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Disabling Up/Down voting in threads

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Mr.Bishop
Posts: 22671 - Karma: 75,830
We just disabled the ability to up/down vote specific posts within a thread.

For now, its an experiment - but if people like it we'll leave it that way.

Up/Down voting in threads was created to give us the data necessary to rank/sort/filter posts based on quality. These views were never finished, and the culture around voting became a signal of whether you agree with the post or not vs. how good it was. That was never the intended purpose... if you want to agree with someone, post up and state your opinion.


The plans for different thread sorting options and filtering were brought up with the community in various discussions and every time they were met with bitter opposition.

Add those two items together and we just made the call to disable them to see what happens.

**This thread was edited on Aug 4th 2016 at 12:37:43pm
POLL
Edit Poll
Votes:

Take care when editing a poll; Options should be similar to maintain vote integrity.

More options will be added automatically as you type. You must supply a question and at least two options. No HTML is allowed.

Jul 14 2016 12:35PM
31 72
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a_burger
Posts: 5206 - Karma: 20,187
J_SSummary of this entire thread:

NS site admins try to defend themselves against an army of angry skiers and miserably fail to hold a valid argument


more like: admins remove a useless feature that didn't do anything beneficial and children fail understand their valid reasons for removing it

You guys realize bishop has stated several times that they will probably revamp the karma system to replace it
Aug 21 2016 10:04AM
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arnie_grape
Posts: 3432 - Karma: 11,408
J_Smiserably fail to hold a valid argument


man you must be some new breed of super retard
Aug 21 2016 2:33PM
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fries
Posts: 2978 - Karma: 7,515
GORILLAWALLACEman you must be some new breed of super retard

oh shit you right lol
Aug 21 2016 3:39PM
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Shoey-Ski
Posts: 1649 - Karma: 6,190
J_Soh shit you right lol


I think you mean : dksbdjebgskdbdusbsgevhddvdhdhsjshsusjd. Lol retards can't form sentences :)
Aug 22 2016 12:08AM
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Deforestation
Posts: 1606 - Karma: 3,192
Does the fact that only 25% of people in the survey want to keep votes out have any impact on what's going to happen?
Aug 23 2016 3:12PM
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treebeard
Posts: 3590 - Karma: 1,065
DeforestationDoes the fact that only 25% of people in the survey want to keep votes out have any impact on what's going to happen?


loud minority
polls haven't been around long. older members who don't want upvotes probably don't use polls much. i know i don't
Aug 23 2016 3:20PM
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eheath
Posts: 61110 - Karma: 118,312
DeforestationDoes the fact that only 25% of people in the survey want to keep votes out have any impact on what's going to happen?


52 people voted....

the 33 that voted yes I can guarantee joined within the last two years and are the people being the loudest, while the 13 that said no are the few members that joined over 3 years ago that are the very, very small amount that even saw this thread, who have also posted about it.

IMO the poll is useless without 200-300 votes.
Aug 23 2016 3:24PM
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Julius_Steezer
Posts: 776 - Karma: 4,527
eheath52 people voted....

the 33 that voted yes I can guarantee joined within the last two years and are the people being the loudest, while the 13 that said no are the few members that joined over 3 years ago that are the very, very small amount that even saw this thread, who have also posted about it.

IMO the poll is useless without 200-300 votes.


Whilst it may not technically belong there, maybe shift this thread to nsg for a week or 2 so it gets more visibility and a more accurate survey?
Aug 23 2016 4:16PM
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Deforestation
Posts: 1606 - Karma: 3,192
eheath52 people voted....

the 33 that voted yes I can guarantee joined within the last two years and are the people being the loudest, while the 13 that said no are the few members that joined over 3 years ago that are the very, very small amount that even saw this thread, who have also posted about it.

IMO the poll is useless without 200-300 votes.


I'm not saying this isn't mostly accurate but I think it's kind of unfair to act as if the opinions of those who haven't been a member for 3+ years don't matter. I joined almost 3 years ago exactly but I browsed the forums long before that and I'm sure others have done the same. I do agree that the poll needs more votes but let's assume it did have the 200-300 responses that you're looking for with the same results it shows currently, my original question remains.

