The cost of running a resort is roughly the same whether it is busy or slow. Resorts don't need more lifties, more lodges, perhaps a few more patrolers, but really their cost of doing business does not increase. Before I moved to Austria, Sugarbush VT used to hold (and still does?) a day where a single day pass cost what it did in the 1950s. It is always their single most busiest/profitable day because tons of people show up. They get way more skiers than normal and make a lot of money.

Resorts don't need to charge 159$ for single day pass. They simply choose to do it because people will still pay for it.

Huck_NorrisYeah but Vail actually isn't even that good it's just Gaper Mecca and that's why it's hilarious to me. It's just where Texans go and that will never stop. It's the Stratton of the West- good enough to ski but nowhere near as good as people give it credit for, not is it worth what they charge for a day ticket.

I mean come on. Vail? That place is a putting green save for a few pockets of radness. That's why I crack up when somebody can't wait to tell you they skied Vail- the largest blue square anywhere. I know I was hugely disappointed when I went. It's kind of mind boggling that so many treat it as the center of the ski universe.

To you and me and most avid skiers, Vail's terrain is pretty tame and I agree, there are countless other places I'd rather go. But 95% of tourists love that stuff... Blue skies, "back bowls", impressive views, mountaintop dining, etc etc. The lift prices arent $159 because of the expert terrain offered, but instead because of the amenities that come with the full package.

Either way, I'll never pay $159 for a lift ticket, but don't care one way or another what Vail charges

onenerdykidThe cost of running a resort is roughly the same whether it is busy or slow. Resorts don't need more lifties, more lodges, perhaps a few more patrolers, but really their cost of doing business does not increase. Before I moved to Austria, Sugarbush VT used to hold (and still does?) a day where a single day pass cost what it did in the 1950s. It is always their single most busiest/profitable day because tons of people show up. They get way more skiers than normal and make a lot of money.

Resorts don't need to charge 159$ for single day pass. They simply choose to do it because people will still pay for it.

Get over it man...its $159 and they don't care what you think. Its supply/demand. If you owned a business and could charge 10% more for your products and still retain the same amount of clients you would dam well do it. Iv been to vail and am not a huge fan of the mountain...that being said many people are about what they do and wont stop paying. Lot of other close by resorts to go to instead

PeppermillRenoWhats wrong with you calm down the income the mountains generate in the summer is minimal.

Well stop being a jackass that just pulls bullshit outta your ass. The income made from the summer is not minimal and a lot of resorts make most of their money through summer events- specifically weddings. Fun fact: Crankworxs at Whistler was the largest attended event in a single day, even bigger than when they had the Olympics.

No wonder Reno sucks because its filled with a bunch of jackoffs like you.

PeppermillRenoIts nothing compared to the property tax on all the condos dickhead.

Not all mountains are the same some are far from hotels and don't have the lodge booked for a wedding every if an weekend. And some are 365 day a year resorts operating around 40% capacity who clearly can host that kind of thing.

Your main point is because hotels are at low capacity... wow, nice because most hotels and properties on the resort's land are not directly owned by the resort and do not profit from how many people stay. The resort (or whoever owns the land) pays the resort for the right to operate. You have zero clue as to how resort management works.

onenerdykidResorts don't need to charge 159$ for single day pass. They simply choose to do it because people will still pay for it.

KravtZGet over it man...its $159 and they don't care what you think. Its supply/demand. If you owned a business and could charge 10% more for your products and still retain the same amount of clients you would dam well do it. Iv been to vail and am not a huge fan of the mountain...that being said many people are about what they do and wont stop paying. Lot of other close by resorts to go to instead

Dude, man that's exactly what I said. There are people who will pay for it, so that's why they do it. They don't don't need to do it in order to cover their expenses, they do it because people will pay it.

If you have an Epic pass how does it work with blackout dates? Do you get a discount on day passes or do you just pay the price in full?

kshaughnI would love to see some data on your super arbitrary numbers that you're throwing out there. Assuming that your ridiculous statistic is correct, let's look at what that means:

-Let's assume that a mountain can host on average two weddings/functions a week. This is probably a good bet since no one get's married during the week and maybe the mountain has a corporate outing scheduled.

-Let's assume that a smaller mountain charges $5K-10K to host the event. Smaller mountains generally have less glamorous base lodges and accommodations, so that could be an accurate number.

Your last assumption there is completely inaccurate. Smaller resorts charge over that (and personally knowing the prices at multiple small resorts in New England will charge over double that) just to rent out a lodge for the reception which end at 10PM.

