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So many people these days are skiing like shit with no style and no technique. What happened to doing technical training in racing and moguls. The reason Adam Delorme, Tanner Hall, Seth, sage , Chris Benchetler ect. ski so well is their technical back ground . All we see now is big mountain edits where's people can't hold an edge , their body position is horrible and all the do is straight line and slide their turns. This is not good skiing people need to learn the fundimentals in order to be a truly good skier. Just cause you can do a double cork 10 and slide side ways down a chute doesn't mean you are a good skier and people should know this and if they can't ski properly they should learn.
People should learn but really it doesnt matter... eventually someone will call a lap outside of the park, everyone else will hype and they will be left standing there with their dick in hand wondering what to do. Not your fault...
Brocka_FlockaHoly fuck someone on this site who know what they are talking about.
But this is a serious problem. With more and more kids growing up in the park, we're seeing less and less good skiing. that's bad.
I compete in a lot of big mountain comps and most of the skiers really aren't that good they just side slip and do hack turns and straight line over gnarly zones with horrible style..
I grew up doing mogul drills.. this taught me to ski with a stacked body position and how to properly angulate an edge.
What's going to happen to skiing when Candide etc. are too old to ski? Basic ski skills are dying.. Watch Henrick ski big mountain. it's ugly as fuck .. amazing skier but that style isn't what's up.. Look at Candide.. stacked body postion.. calm upper body lower body doing all the work.. the guy skis like water.. same with Tanner and Parker.. the only kids coming up with amazing ski skills are Kye Peterson and Logan Pehota and I'm pretty sure both of them raced for years before skiing because their parents knew what was needed to make them proper skiers...
It's like surfing and aerials and not being able to do big power hacks... they should be a huge part of someone's surfing in order to be considered a "Good surfer" just cause you can do a full rotation air reverse doesn't make you a good surfer.. you have toe have the rail game to back it up like Dane Reynolds.
There is a reason that Dane is considered to be the best surfer in the world atm.. because he has the all around game and fundamentals to back it up.. In my opinion, this is a really big deal in skiing and needs to be talked about and taught to young kids coming up... You all need to learn how to ski properly... not just side slip turns... It's ugly as fuck and makes skiing in general look really bad... So many edits I cringe when I see people skiing powder...
I agree to an extent but also need to give props where props are due. I just Jr Big mountain comps and a ton of those kids charge like beasts and can work their skis like nobody's business. Lot's of railing going on, more so than in the sr comps.
skiing is art. sure it helps to have a technical background like someone who can paint a perfect portrait, but if you can disregard the rules and still create something stunning, more power to you.
ozzywrongI compete in a lot of big mountain comps and most of the skiers really aren't that good they just side slip and do hack turns and straight line over gnarly zones with horrible style..
I grew up doing mogul drills.. this taught me to ski with a stacked body position and how to properly angulate an edge.
What's going to happen to skiing when Candide etc. are too old to ski? Basic ski skills are dying.. Watch Henrick ski big mountain. it's ugly as fuck .. amazing skier but that style isn't what's up.. Look at Candide.. stacked body postion.. calm upper body lower body doing all the work.. the guy skis like water.. same with Tanner and Parker.. the only kids coming up with amazing ski skills are Kye Peterson and Logan Pehota and I'm pretty sure both of them raced for years before skiing because their parents knew what was needed to make them proper skiers...
It's like surfing and aerials and not being able to do big power hacks... they should be a huge part of someone's surfing in order to be considered a "Good surfer" just cause you can do a full rotation air reverse doesn't make you a good surfer.. you have toe have the rail game to back it up like Dane Reynolds.
There is a reason that Dane is considered to be the best surfer in the world atm.. because he has the all around game and fundamentals to back it up.. In my opinion, this is a really big deal in skiing and needs to be talked about and taught to young kids coming up... You all need to learn how to ski properly... not just side slip turns... It's ugly as fuck and makes skiing in general look really bad... So many edits I cringe when I see people skiing powder...