Julius_SteezerWhilst it may not technically belong there, maybe shift this thread to nsg for a week or 2 so it gets more visibility and a more accurate survey?


Agree
Aug 23 2016 5:00PM
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el_mn_op
Posts: 577 - Karma: 1,175
I almost want upvotes back now just for the sake of everyone shutting the fuck up about it. It seems like it becomes a point of discussion in every thread in SG and NSG these days.
Aug 23 2016 7:12PM
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-Dan
Posts: 7087 - Karma: 50,494
I want them back and I want responses ordered based on a combination of votes and how recent the response was made. Save NS
Aug 24 2016 8:48AM
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arnie_grape
Posts: 3432 - Karma: 11,408
TallxTI want them back and I want responses ordered based on a combination of votes and how recent the response was made. Save NS


here u go


https://www.reddit.com/r/skiing/
Aug 24 2016 1:35PM
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~Gotama~
Posts: 821 - Karma: 3,160
So I was pretty clearly against the idea of removing voting when it first happened, and I certainly stand by much of what I said earlier in this thread (If NS wants more activity, they should expand there efforts to attract users), however I have come to appreciate the removal of votes. As innocuous as they seemed, without vote scores I find myself more focused on the content of the individual posts. I think it is more true to the function of a forum since a more "popular" voice isn't emphasized above those which did not earn a high score.

Furthermore, and I hate to say this, but most of the people who were bitching about voting's removal were acting super childish about it and making baseless complaints without giving much reason for their opinion. Which isn't to say that people arguing the other side were immune to making shitty arguments and acting like idiots (looking at you, GorillaWallace), but the anti-voting side of the argument seemed to have consistently more legitimate reasons why they felt they were right, and included more of the members whose opinions I have come to respect in one way or another.

I like the sounds of an updated Karma system, where Karma can be given or taken away on individual posts without it being broadcast along side the post. That maintains the metric and small reward for posting quality content, without it becoming a competition within a thread to come up with a post with the most populous appeal.

And this is pretty unrelated, but I think if we want to #MakeNSgreatagain a big way to do it is through news articles. For example, articles like Twig's Behind the Edits: Glacier Days are super appealing (to me, at least) because it is professional, well produced medium that invites readers into the story behind the media that is becoming more and more saturated. 2 minute long banger edits from Windells and Park City are a dime-a-dozen these days, and I start to get bored after watching about 2 or 3. I think editorial articles are cool because they engage a reader for a longer period of time, and have more potential to A) stand out from each other, and B) inspire the reader to think and feel about what they are seeing. When people think and feel, they come up with opinions, and forums become the place for people to discuss their opinions. I know this paragraph is pretty off topic from the thread, but I just wanted to get that out there for those of us who have complained about NS's downturn in activity. I might make a separate thread for people who want to talk about this more.

So, to wrap up this very long-winded post, I'll just restate that it turns out voting in threads was bogus, and an updated Karma system would be more a more appropriate approach to what the voting system attempted. Additionally, front-page targeted content that is more engaging with readers seems like a good start to a Newschoolers Renaissance, if you will.
Aug 25 2016 9:48AM
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cory.iyoob
Posts: 736 - Karma: 5,370
TallxTI want them back and I want responses ordered based on a combination of votes and how recent the response was made. Save NS


As all the mods claim that only new and less core members want them back.
Aug 25 2016 4:01PM
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eheath
Posts: 61110 - Karma: 118,312
cory.iyoobAs all the mods claim that only new and less core members want them back.


As we said before, we won't be reddit, so his dream was already denied awhile ago.

And the loud minority has been heard, you guy don't need to keep posting about it. There will be a change again, but it won't be the same as before.

Rewarding people for downvoting people they don't like/want to humiliate and rewarding people who want to post just to get an upvote are not how we want NS to be.
Aug 25 2016 4:07PM
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arnie_grape
Posts: 3432 - Karma: 11,408
~Gotama~(looking at you, GorillaWallace)




https://www.newschoolers.com/videos/watch/836046/Frig-off--Barb-
Aug 25 2016 4:19PM
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-Dan
Posts: 7087 - Karma: 50,494
eheathAs we said before, we won't be reddit, so his dream was already denied awhile ago.