But no, keep on pretending you know something about this. Its funny. 300k for a whole summer of weddings? Try 500k for a month's worth.

JenniferGarnerYour last assumption there is completely inaccurate. Smaller resorts charge over that (and personally knowing the prices at multiple small resorts in New England will charge over double that) just to rent out a lodge for the reception which end at 10PM.

But no, keep on pretending you know something about this. Its funny. 300k for a whole summer of weddings? Try 500k for a month's worth.

5,000 skiers going up one day x $159 per ticket = $795,000 in one DAY. I'm not quite sure what point you're trying to make here.

"Total net revenue was $1,120.8 million for fiscal 2013 compared to $1,024.4 million in the prior year, a 9.4% increase."

"Net income attributable to Vail Resorts, Inc. was $37.7 million"

Well, they certainly don't have money issues

bibliography - http://investors.vailresorts.com/releasedetail.cfm?ReleaseID=793621

If I'm not skiing park, I'd still rather ski at Vail then anywhere in Summit County.

JenniferGarnerYour last assumption there is completely inaccurate. Smaller resorts charge over that (and personally knowing the prices at multiple small resorts in New England will charge over double that) just to rent out a lodge for the reception which end at 10PM.

But no, keep on pretending you know something about this. Its funny. 300k for a whole summer of weddings? Try 500k for a month's worth.

You're actually insane if you think a mountain will be making $500k a month for hosting weddings. Let's assume your ridiculous statement is true that they will charge even $30,000 to rent it out for an event, that mean's that the mountain has 17 events a month. There is literally less than a 0% chance the a mountain lodge is getting rented out EVERY OTHER DAY in the summer. Mountains will be lucky to average an event like that just twice a week.

Do you even think before you write these things? Because if you did any basic math and had common sense on how the world works, you would realize how dumb you sound.

RedPanda5,000 skiers going up one day x $159 per ticket = $795,000 in one DAY. I'm not quite sure what point you're trying to make here.

Hell even if the mountain averaged 500 skiers a day at $70 a ticket, that comes out to $1.05 million for the month. The dude has a bunch of oatmeal for a brain.

I_liketobutterIf I'm not skiing park, I'd still rather ski at Vail then anywhere in Summit County.

Definitely, but their park isn't bad and you have it to yourself. Plus, the more money a lift ticket-the more gaper-y the skiers are there. I know it's not true, but I can say with decent confidence that I'm one of the best all-around skiers on the mountain at Vail, I wouldn't even think of saying that at Key or Breck

NinetyFourIf you have an Epic pass how does it work with blackout dates? Do you get a discount on day passes or do you just pay the price in full?

The Epic pass doesn't have blackout dates. The Epic Local pass does. On their website it says "$59 tickets available on blackout dates at Park City, Canyons, Heavenly, Northstar, and Kirkwood."

But the epic local pass was something like $200 cheaper and most of the blackout dates are when I wouldn't be skiing anyway - Thanksgiving (im too busy to ski that day), over Christmas week (I was home visiting my family, so dont care), the first day of Sundance (I will be avoiding Park City like the plague during the Sundance madness), Valentine's day weekend (I'll survive not skiing those 2 days). That's it, pretty mellow and definitely worth saving $200.

DeebieSkeebiesits funny, all my coworkers at PCMR are just like "same shit, different day". no head mangers or supervisors left because of vail, no one got fired, and if anything, employees are going to get paid a bit more while having some killer benefits. They really aren't that bad of a company, but could be just a sheep that is under Mr. Katz' spell.

Yeah that $9.25 is super killer. Read the fine print on those benefits too.

kshaughnYou're actually insane if you think a mountain will be making $500k a month for hosting weddings. Let's assume your ridiculous statement is true that they will charge even $30,000 to rent it out for an event, that mean's that the mountain has 17 events a month. There is literally less than a 0% chance the a mountain lodge is getting rented out EVERY OTHER DAY in the summer. Mountains will be lucky to average an event like that just twice a week.

Do you even think before you write these things? Because if you did any basic math and had common sense on how the world works, you would realize how dumb you sound.

Right, because just hosting the reception in a lodge is the ONLY EXPENSE TO A WEDDING. Good lord, its funny seeing kids with zero knowledge of resort management to try and educate those who do of what's accurate and what's not.

JenniferGarnerRight, because just hosting the reception in a lodge is the ONLY EXPENSE TO A WEDDING. Good lord, its funny seeing kids with zero knowledge of resort management to try and educate those who do of what's accurate and what's not.

