Welcome to the Newschoolers forums! You may read the forums as a guest, however you must be a registered member to post. Register to become a member today!
I'm moving out to Colorado from the east coast and looking to get some wider skis. I plan on bringing 3 or 4 pairs. Right now I have Armada t halls (118-85-108) and Moment reno rockers (114-92-114).
I've narrowed it down to 3 pairs of skis I like and I'm looking at getting 2 of them, I'm open to suggestions though. They are the Moment deathwish (138-112-129), Armada JJ (126-136-115-133-123), and Surface new life (151-122-151). Overall, which skis would best help complete my quiver for CO?
The new new lifes are pretty stiff and the kink rocker is pretty buck wild. JJ's are softer and have only heard good things about them. I've also heard tons of good stuff about Moment as well, not that specific ski though
What do you like to ski? all those skis are good choices, it comes down to how you like the flex
dangler2470I mainly ski open bowls and chutes down into trees. I also ike skiing tight trees. I hunt the pow so that's a huge plus. Do the new lifes sometimes wheelie on the tails?
I would cut the jj's out of that list. They don't do too good in crud, so onnce those bowls get spec hopped up etc, they will get thrown around. Also they are roller skates, so they won't be to hot for chutes either.
dangler2470Do the new lifes sometimes wheelie on the tails?
Never heard of this... but it's defiantly not impossible with that style rocker. If you like charging chutes the new lifes might be your best choice IMO... There gunna be more stable
Although my knowledge of the Moments are minimal, so take it with a grain of salt.
I recommend you look into next year's Bent Chetler. Super stable when charging the crud after first tracks are gone, very playful in the deeper stuff, and they perform on the groomers incredibly well. They also pivot through the narrow tree runs like it's no problem. They're not at all like the previous Bent Chetlers if you've ever skied any of them.
chuckmartyI recommend you look into next year's Bent Chetler. Super stable when charging the crud after first tracks are gone, very playful in the deeper stuff, and they perform on the groomers incredibly well. They also pivot through the narrow tree runs like it's no problem. They're not at all like the previous Bent Chetlers if you've ever skied any of them.
I found a pretty good deal on new 2013 Bent chetlers. They're 192cm which I think might be too big for me. I'm
5' 11" and about 155 lbs. I'd consider myself an expert skier. The rocker will make them ski shorter but will they still be too hard to control?
dangler2470I found a pretty good deal on new 2013 Bent chetlers. They're 192cm which I think might be too big for me. I'm5' 11" and about 155 lbs. I'd consider myself an expert skier. The rocker will make them ski shorter but will they still be too hard to control?
There is a ton of more space out west then there is out east in the trees. If I were out east again I would not go above 185 and im 5'11 220lbs. You won't have a problem handling 192 chetlers out west.
dangler2470What do you mean by roller skates?
dangler2470I found a pretty good deal on new 2013 Bent chetlers. They're 192cm which I think might be too big for me. I'm5' 11" and about 155 lbs. I'd consider myself an expert skier. The rocker will make them ski shorter but will they still be too hard to control?
They are unstable at speed, and don't do good in crud.....also I am 511 and 155 and I love my 192 chetlers! But most people my size wouldn't. I just enjoy a longer ski. If you are actually expert, I would say go for it. They will take more work than the 183 size though.
At 5'7" and 140 lbs the 2013 183 Bent Chetler works wonderfully for me in pretty much everything except ice. They are actually decently stable at speed. You get the flappy tips going, but that's only on hard pack. You're definitely tall enough where you could handle a 192, especially with how open CO is. I skied a couple of seasons if VT and to be honest you could ski those trees with 192s and a little trickery. If you can get a good deal on the 2013 Bents definitely go that way. They are a super fun ski and the 2015 model isn't worth blowing extra money on in my opinion.