And the loud minority has been heard, you guy don't need to keep posting about it. There will be a change again, but it won't be the same as before.

Rewarding people for downvoting people they don't like/want to humiliate and rewarding people who want to post just to get an upvote are not how we want NS to be.


Reddit works though doesn't it? Pretty much the gold standard of the internet right now. For forum participation, NS's current situation isn't working.

And how can you claim the vocal segment to be a minority? Was there such outcry by the majority when upvotes and downvotes were introduced? If so, where?

And even if it were the case that so many people don't want upvotes, if they aren't posting anyway then why should their opinion be accounted for? Better yet, how could their opinion be accounted for? (;

Then finally, how can you so universally determine the motivations behind each person's use of the voting tool?

Obviously it's my preference to see it return, as stated. Regardless of that, I will always trust the judgement of those running the site to steer us all in the right direction. As it stands tho, your reasoning isn't lining up for me here.
Aug 25 2016 8:35PM
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a_burger
Posts: 5206 - Karma: 20,187
TallxTReddit works though doesn't it? Pretty much the gold standard of the internet right now. For forum participation, NS's current situation isn't working.


Reddit pretty much drowns out anything that isn't the majority opinion with it's algorithms, which is really lame. How can new trends start if they just get shut down at the beginning?

Their algorithm works fine for reading the news and commenting on it or keeping up with whats happening (which is why upvotes work great on the homepage), but it makes actual two way discussions really hard

At the start of this thread I was glad votes were gone and didn't really want them back at all but the other alternatives the mods are looking into look really good.

I think the real answer isn't that voting is bad, but that we can do better
Aug 25 2016 8:51PM
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-Dan
Posts: 7087 - Karma: 50,494
a_burgerI think the real answer isn't that voting is bad, but that we can do better


And that's something I can back. Just want to get some real Answers.
Aug 25 2016 11:00PM
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Julius_Steezer
Posts: 776 - Karma: 4,527
eheathAnd the loud minority has been heard


The survey shows more people want them back, this thread is about 50:50, the thread in nsg seemed mostly pro-voting the last I saw it. Other than the "old core members" who apparently dont really care enough to say much if there's as many of them as you keep suggesting, why do you keep assuming its the minority who want voting back?

Also if you want NS to be as great as you say, then opinions shouldn't be weighted by the members post count. So can we stop waxing lyrical about the good old days and how all the OGs of NS miss not having votes. Seriously, we get it. If you want these improved contributions and higher forum quality then start here by offering good ideas for potential ideas rather than slagging all the newer members off for disagreeing with you
Aug 26 2016 11:11AM
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.Hugo.
Posts: 17360 - Karma: 28,469
Julius_SteezerThe survey shows more people want them back, this thread is about 50:50, the thread in nsg seemed mostly pro-voting the last I saw it. Other than the "old core members" who apparently dont really care enough to say much if there's as many of them as you keep suggesting, why do you keep assuming its the minority who want voting back?

Also if you want NS to be as great as you say, then opinions shouldn't be weighted by the members post count. So can we stop waxing lyrical about the good old days and how all the OGs of NS miss not having votes. Seriously, we get it. If you want these improved contributions and higher forum quality then start here by offering good ideas for potential ideas rather than slagging all the newer members off for disagreeing with you


No one who wants votes has made a even half way decent argument as to why they should be brought back. All anyone says is because i like them
Aug 26 2016 11:33AM
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arnie_grape
Posts: 3432 - Karma: 11,408
.Hugo.No one who wants votes has made a even half way decent argument as to why they should be brought back. All anyone says is because i like them


"I want them back so that I can express my opinion without actually having one"

"I want them back so I can only read the best posts, I'm a very busy guy"

"I want them back so people can give me props on my lulz posts"

