involved in getting Liberty where it is today. By no means was i attempting to rag on the company, because i love Liberty, and i wouldnt be a part of it if i didnt. I was simply trying to throw out some constructive ideas for potential growth in the future. I understand alot of what goes on behind the scenes with this company, and i appreciate how privelaged we are to even have a say in it. I apologize to everyone if my initial post was a little harsh, because as i say, i have nothing but love and respect for liberty, and i just want to see it grow and improve! Everyone does a great job here including the reps, team managers, athletes, and management, and Im sure that all of these ideas can come together to keep moing liberty forward!

^ yea my post was kinda like that, i apologize and i just want to say that this company is really in touch with its riders, i dont know any other company that has any form of connection like this with their riders, i think it is awesome...

I understand that the ad is put in freeskier, but as Spinks said, and I forgot to point out, the ad is for the Cnotes, where a back X is far more appropriate than an urban rail shot.

i think it's really important that we as riders have a really solid idea of 'who' Liberty wants to be. i, for one, wasn't totally aware of the fact that being seen as a more all-around ski company was the aim. and that's fantastic! good to know...but i can understand where the 'constructive criticism' is coming from, when you look at other big ski companies advertising in magazines like Freeskier specifically to the (right now) main audience of the magazine - i.e. jibbers under 20. it's SO cool that we want to be seen as a ski company accessible to EVERYONE, unlike companies like 4frnt and Armada which aim to have a much younger group of consumers, but i think it's fair that this team (the under-20-jibber-crew) would say something, maybe i shouldn't go so far as to say negative, but in reference to our ad that's currently running. especially if i'm not the only one finding out for the first time WHO exactly our target audience is.



eloquence. a quality i sometimes lack.

I dont believe its so much of a target audience, I think we need to look at the hill and see who is riding twintip skis. Now without a doubt the most twintip skis on any hill are found on young (under 20) riders in the park. There are far more jibbers and park rats on the hill than pure big mountain skiers that require a fat ski. Another thing I wanted to point out is that I believe this company may have a little too much of a "hard core" image, skiing is influenced by an urban culture. It can be seen in every kid on the hill with baggy pants and goggle sag, not to mention that hip hop/pop music is used in most video parts in the big movies. I am not saying we take a core hip hop approach, but perhaps make more orginal ads without the words "fearless and independent". thats just my two cents

The goal of Liberty has always been clear, to provide a quality product to skiers designed by skiers. As chees ball as that sounds Liberty wants to make products for every type of skier. Liberty is the company that can outfit the whole family. For the younger kids, we have the predator 160cm, for the older kids who play in the park the pro twins, for the 25 year old son who skis trees, logslides and powder and cruisers and basically jibbing the whole mountain we have the SB, for the guy that is back flipping cliffs we have the C-Note, and for the recreational cruiser skiers we have the Lightspeed.

All the skis are super sick for whom they are targeted.

This was a good discussion, I appreciate all of you putting up your thoughts.

****If you have any other questions about company image, direction, strategy, ect you can email Dan or Andy and they will let you know what's up.****

thanks, that was really well put together and concise

well said