I would go with the JJs for sure if it's between those three. New Lifes have no camber so they are a more pow specific ski, whereas the JJs have camber underfoot so they will be better for technical lines where you need to make tight turns and that kinda stuff. I ski my K2 Obsethed (very similar to Armada JJ) almost all the time. That said, the New Lifes would work too if you only want them for pow days and will be skiing your narrower skis when it's not a pow day. If you have the money for a few pairs of skis, my leaning would be get the JJs now, bring those and the two pairs you already have. Save the extra money. If you don't have good boots, go to a bootfitter and buy a good pair. Get them heat moulded and get custom footbeds. If you already have good boots and all the other gear you need and really want a fourth pair of skis, wait and see how you like the JJs, demo a few pairs, see what terrain you end up skiing and enjoying the most, and then make your decision on what other pair you want. You might decide you want a huge pow ski like Surface Lab 001 or DPS Spoon, you might decide you want an aggressive hard charging ski like Dynastar Cham 117, you might decide you want something better for variable conditions like Volkl Katana. The Deathwish, JJ, and New Life are similar enough that you really don't need two of them.
Also, since you said you are open to other suggestions: Atomic Bent Chetler and K2 Pettitor (aka Shreditor 120). They'll be pretty similar to the others you mentioned. The Bent Chetlers have 60% rocker and 40% camber so on groomers they favor aggressive short radius turns, and with all the rocker they'll be great in pow of course. I don't really like them in bumps though. And the 2015 Bent Chetler has a convex base tip and tail, giving it even better pow performance.
I haven't skied the Pettitors, but K2 Obsethed (which are basically an older version of the Pettitors, pretty similar and both are K2s) are my favorite skis I've ever been on. Great for just about everything (the only exceptions being really hard/icy conditions and hard bumps).
I'm not trying to imply they are better than the three pairs you mentioned, only that they are alternatives to look into and consider if you haven't yet.
Sh4dowI would go with the JJs for sure if it's between those three. New Lifes have no camber so they are a more pow specific ski, whereas the JJs have camber underfoot so they will be better for technical lines where you need to make tight turns and that kinda stuff. I ski my K2 Obsethed (very similar to Armada JJ) almost all the time. That said, the New Lifes would work too if you only want them for pow days and will be skiing your narrower skis when it's not a pow day. If you have the money for a few pairs of skis, my leaning would be get the JJs now, bring those and the two pairs you already have. Save the extra money. If you don't have good boots, go to a bootfitter and buy a good pair. Get them heat moulded and get custom footbeds. If you already have good boots and all the other gear you need and really want a fourth pair of skis, wait and see how you like the JJs, demo a few pairs, see what terrain you end up skiing and enjoying the most, and then make your decision on what other pair you want. You might decide you want a huge pow ski like Surface Lab 001 or DPS Spoon, you might decide you want an aggressive hard charging ski like Dynastar Cham 117, you might decide you want something better for variable conditions like Volkl Katana. The Deathwish, JJ, and New Life are similar enough that you really don't need two of them.
Yeah I'm going to have to disagree on that first part. While the jj may do better on just straight groomers, they do horrible in chop. Which is going to be more common than groomers if you are skiing a pow day. Also they are too soft and turny to take groomers at speed, or anything at speed. So the added stiffness of the new life will do much better than the jj. Also the k2 obsethed and jj really aren't that similar. The obsethed has a 23m radius and is much more charging/play around oriented. While the jj has a 14m radius which is extremely turny, and is really only good for trees. Although I do agree with the second part. I would say buy either the new life for a pow oriented board, or the death wish for a variable pair of sticks.
Profahoben_212Yeah I'm going to have to disagree on that first part. While the jj may do better on just straight groomers, they do horrible in chop. Which is going to be more common than groomers if you are skiing a pow day. Also they are too soft and turny to take groomers at speed, or anything at speed. So the added stiffness of the new life will do much better than the jj. Also the k2 obsethed and jj really aren't that similar. The obsethed has a 23m radius and is much more charging/play around oriented. While the jj has a 14m radius which is extremely turny, and is really only good for trees. Although I do agree with the second part. I would say buy either the new life for a pow oriented board, or the death wish for a variable pair of sticks.
In that case you're probably right, I skied the JJs but it's been a while and it was only a run or two. OP, listen to this guy on the JJs. I stand by everything else I said.