Hey man, any specific video examples of this? I am a visual learner always trying to up my game in all facets of the sport so videos with timestamps would be appreciated
ozzywrongCause it's ugly as fuck when people don't have good technique .. Simple and we should establish that it's unacceptable to have bad technique.
yeah it helps if you know how to carve a turn but if literally everybody skied with perfect form skiing would be a lot more boring to watch. I like watching Henrik's pow/big mt stuff because his style is so unique in that category, makes it look fun because of how unstable and on the edge of eating shit he is yet he still rides away.
tl;dr why do you get to decide what style is good/ugly
This is a pretty hostile rant haha but you have some really good points. I see too many kids nowadays getting sponsored for their jump skills when they couldn't even hold control in a line of moguls or make some decent turns through a race course. My father made me race for years before I could do freestyle and I'm glad he did because it made me a better park skier and now that I'm living out west skiing gnarly terrain I find myself much more prepared than other park rats like myself.
People are always hostile towards you if you try to tell them how to ski but if they honestly can't realize that a good fundamental background will not only make them exponentially better at skiing but also increase their riding experience infinitely then that is their own problem.
JibberinoCould you elaborate on why this is a problem?
It's dangerous. People with bad technique are more likely to get hurt or hurt others. The stacked, controlled body position makes it much easier to absorb and react to unexpected terrain and snow conditions and generally stay in control.
A solid foundation will also help you progress much faster. I'm friends with a number of very good racers, and I've gone in the park with some of them and watched them learn stuff in a single day that takes jibber kids an entire year. They're in there stomping 7s first day because they know how to ski already.
Like Ozzy here, I skied moguls for a bit growing up and that gave me a great foundation, but I lost some over the years. Two summers ago I did some race training and generally brushed up on my technique, and the next winter I found myself skiing pow much better than ever before. It made a huge difference and boosted my confidence a lot.
I think some of this loss of technical ability is due to fewer soul shredders coming up. A lot fewer skiers, especially park skiers, grew up skiing nowadays. Instead they watch x games at 13 and head straight to the park. The involvement is awesome, don't get me wrong, but they'd progress faster and safer with real skiing ability. And there's no reason it can't be learned alongside park.
You know why Jonah Williams and Quinn Wolferman are next level good? They're better skiers than most coming up right now. I've known both of them since they were still young beans with Wasatch Project hiking in our summer park. They already knew how to ski fast and ski well then, and you can see where it's taken them.
TL;DR: if you wanna become nasty quickly and safely, learn how to ski well.
I grew up doing mogul drills.. this taught me to ski with a stacked body position and how to properly angulate an edge.
What's going to happen to skiing when Candide etc. are too old to ski? Basic ski skills are dying.. Watch Henrick ski big mountain. it's ugly as fuck .. amazing skier but that style isn't what's up.. Look at Candide.. stacked body postion.. calm upper body lower body doing all the work.. the guy skis like water.. same with Tanner and Parker.. the only kids coming up with amazing ski skills are Kye Peterson and Logan Pehota and I'm pretty sure both of them raced for years before skiing because their parents knew what was needed to make them proper skiers...
It's like surfing and aerials and not being able to do big power hacks... they should be a huge part of someone's surfing in order to be considered a "Good surfer" just cause you can do a full rotation air reverse doesn't make you a good surfer.. you have toe have the rail game to back it up like Dane Reynolds.
There is a reason that Dane is considered to be the best surfer in the world atm.. because he has the all around game and fundamentals to back it up.. In my opinion, this is a really big deal in skiing and needs to be talked about and taught to young kids coming up... You all need to learn how to ski properly... not just side slip turns... It's ugly as fuck and makes skiing in general look really bad... So many edits I cringe when I see people skiing powder...[/QUOTE]
If you want to see some good big mtn comp skiers, come to Whistler because many of us from the freeride club started in racing.
Heartcave is in the public domain now so no excuses for bad technique. Go make the ski (and even use the name) which'll fix it (in my view.)
Don't agree with me with a passion?? Go make the ski anyway and prove me wrong.
Never look or feel like a retard again, that's my promise!! Be a contrarian.
Anyhow, bad technique has its limits, but not good technique.
If someone's technique is so bad, they'll either be injured or in pain, and so they won't be skiing. Or otherwise they might be severely limited with regards to terrain choice.