"I want them back so I can downvote mingg"

am I missing any?
Aug 26 2016 12:18PM
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Julius_Steezer
Posts: 776 - Karma: 4,527
.Hugo.No one who wants votes has made a even half way decent argument as to why they should be brought back. All anyone says is because i like them


And what's wrong with that? If a lot of people like something then why remove it for the sake of it? I can get behind improving it but atm its just been removed and so a feature which a lot of people enjoyed is just gone
Aug 26 2016 12:31PM
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Mingg
Posts: 13936 - Karma: 48,466
GORILLAWALLACE"I want them back so I can downvote mingg"


I miss getting downvoted
Aug 26 2016 4:44PM
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Mr.Bishop
Posts: 22671 - Karma: 75,830
J_SSummary of this entire thread:

NS site admins try to defend themselves against an army of angry skiers and miserably fail to hold a valid argument


what in the name of Jesus' balls are you talking about?
Aug 26 2016 8:02PM
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Mr.Bishop
Posts: 22671 - Karma: 75,830
TallxTI want them back and I want responses ordered based on a combination of votes and how recent the response was made. Save NS


Oh man you made me wet here. Finally someone that gets it.
Aug 26 2016 8:18PM
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Mingg
Posts: 13936 - Karma: 48,466
Mr.BishopOh man you made me wet here. Finally someone that gets it.


My only issue with that is it breaks up conversation and reorders it in a non-chronological way. If posts are ordered that way, they are all independent of one another. Where as when they are ordered by time you can see the flow of conversation, where it shifts and maybe even why it shifts depending on the conversation.

People in this thread are against votes because it seems to produce comments that are written in an attempt to get the most upvotes. If you reorder threads so that the highest is on top... god fuck there would be 10 times as much of that behavior than there already was just to get attention and to the top of the page... No one would ever browse, because you see what you want to see in the first 5 posts. It would be extremely opinionated and anyone who speaks out otherwise would go straight to the bottom... which is exactly the opposite of what I think most people would want to see.

Sure, the threads like the Unrealistic ski photoshop thread would be alright for that. Those threads tend to not produce much conversation imo though.
Aug 26 2016 8:41PM
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Julius_Steezer
Posts: 776 - Karma: 4,527
Mr.BishopOh man you made me wet here. Finally someone that gets it.


Could you have "sort" options for a thread as you would on a shopping site? So for NS, maybe "top rated comments- bottom rated", " most recent", "longest response" etc. I guess it could well and truly screw the flow of a thread but if you could figure a way to make a thread based on top rated comments (as tallxtee) said then I guess having a range of sort options would be feasible. Then everyone's chill with it
Aug 26 2016 9:06PM
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dbchili
Posts: 2555 - Karma: 1,657
Julius_SteezerCould you have "sort" options for a thread as you would on a shopping site? So for NS, maybe "top rated comments- bottom rated", " most recent", "longest response" etc. I guess it could well and truly screw the flow of a thread but if you could figure a way to make a thread based on top rated comments (as tallxtee) said then I guess having a range of sort options would be feasible. Then everyone's chill with it


Agree with this. It all depends on the thread content, and having the ability to sort would help immensely.

For example, in the Jane thread you want to be able to see the development of ops argument over time and him get roasted again and again, but in other threads I just wanna see the best comment

Also I'm sick of not having voting. Can we please bring it back already? This is like prohibition
Aug 26 2016 9:47PM
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eheath
Posts: 61110 - Karma: 118,312
dbchiliAlso I'm sick of not having voting. Can we please bring it back already? This is like prohibition


I can understand the aspect of sorting comments, why people would like that, etc.

But we never had that, so why do you want voting back? Can you give me a legitimate reason? you're an older member, you've been through both, why was having voting better?

Downvoting a stupid post or upvoting a funny post isn't in my mind a legit reason, but thats just me. Is this the reason you want it? or does this voting system actually have some merit? Because from my end here, I only see it as a negative thing and I need someone who's pre-upvote/downvote to explain it to me.

People might upvote a helpful post or downvote a hateful post, but what does that accomplish? the person making the hateful post doesn't care if they have 50 down votes, hell they might have posted a hateful post just to get that result, which is something we don't want. An upvote for a good helpful post is an ok thing to me, but what does it actually accomplish? the person knows they made a good post, guarantee someone responded to them with gratitude, so why do we need the upvote?