AJizzleEverybody puts all this hate on the JJ, but I skied on it for two years and, while it may not be awesome in chop, it can sure as fuck ski all but the hardest groomers at speed.
I wasn't hating it. Just saying that in OP's situation, he could benefit from the other skis since he isn't going to be using it as just a straight tree/pow ski. Which is where it excels. The other skis he mentioned will IMO, benefit him much more than the jj would.
When it comes to powder skis I find myself wondering how many of the people here on NS just pull stuff out of their asses. You can't go wrong with Bent Chetlers, Pettitors, or JJ's. They are all excellent pow skis and their construction is top notch because Atomic, K2, and Armada are good companies with good ski presses. Like I said before, the 2015 Bent Chetlers aren't worth blowing the money on, though. Also we're talking about POWDER skis, not crud skis.
I haven't read all the posts in this thread but judging by your current skis you want something 105-112 underfoot, rockered and stiff for the mixed days of some old pow and crud + for charging hard. I don't know a lot about this kind of ski, but I often feel I'm missing it. If I can ever afford a 3-4 ski quiver again I'll get one. ON3P Wrenegade and Moment Deathwish are options you often hear about but that's all I can tell you.
Deep-pow skis wise, forget the JJ. One of the few skis I've hated. Recommended mount at -5 felt too far back for jibbing and moving the mount forward it skied horrendously as soon as you hit hardpack. The Bent Chetler is a similar ski but better in every way, it amazes me people still buy JJs since the Chetler's were released. New Lifes are a different kind of ski entirely, massive rockered jib sticks in the mould of EP Pros and Hellbents (but stiffer). Icelantics Gypsys, Shredditor 120s etc also fit this type but honestly, of the skis I've skied Bent Chetlers are the best. Again I'm sure there are smaller brand options we don't get in europe that I haven't tried.
jadavisWhen it comes to powder skis I find myself wondering how many of the people here on NS just pull stuff out of their asses. You can't go wrong with Bent Chetlers, Pettitors, or JJ's. They are all excellent pow skis and their construction is top notch because Atomic, K2, and Armada are good companies with good ski presses. Like I said before, the 2015 Bent Chetlers aren't worth blowing the money on, though. Also we're talking about POWDER skis, not crud skis.
I wholeheartedly disagree with your statement about the 2015 Bents and here's why:
They ski nothing like the previous BC models. Like I said above, they are much more stable at high speeds in every type of terrain than the earlier models. They don't make you feel like you're going to get bucked when you hit a bump weird and they hold an edge like no other when busting through the crud after the first tracks are gone. Granted, you could spend less money on another ski and be very happy, but I'm glad I spend the money on these skis because they are better in every way than the previous models. They're much poppier thanks to the SPV inserts and they charge so much harder. I don't have to work nearly as hard on the 2015's as I did on my 2012's. The ski does everything for me.
So OP, if saving up for the 2015's is an option for you, I would highly recommend you do that. They're stiffer than the K2 Pettitors and Obsetheds so they don't noodle around as much, but they are still very playful.
Depending on how you ski you could pick either the 185's or 192's. I would pick 185 if you're more into playful skiing and riding trees. But go with the 192's if you mostly do really big, steep lines.
I'm 6ft, 140lbs and I find that the 185's ski really well everywhere. But be sure to check out some other skis too.
That's my opinion on the Bent Chetlers. I can't speak for the other skis you're looking at but I just wanted to tell you what I know about the skis I'm on.
chuckmartyGranted, you could spend less money on another ski and be very happy
That's my point. Some old Bent Chetlers will save you hundreds and still be awesome. They are more of a pure powder ski than the 2015 model and if that's something OP is fine with, which I'm guessing he is judging by the skis he was looking at, then they would be awesome. Not to mention if you grow a pair, get some good form, and turn your DIN up a little you can send just about anything on old Bent Chetlers. Also one of the real reasons Atomic changed the Bent Chetler is that the market for full blown powder skis is mainly saturated.