If someone's technique is so good, they'll be so stoked to ski, and they'll look and feel so great that more people will be attracted to the sport. Every injury is a negative to the sport, like when non-skiers and parents hear about it.
ozzywrongSo many people these days are skiing like shit with no style and no technique. What happened to doing technical training in racing and moguls. The reason Adam Delorme, Tanner Hall, Seth, sage , Chris Benchetler ect. ski so well is their technical back ground . All we see now is big mountain edits where's people can't hold an edge , their body position is horrible and all the do is straight line and slide their turns. This is not good skiing people need to learn the fundimentals in order to be a truly good skier. Just cause you can do a double cork 10 and slide side ways down a chute doesn't mean you are a good skier and people should know this and if they can't ski properly they should learn.
fewer skiers and their families can afford good technical training, even lessons for that matter. those little things certainly help, and unless skiing can become more affordable and available to more people (no thanks to mega resorts, fuck you guys), the trend you're outlining is only going to continue into a downward spiral.
ozzywrongWhat's going to happen to skiing when Candide etc. are too old to ski? Basic ski skills are dying..
Just cause your average 15 year old park rat doesnt know how to make a proper turn doesnt mean nobody else knows how to actually ski. Racers and mogul skiers still exist and tons of them ski park as well. Sure a good amount of park kids pizza and side slip, but those arent the kids that are going to become huge like candide or tanner. Keep an eye out and Im sure youll be surprised by the talent that is out there.
ozzywrongI compete in a lot of big mountain comps and most of the skiers really aren't that good they just side slip and do hack turns and straight line over gnarly zones with horrible style..
I grew up doing mogul drills.. this taught me to ski with a stacked body position and how to properly angulate an edge.
What's going to happen to skiing when Candide etc. are too old to ski? Basic ski skills are dying.. Watch Henrick ski big mountain. it's ugly as fuck .. amazing skier but that style isn't what's up.. Look at Candide.. stacked body postion.. calm upper body lower body doing all the work.. the guy skis like water.. same with Tanner and Parker.. the only kids coming up with amazing ski skills are Kye Peterson and Logan Pehota and I'm pretty sure both of them raced for years before skiing because their parents knew what was needed to make them proper skiers...
It's like surfing and aerials and not being able to do big power hacks... they should be a huge part of someone's surfing in order to be considered a "Good surfer" just cause you can do a full rotation air reverse doesn't make you a good surfer.. you have toe have the rail game to back it up like Dane Reynolds.
There is a reason that Dane is considered to be the best surfer in the world atm.. because he has the all around game and fundamentals to back it up.. In my opinion, this is a really big deal in skiing and needs to be talked about and taught to young kids coming up... You all need to learn how to ski properly... not just side slip turns... It's ugly as fuck and makes skiing in general look really bad... So many edits I cringe when I see people skiing powder...
As someone who has grown-up competing big mountain, this is important to me.
I also think that there is a direct correlation between the best styles and being a good skier. Parker, Duncan, Rainville and C-Lo. Jonah and Quinn. You watch those two and it is clearly evident that they have solid technique.
Let me get this straight.... Someone can ski a gnarly line faster and better than you ever could and they're the one without proper ski technique because they don't stick to the "this is how to ski" textbook you seem to fuck at night when you're lonely?
Once upon a time racers claimed Shane didn't have proper technique with his side slashing maneuver to kill speed at critical moments and yet every racer has now adopted that technique and credited him with "inventing" it.
In short, you're a fucking idiot and should fuck off. There is no proper way to ski. The status quo is set by the jackasses with too big of an ego who claim there is no better way to ski than how they do it.
With that written, kids who grow up only ski park are really shitty at skiing anything outside of the park. That's about it.
That's a saying I hear golfers use a lot and it always reminds me or skiing. In golf, it's pretty cool if you can destroy the ball off the tee and send it 300 yards, but if you can't chip out of the sand trap and putt it in the hole, you're lacking a crucial part of your game. Same with skiing, if you can throw down in the park, but you get bucked around the moguls like a quadriplegic riding a bull, you aren't making the most of your potential.