Why do you need a number next to your post to feel good about it? Why do you think someone needs a negative number next to their post so you feel good about it? These are questions that there is zero answer to in this thread, its just people complaining its not back with no reasoning.
Aug 26 2016 10:04PM
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MikeWeinerONE
Posts: 501 - Karma: 1,215
eheathWhy do you need a number next to your post to feel good about it? Why do you think someone needs a negative number next to their post so you feel good about it? These are questions that there is zero answer to in this thread, its just people complaining its not back with no reasoning.


This is beating a dead horse, but this is correct. Evan do you pay people for how much karma they have? How do I get on that program?

Who cares about votes. I come to newschoolers to catch up on industry news, read things, and post/promote video content. No reason for voting so little kids who are pretentious can hate on others. Way better to have discussion and read through people's opinions then some up upvote/downvote. When votes were there I didn't even really realize it or pay attention. I'm going to read what I think is worthwhile and don't need people to tell me if its good or bad. To each their own.

You kids needa stop caring about what people think of you, contribute content, and if you disagree instead of being a pussy and downvote then write it out. Who gives a fuck what your karma is? Unless your paying people Evan, cuz if you are I'm gonna start post whorIng to get my karma up. That way the next time my car breaks down someone on the side of the road will jump my battery.
Aug 27 2016 1:45AM
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Rennis_Deynolds
Posts: 2739 - Karma: 19,061
eheathI can understand the aspect of sorting comments, why people would like that, etc.

But we never had that, so why do you want voting back? Can you give me a legitimate reason? you're an older member, you've been through both, why was having voting better?

Downvoting a stupid post or upvoting a funny post isn't in my mind a legit reason, but thats just me. Is this the reason you want it? or does this voting system actually have some merit? Because from my end here, I only see it as a negative thing and I need someone who's pre-upvote/downvote to explain it to me.

People might upvote a helpful post or downvote a hateful post, but what does that accomplish? the person making the hateful post doesn't care if they have 50 down votes, hell they might have posted a hateful post just to get that result, which is something we don't want. An upvote for a good helpful post is an ok thing to me, but what does it actually accomplish? the person knows they made a good post, guarantee someone responded to them with gratitude, so why do we need the upvote?

Why do you need a number next to your post to feel good about it? Why do you think someone needs a negative number next to their post so you feel good about it? These are questions that there is zero answer to in this thread, its just people complaining its not back with no reasoning.


not that you asked me or care about my opinion but I have a few valid reasons why voting should be brought back

Personally, voting made newschoolers seem more like a close knit community of people, having the ability to rate posts made ns feel more like people were actually reading your posts and giving feedback on what you had to say. Without the ability to vote, it takes away from that feeling of validation, like posts arnt as meaningful without votes because you can literally say anything. Posts become less thought out and less effort is put in because no one cares , therefore, the amount of shitposting will increase without votes.
Aug 27 2016 3:04AM
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dbchili
Posts: 2555 - Karma: 1,657
Dennis_Reynoldsnot that you asked me or care about my opinion but I have a few valid reasons why voting should be brought back

Personally, voting made newschoolers seem more like a close knit community of people, having the ability to rate posts made ns feel more like people were actually reading your posts and giving feedback on what you had to say. Without the ability to vote, it takes away from that feeling of validation, like posts arnt as meaningful without votes because you can literally say anything. Posts become less thought out and less effort is put in because no one cares , therefore, the amount of shitposting will increase without votes.