DUHHHH they make so much off charging 80 a plate to 80 guests duhhhhhh thats big money and as much as a days lift tickets duhhhhhhh.

Just shut up and admit you sound stupid Jenny.

JenniferGarnerRight, because just hosting the reception in a lodge is the ONLY EXPENSE TO A WEDDING. Good lord, its funny seeing kids with zero knowledge of resort management to try and educate those who do of what's accurate and what's not.

For Vail to MAKE $500k on a wedding it has to be an expensive as fuck wedding. That being said, look at their client base. Some wealthy guy could easily spend a couple million on a wedding in Vail if they flew everyone in and potentially vail could see a 500k profit (or 500k profits spread throughout the entire wedding production: food, planner, flowers, etc).

Needles to say I am a cheap bastard so I buy as little as possible on the mountain.

This season, so far all I have bought is my season pass and thats it. I was recently skiing at Sunvalley over break, tickets cost $110 daily, for the amount of time it almost made sense to buy a seasons pass, but I would have been 2 days shy or something like that.

Its math, I don't wanna have to explain myself here, but trust me, these ritzy resorts have you by the balls when it comes to passes and on mountain costs.

I can't pass as a little kid anymore too so that is shitty.

If you can bum the college deals, do so as long as possible, college rates are so cheap compared to adult passes and so worth it. If you just got out of college drag out the pass for the next couple of years saying you are in grad school or some bs like that.

KravtZFor Vail to MAKE $500k on a wedding it has to be an expensive as fuck wedding. That being said, look at their client base. Some wealthy guy could easily spend a couple million on a wedding in Vail if they flew everyone in and potentially vail could see a 500k profit (or 500k profits spread throughout the entire wedding production: food, planner, flowers, etc).

Just want to point out that the 12th most expensive wedding ever thrown was $1.6 million or so. So no, some wealthy guy is not going to just "easily spend a couple million" on a Vail wedding. You literally have the ability to fact check everything you claimed using google, a free search engine that allows you to access hard data, yet you spew some ridiculous bullshit.

VAIL IS NOW MORE EXPENSIVE THAN DEER VALLEY.

and I thought deer valley was expensive

FUCK YOU VAIL FUCK YOU

You don't have to ski there.

TrollerBlader69You don't have to ski there.

Yup. Vote with your dollar people.

onenerdykidPeople here in Austria are complaining that single day tickets are now 50 euros, up from 46. When I tell them about prices in North America they honestly think I am lying.

confirmed.

pimpcatJust want to point out that the 12th most expensive wedding ever thrown was $1.6 million or so. So no, some wealthy guy is not going to just "easily spend a couple million" on a Vail wedding. You literally have the ability to fact check everything you claimed using google, a free search engine that allows you to access hard data, yet you spew some ridiculous bullshit.

Yes, the 12th most expensive wedding where the people were so full of themselves they decided to publicize the cost of their wedding. Most normal rich people don't do that. You'd be shocked at how many wealthy families are willing to pitch in a half million each to throw a ridiculous event.

JenniferGarnerYes, the 12th most expensive wedding where the people were so full of themselves they decided to publicize the cost of their wedding. Most normal rich people don't do that. You'd be shocked at how many wealthy families are willing to pitch in a half million each to throw a ridiculous event.

I'd like to see his source...I guarantee there have been weddings that cost well above $2M. Hell there have been some people who have thrown bar mitzvahs that definitely cost well above that.

JenniferGarnerRight, because just hosting the reception in a lodge is the ONLY EXPENSE TO A WEDDING. Good lord, its funny seeing kids with zero knowledge of resort management to try and educate those who do of what's accurate and what's not.

Do you really think of someone is throwing a wedding at a mountain lodge that the lodge will be supplying the food? Yeah they are going to be serving burgers and pizza for the wedding. Everything else will be catered by other companies and none of that money will go to the mountain. The only thing the mountain will get paid for is for the location, other expenses will go to other people not affiliated with the company. I don't understand how you can even try to say you are correct when your statements make no sense. You say that all of us know nothing about resort management when you continuously throw out these claims that prove you actually know nothing since math and facts are proving you wrong.

We (RedPanda and I) also disproved your statement that the majority of the mountains revenue would come from this with basic mathematics and facts. If the mountain averages 500 skiers a day, they more than double your revenue estimates. But as always, you've ignored that point because facts have disproved your outrageous claims again.