You can have fun either way of course, but if want to truly be a great skier like Candide or Tanner, you should be proficient in different aspects of the game. I'm not trying to force anyone to change up their entire style of skiing, but skiing moguls, glades, and practicing carving from time to time will make you a better all around skier, allowing for even more fun at the hill.
I agree that technical training like moguls, racing etc. provides a good background, but it's not necessary for learning good technique. Those programs also aren't accessible to a lot of people who live in a place with no programs or can't afford sports coaching. Also I think people with a background outside the established programs can be more ready to innovate and add to existing skiing techniques.
skiP.E.I.I agree that technical training like moguls, racing etc. provides a good background, but it's not necessary for learning good technique. Those programs also aren't accessible to a lot of people who live in a place with no programs or can't afford sports coaching. Also I think people with a background outside the established programs can be more ready to innovate and add to existing skiing techniques.
Also speaking of big mountain events, I'd say it's good those folks with weaker technique are attending those events because it can potentially be a good incubator for them to find out what works and what doesn't. i.e. I have a friend who informally coached me a bit, he did some big mountain competitions and the experience he gained prepping for and skiing in those events he was able to pass on to me and it's helped me a lot to understand things like what goes into choosing a line and executing it aesthetically and efficiently.
I ski with no poles because it's more fun. Do I have shit form? Probably.
I ski giant retarded flappy rockered paddles centre mounted, because it's more fun.
I do a lot of stuff that Mr Judgey McJudgeington the ski instructor probably thinks looks like shit, but I have fun doing it.
As someone mentioned above, the "by the book" way of doing things might be more efficient or faster or whatever. But if what you do is more fun, to you, than the by-the-book method, whatever, go hard.
My parents are ski instructors. I got raised by PSIA. But I'll watch a dub cork 10 any minute over some turns with great angluation and edge control. Who cares about what happens between the tricks? That goes for big mountain comps too.
ozzywrongSo many people these days are skiing like shit with no style and no technique. What happened to doing technical training in racing and moguls. The reason Adam Delorme, Tanner Hall, Seth, sage , Chris Benchetler ect. ski so well is their technical back ground . All we see now is big mountain edits where's people can't hold an edge , their body position is horrible and all the do is straight line and slide their turns. This is not good skiing people need to learn the fundimentals in order to be a truly good skier. Just cause you can do a double cork 10 and slide side ways down a chute doesn't mean you are a good skier and people should know this and if they can't ski properly they should learn.
For the most part I agree, but powersliding a spine, which we got from McConkey who certainly had fundamentals, is a legit way to approach things. If a guy can only powerslide that is different. The best skiers will always have edging skills.
For the people who don't think this is a problem the issue is that it inhibits the progression of big mountain skiing. The best guys will always be able to edge and will have a grab bag of skills, i.e. powersliding AND railing perfect turns, to negotiate big mountain terrain with.
I remember years ago talking to a 4frnt rep. He told me that Hoji had the best technique among the 4frnt riders, as well as the ability to powerslide, and those skills are what make him arguably the best big mountain skiers out there.
Progression in big mountain takes great technique as well as the ability to powerslide down a spine. The guys who only sideslip and huck will never get past a certain level. As far as guy who huck the guys who land on their feet and ski out of big hucks ALL have a good fundamental basis.
I agree that there are different ways to approach big mountain, which is part of what makes it interesting. Sage and Ian Mac both have different approaches, but both also have great fundamentals.
One thing we don't see often in movies is ledge to ledge technical billygoating. McConkey was incredible at this stuff, and it takes serious edging skills. Watch Something About McConkey if you want to see that stuff, it is skiing at the highest level.
the faster you can ski a really gnarly line, the better skier you are. calling other skiers out for their "form" while they get into heavier stuff than you ever will is pure bs
S.J.WThe real issue is kids who can cork 7 but can't even hold an edge on a blue run. That's the real issue here.
Also the people who don't show their stack rolls at the end of their edits (and who wants to see those??)
Just like no one wants to see an abattoir in operation or Concentrated Animal Feeding Operations, skiing has a dark side too. But until you see it, then nahh, skiing ain't broke, nothing to fix.