Dennis has posted a lot of stupid stuff on this site (not news to anyone) but this is a quality post, and a post that exemplifies why having post voting is useful. If I could I would upvote this post, and so would many others, easily showing the mods the popularity of the opinion

Overall I'll give 3 quick reasons why I think voting is useful:
1. I love this site but don't have that much time to spend on it - between a full time job and actually playing sports, as much as I like browsing NS I don't actually have that much time to do so. Up/down voting helps me to see (along with other metrics) which threads might actually be worth reading, and beyond that which posts are worth reading once I'm in a thread if I'm just scanning. That matters to me and it improves the quality of my experience in the short amount of time I have because I end up reading better/more controversial content
2. Popular/unpopular opinions - I like to see what direction a thread is going in, and you can say people can just respond, but let's face it only a minority of people who view the thread will actually write a post, but allowing them to quickly chime in via a vote allows them to contribute an opinion and the overall popular vote to show through. I like to see what the popular opinion is, whether it's a new clothing company or why someone thinks tanner is a bad role model, I like to see what the majority thinks and be able to chime in myself. Many times I won't post because something similar has already been said, but at least I can quickly upvote that post as well
3. I'm a forum member, not a media member - I don't post videos or pictures, but I still feel like over the past 10 years I've made a relatively decent contribution to this site because I post on the forums. I post relevant and thought out posts, and my karma count reflects that. Without voting it wouldn't
Aug 27 2016 3:32PM
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el_mn_op
Posts: 577 - Karma: 1,175
eheathI can understand the aspect of sorting comments, why people would like that, etc.

But we never had that, so why do you want voting back? Can you give me a legitimate reason? you're an older member, you've been through both, why was having voting better?

Downvoting a stupid post or upvoting a funny post isn't in my mind a legit reason, but thats just me. Is this the reason you want it? or does this voting system actually have some merit? Because from my end here, I only see it as a negative thing and I need someone who's pre-upvote/downvote to explain it to me.

People might upvote a helpful post or downvote a hateful post, but what does that accomplish? the person making the hateful post doesn't care if they have 50 down votes, hell they might have posted a hateful post just to get that result, which is something we don't want. An upvote for a good helpful post is an ok thing to me, but what does it actually accomplish? the person knows they made a good post, guarantee someone responded to them with gratitude, so why do we need the upvote?

Why do you need a number next to your post to feel good about it? Why do you think someone needs a negative number next to their post so you feel good about it? These are questions that there is zero answer to in this thread, its just people complaining its not back with no reasoning.



I feel a sense of camaraderie with my fellow ns'ers when I upvote or downvote a post. Like by upvoting a post and seeing that others have also upvoted it, I feel like I've shared a chuckle or whatever similar reaction with all the other people who upvoted it. And downvoting, it's like a collective groan when a post has several downvotes.

Also, it allows quieter members to participate in threads. I doubt that getting rid of votes is going to get more people to participate in discussions, because if they weren't already, why would they start now? But having upvotes allows members who don't have as loud of opinions to say "yeah! thumbs up!" and participate in their own way.
Aug 27 2016 5:37PM
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arnie_grape
Posts: 3432 - Karma: 11,408
dbchiliI post relevant and thought out posts, and my karma count reflects that. Without voting it wouldn't


how do you figure
Aug 27 2016 7:03PM
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Shoey-Ski
Posts: 1649 - Karma: 6,190
Dennis_Reynoldsnot that you asked me or care about my opinion but I have a few valid reasons why voting should be brought back

Personally, voting made newschoolers seem more like a close knit community of people, having the ability to rate posts made ns feel more like people were actually reading your posts and giving feedback on what you had to say. Without the ability to vote, it takes away from that feeling of validation, like posts arnt as meaningful without votes because you can literally say anything. Posts become less thought out and less effort is put in because no one cares , therefore, the amount of shitposting will increase without votes.

This is by far the best post Dennis has made! I agree 100% with him
Aug 28 2016 12:01AM
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Rennis_Deynolds
Posts: 2739 - Karma: 19,061
Shoey-SkiThis is by far the best post Dennis has made! I agree 100% with him


nah I made this one post in a thread about vaping and made a photoshop of a fulltilt vape and told him to get fulltilts that was my best post
Aug 28 2016 12:21AM
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dbchili
Posts: 2555 - Karma: 1,657
GORILLAWALLACEhow do you figure


Because you and I have the same number of posts and my karma count is twice as high as yours....
Aug 28 2016 6:43AM
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SFBv420.0
Posts: 2539 - Karma: 3,124
dbchiliBecause you and I have the same number of posts and my karma count is twice as high as yours....


if you replace the word karma
with imaginary e cookies
you would see how narrasistically stupid you and the need for up/downvotes kids sound.
Aug 28 2016 7:39AM
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.Hugo.
Posts: 17360 - Karma: 28,469
dbchiliBecause you and I have the same number of posts and my karma count is twice as high as yours....