JenniferGarnerRight, because just hosting the reception in a lodge is the ONLY EXPENSE TO A WEDDING. Good lord, its funny seeing kids with zero knowledge of resort management to try and educate those who do of what's accurate and what's not.

Also just to end this conversation once and for all with actual wedding package prices from mountains:

Sun Valley - Max $10,000

https://www.sunvalley.com/groups-weddings/weddings

Stowe- Max roughly $8,000

http://www.stowe.com/upload/photos/307A_Complete_Guide_to_Planning_Your_SMR_Wedding.pdf

Bear - Max roughly $7,000

http://www.visitbearmountain.com/files/603/BMI_Wedding_Packages_2013-2014.pdf

Bear and Stowe's totals do even include them bringing in someone to cater the reception and dinner (so some mountains will actually provide that).

Thank you for playing Jenny, but you have once again been proven incorrect with actual data. There is no way a mountain would ever total $500,000 in a month from hosting weddings and we have previously proven that a mountain can make more than $1 million in a month from lift tickets. Better luck next time.

kshaughnAlso just to end this conversation once and for all with actual wedding package prices from mountains:

Sun Valley - Max $10,000

https://www.sunvalley.com/groups-weddings/weddings

Stowe- Max roughly $8,000

http://www.stowe.com/upload/photos/307A_Complete_Guide_to_Planning_Your_SMR_Wedding.pdf

Bear - Max roughly $7,000

http://www.visitbearmountain.com/files/603/BMI_Wedding_Packages_2013-2014.pdf

Bear and Stowe's totals do even include them bringing in someone to cater the reception and dinner (so some mountains will actually provide that).

Thank you for playing Jenny, but you have once again been proven incorrect with actual data. There is no way a mountain would ever total $500,000 in a month from hosting weddings and we have previously proven that a mountain can make more than $1 million in a month from lift tickets. Better luck next time.

I do not need google to tell ya weddings cost way more than that

louie.miragsI do not need google to tell ya weddings cost way more than that

I never once said that a wedding doesn't cost more than that. I said that this is the amount that a mountain will charge to use their facilities. Obviously there are a lot of other expenses involved with a wedding, but those are not directly related to the mountain and the resort would not see the revenue. It's like you and Jenny both don't actual read what people write before you comment.

kshaughnI never once said that a wedding doesn't cost more than that. I said that this is the amount that a mountain will charge to use their facilities. Obviously there are a lot of other expenses involved with a wedding, but those are not directly related to the mountain and the resort would not see the revenue. It's like you and Jenny both don't actual read what people write before you comment.

k

I'm definitely going to use this in my business class as an example for inelastic/elastic demand :D

kshaughnDo you really think of someone is throwing a wedding at a mountain lodge that the lodge will be supplying the food? Yeah they are going to be serving burgers and pizza for the wedding.

Where did I write that? OK you've confirmed my suspicions that not only do you know nothing about resort management but you know nothing about weddings either. Just give up and hang yourself already.

JenniferGarnerWhere did I write that? OK you've confirmed my suspicions that not only do you know nothing about resort management but you know nothing about weddings either. Just give up and hang yourself already.

"Right, because just hosting the reception in a lodge is the ONLY EXPENSE TO A WEDDING. Good lord, its funny seeing kids with zero knowledge of resort management to try and educate those who do of what's accurate and what's not."

You mentioned other expenses, a large one of which is food. Also, I provided you wrong with the actual total costs for a wedding and reception provided by 3 separate mountains , so how am I still wrong? You have shown absolutely no knowledge on anything in this conversation and your only argument is to say I am wrong with no actual proof or reasoning behind it. I don't understand how you can even tell me I am wrong when I have provided actual data proving that you are incorrect, both in the price of a wedding and in the revenue generated from lift ticket sales. Good effort though.

It's true bro, you're just showing your ignorance with every post. See, you have no idea most high end venues also require catering to be contracted through them. The more you type the worse you look.

will_powderDay passes keep going up, seasons keep going down.

And the girls they stay the same age

Dude this is such a good deal for the locals...stop complaining. Epic pass for 700, local pass for 500 and 2 mountain pass for 300...this shit is unheard of for season pass prices. The 2 mountain pass is a way better deal than I ever got in college. Quit your bitching for real. You are stupid and the only ones getting fucked are out of towners who we don't want at our resorts anyways.