I've heard the Praxis GPO is a great powder ski that rips hard. However it is 115 underfoot but maybe if you decide to get only one ski, this could be for you. If anyone can fill in any info on this it would be great to hear as I think I'm going to buy me a pair when my custom top sheet is ready. Basically,a great floating pow ski that can shred very technical lines and terrain (crud,etc.)?
jadavisThat's my point. Some old Bent Chetlers will save you hundreds and still be awesome. They are more of a pure powder ski than the 2015 model and if that's something OP is fine with, which I'm guessing he is judging by the skis he was looking at, then they would be awesome. Not to mention if you grow a pair, get some good form, and turn your DIN up a little you can send just about anything on old Bent Chetlers. Also one of the real reasons Atomic changed the Bent Chetler is that the market for full blown powder skis is mainly saturated.
I found a damn good deal for new 2013 Bent Chetlers 192cm for $250 shipped. The 2015 model sounds awesome but I'm mainly going to be using them for deep pow. I'll definitely be getting a pair of mid fat skis as well that will do better in variable terrain.
dangler2470I found a damn good deal for new 2013 Bent Chetlers 192cm for $250 shipped. The 2015 model sounds awesome but I'm mainly going to be using them for deep pow. I'll definitely be getting a pair of mid fat skis as well that will do better in variable terrain.
That's a ridiculously good deal. If you get some mid fats too you'll definitely be set. The 2013 Bent Chetlers are a blast. Buy them and get your stoke up for big pow next season. One suggestion, get some nice bindings for them. I tried to skimp on the bindings for mine, but the wide waste makes it easier to loose skis regardless of your DIN if you have cheaper bindings. The bindings actually ended up breaking so I mounted some old FFG 16's and they've been solid ever since.
Bent Chetlers in NW pow:
dangler2470I found a damn good deal for new 2013 Bent Chetlers 192cm for $250 shipped. The 2015 model sounds awesome but I'm mainly going to be using them for deep pow. I'll definitely be getting a pair of mid fat skis as well that will do better in variable terrain.
Stop posting and by that shit right fucking now.
Per your initial positing I would recommend the Deathwish and here is why:
Is plenty wide at 112 underfoot to handle deep days but is an absolute blast to ski everything when is gets chundery. The deathwish handles pretty much everything that you through at it and is fairly durable so if you are hard on your skis than it would be a great ski to get. With that said it can be pretty soft too but honestly I don't think that ever conflicts with the ability to charge on them check out what blister said here:
http://blistergearreview.com/gear-reviews/moment-deathwish[url]
The Deathwish is a great ski that isn't limited to just pow, which sounds like something you are interested in. However, if you are looking for a "pure powder" ski that will crush bottomless there are definitely more options as you get wider underfoot.
Personally this is what I did when I was in your shoes. Had a 104 underfoot ski, got the Deathwish the first year they came out and absolutely loved them…never really felt like I needed a wider ski. When this season came around I had the opportunity to add another ski to the quiver and I felt I had all my bases covered (narrow park ski, ~100 underfoot touring setup and ~100 underfoot resort crusher, & Deathwish. I figured the only ski missing were some fatties. Picked up the Bushywayne and never looked back. Although the Bushywayne (and some other skis in the ~120+ category) they can handle skiing conditions other than pure powder you would likely be more happy on something a little more manageable in those conditions.
Hopefully that makes sense a little bit...
the jjs are the tits, id ride them anywhere. that being said they are super flexy and when you get into the higher speed range they are a little bit unstable. the deathwishs are amazing heard nothing but great things from people who ride them.
if you are open to suggestion check out the ON3P jeffery 114s for next year. basically a stiffer jj. but since you are buying 2 pairs why not get two slightly different types of pow skis.
for example one thats a more everyday and all mountain type pow ski and one for the deep days. for that i would point you towards armada magic J(125 underfoot) for the deep days and something similar to the skis you already have picked out for the regular days(JJ, New Life, Deathwish, Patron, Jeffery 114, blog, automatic, shredditor, YLE, CRJ).
P.S. since im always on the hunt for skis, 4frnt is having a 40% off sale one all of last years shit, and the CRJ 188 sounds right up your alley. http://4frnt.com/products/crj
p.s.s. i do not work for 4frnt