You look at all the injuries and wonder if there is something systemically wrong with ski technique in all its categories, and not just whitewashing the injuries away with that jackass statement "well it is a dangerous sport."
Also, "having fun" is a con-artist's line too when there are pitfalls all around you that you have to be wary of. Want to have fun long-term? Be as cautious AF. And how fun is that? Or have some know-it-all, dominatrix instructor's voice rattle through your head on every turn. So much fun.
ozzywrongCause it's ugly as fuck when people don't have good technique .. Simple and we should establish that it's unacceptable to have bad technique.
p-foIt's dangerous. People with bad technique are more likely to get hurt or hurt others. The stacked, controlled body position makes it much easier to absorb and react to unexpected terrain and snow conditions and generally stay in control.
A solid foundation will also help you progress much faster. I'm friends with a number of very good racers, and I've gone in the park with some of them and watched them learn stuff in a single day that takes jibber kids an entire year. They're in there stomping 7s first day because they know how to ski already.
Like Ozzy here, I skied moguls for a bit growing up and that gave me a great foundation, but I lost some over the years. Two summers ago I did some race training and generally brushed up on my technique, and the next winter I found myself skiing pow much better than ever before. It made a huge difference and boosted my confidence a lot.
I think some of this loss of technical ability is due to fewer soul shredders coming up. A lot fewer skiers, especially park skiers, grew up skiing nowadays. Instead they watch x games at 13 and head straight to the park. The involvement is awesome, don't get me wrong, but they'd progress faster and safer with real skiing ability. And there's no reason it can't be learned alongside park.
You know why Jonah Williams and Quinn Wolferman are next level good? They're better skiers than most coming up right now. I've known both of them since they were still young beans with Wasatch Project hiking in our summer park. They already knew how to ski fast and ski well then, and you can see where it's taken them.
TL;DR: if you wanna become nasty quickly and safely, learn how to ski well.
both of these are just so on point. Every one elses posts have either blatantly admitted they are a shitty skier or accidentally agreed with you. Sure riding backseat and slipping a groomed run because they can't hold an edge but ride only 30 days a year they assume they're the shit and dont think they're hurting their bodies. Go ride over 150 days with horrible form and watch how fucked your hips back and shins will be. I started skiing two years ago watched a fuck ton of racers, rode with an ex racer that taught me technique as well and I can out shred a large majority of these fuckers any day of the week outside the park, and I can hold my own in the park due to quick progression from understanding what needs to be done and how to initiate. Lots of hate in this thread but even when I snowboarded and had no clue about skiing I could point out in a snap anyone that could Huck their meat but not keep their technique neat and just look sloppy as fuck.
you can have a sick style and still ski properly. Not learning how to ski properly and getting super good at park is basically like watching porn as a virgin then going on about how many sexual positions you know.
Alvarothe faster you can ski a really gnarly line, the better skier you are. calling other skiers out for their "form" while they get into heavier stuff than you ever will is pure bs
I guarantee I'm a better skier than you.. So step the fuck back.. were you on the Batalla pro team or on the French Dynastar team before that no was I yes.. There is a point in this thread .. And the point is that people need to learn how to ski properly or skiing will lose it self. We need to teach people that bad form and bad style will not be rewarded and keep that going through History just like surfing ..
HoodlivingGo ride over 150 days with horrible form and watch how fucked your hips back and shins will be.
Go ride with perfect GS or slalom racing technique for a single day (let alone 150 days) outside the race course and see how tired you get forcing yourself into unwieldly body positions and note how highly strung you become mentally. At least with those chill park laps you can relax between hits.
baby_HCGo ride with perfect GS or slalom racing technique for a single day (let alone 150 days) outside the race course and see how tired you get forcing yourself into unwieldly body positions and note how highly strung you become mentally. At least with those chill park laps you can relax between hits.
Hey bud, if you ski proper its nice and easy to link turns between features. Then again half these kids cant even link a line together. Ski proper and you will have all the relaxed turns you need. Lets take 5 palmer laps then go straight to the park 88% of these skiers would cramp or have to take a break and smoke a spliff before they coild cause their legs hurt so bad from shit form.