Alex_GDude this is such a good deal for the locals...stop complaining. Epic pass for 700, local pass for 500 and 2 mountain pass for 300...this shit is unheard of for season pass prices. The 2 mountain pass is a way better deal than I ever got in college. Quit your bitching for real. You are stupid and the only ones getting fucked are out of towners who we don't want at our resorts anyways.

Shut up you granola crunching hippy. Go smoke a dubie somewhere else when the growns folk is talkin.

Black.That's crazy wtf!? What do you guys reccomend me getting for a 3 day trip out there?

A season pass

ginLol you could get a single day pass to abay for 40 bucks

Well since Vail is about 5 times bigger I guess that $159 is a deal.

Alex_GDude this is such a good deal for the locals...stop complaining. Epic pass for 700, local pass for 500 and 2 mountain pass for 300...this shit is unheard of for season pass prices. The 2 mountain pass is a way better deal than I ever got in college. Quit your bitching for real. You are stupid and the only ones getting fucked are out of towners who we don't want at our resorts anyways.

Of course the pass is a good deal, that's the only way vail doesn't get run out if town.

pussyfooterOf course the pass is a good deal, that's the only way vail doesn't get run out if town.

I think you are being a selfish baby who doesn't like seeing others get a good deal. "PC hooked me up before so this automatically sucks." You trying to outdue Jennifer on sounding dumb?

Vail wouldn't get run out of town they are the leaders of their industry and would bring increased property values to the resorts since people could rely on the lifts not sucking and such. Yeah...people are just gonna golf in January because they don't like the coorporation who owns the hill near them. Or some gapers are gonna go to Jackson Hole since Park City and Vail are owned by the company they want ran out of town.

I like Vail my Epic pass was a great buy and Im loving the Mountain Collective that came along as competition Im on 27 days so far 18 of them in Aspen that doesn't happen without the mountains giving these sicks deals to multiple hills.

MCsugarcatI think you are being a selfish baby who doesn't like seeing others get a good deal. "PC hooked me up before so this automatically sucks." You trying to outdue Jennifer on sounding dumb?

Vail wouldn't get run out of town they are the leaders of their industry and would bring increased property values to the resorts since people could rely on the lifts not sucking and such. Yeah...people are just gonna golf in January because they don't like the coorporation who owns the hill near them. Or some gapers are gonna go to Jackson Hole since Park City and Vail are owned by the company they want ran out of town.

I like Vail my Epic pass was a great buy and Im loving the Mountain Collective that came along as competition Im on 27 days so far 18 of them in Aspen that doesn't happen without the mountains giving these sicks deals to multiple hills.

I'm not really sure where that first statement came from? I'm simply stated if they charged 2000 for their epic pass, get get more greif. I'm also not sure why you're comparing me to a troll.

I don't expect anyone to understand how much vail sucks when all you do is buy a pass and ski the resorts. Vail has made my job more difficult and it's even worse for people who actually work for the resort. I have no interest in arguing with someone who actually has no idea what I'm talking about and won't understand.

MCsugarcatI like Vail my Epic pass was a great buy and Im loving the Mountain Collective that came along as competition Im on 27 days so far 18 of them in Aspen that doesn't happen without the mountains giving these sicks deals to multiple hills.

Calls people dumb, doesn't know basic sentence structure.

pussyfooterVail has made my job more difficult

can you expand on this? is it cuz Vail recently purchased park city or whatever? what are they doing differently than Powdr?

momsspaghetti\

can you expand on this? is it cuz Vail recently purchased park city or whatever? what are they doing differently than Powdr?

Vail is restricting any media passes and I've heard they've threatened to sue anyone who uses an image of someone in their park for ads/sponsorship purposes. You have to sign a contract which states that any pictures taken on PCMR property is partially owned by Vail and is subject to 30% royalties if you make any money on them.

momsspaghetti\

can you expand on this? is it cuz Vail recently purchased park city or whatever? what are they doing differently than Powdr?

I work for the local tv station in park city. Its a sports and lifestyle channel, not a news outlet. We used to be able to go up to pcmr (by far one of our biggest clients) and shoot whatever we wanted whenever. We used to get great content with guests and locals at the resort and now we're not allow to talk to anyone and can't show anyone in a video who hasn't been approved to represent the resort. BaBasically we can only interview a qualified rep and we have to plan the most basic shoots a week ahead of time. It might be hard to understand how annoying this is for us, but vail is making it more difficult for us.

^Sounds like Vail is protecting their new baby. It makes sense right? It wouldn't be hard for the tv channel you work with to portray a negative image.... Not that you would ever do such a thing