Arguing about karma.... jesus christ lol
Aug 28 2016 9:12AM
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dbchili
Posts: 2555 - Karma: 1,657
The referenced post has been removed.


Didn't know this tbh, but that's interesting. Kind of defeats my illustration above.
Aug 28 2016 2:16PM
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tomPietrowski
Posts: 7099 - Karma: 17,043
i have not posted much recently but i was disappointed to see votes gone. I only used to really go in the gear forum and threads there are usually looking for actual answers to questions. With upvotes it was easy for people to identify which posts were actually giving good advice compared to those giving bad or misguided advice. From the standpoint of new users the voting allowed easy identification of good responses which may not easily be recognized without some knowledge on the subject. Just my two cents.
Aug 29 2016 4:37AM
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Mr.Bishop
Posts: 22671 - Karma: 75,830
MinggMy only issue with that is it breaks up conversation and reorders it in a non-chronological way. If posts are ordered that way, they are all independent of one another. Where as when they are ordered by time you can see the flow of conversation, where it shifts and maybe even why it shifts depending on the conversation.

People in this thread are against votes because it seems to produce comments that are written in an attempt to get the most upvotes. If you reorder threads so that the highest is on top... god fuck there would be 10 times as much of that behavior than there already was just to get attention and to the top of the page... No one would ever browse, because you see what you want to see in the first 5 posts. It would be extremely opinionated and anyone who speaks out otherwise would go straight to the bottom... which is exactly the opposite of what I think most people would want to see.

Sure, the threads like the Unrealistic ski photoshop thread would be alright for that. Those threads tend to not produce much conversation imo though.


The key is threaded conversations. So the first response becomes the starter of a new "conversation" and then that entire argument is kept in line with the original response. Its like how Gmail threads conversations, if its all about the same topic you have it all together. It would never just throw a response out of chronological order, except for the first one which is simply a new thought about the original topic.

Does that make sense?

Dennis_Reynoldshaving the ability to rate posts made ns feel more like people were actually reading your posts


That is actually an excellent point.

The referenced post has been removed.


Well.... it actually does have a *little* bit of an affect, but not a huge one.

tomPietrowskii have not posted much recently but i was disappointed to see votes gone. I only used to really go in the gear forum and threads there are usually looking for actual answers to questions. With upvotes it was easy for people to identify which posts were actually giving good advice compared to those giving bad or misguided advice. From the standpoint of new users the voting allowed easy identification of good responses which may not easily be recognized without some knowledge on the subject. Just my two cents.


Gear would be the one absolutely best helped by taking that vote data and re-organizing the thread. Helpful responses would be at the top. Most really super successful tech forums (see http://www.stackoverflow.com) employ this for the answering of questions.

Gear above and beyond all else is almost silly that it doesn't re-order and votes are massively helpful.
Aug 29 2016 12:10PM
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arnie_grape
Posts: 3432 - Karma: 11,408
I think the closest thing to a win win solution at this point is to bring back votes but make the sum only visible to the poster, like someone suggested earlier.
makes the insecure members feel validated/appreciated without opening the gates to attention whores/serial shitposters
Aug 29 2016 8:42PM
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Mingg
Posts: 13936 - Karma: 48,466
I tried to quote Doug but it didn't show up. I get it but I'm not sure I would like it just cause I enjoy how it is set up now (:

GORILLAWALLACEI think the closest thing to a win win solution at this point is to bring back votes but make the sum only visible to the poster, like someone suggested earlier.
makes the insecure members feel validated/appreciated without opening the gates to attention whores/serial shitposters


Doug also did say votes can affect karma. Maybe the votes aren't public but you can still give or take karma for a post. (Karma isn't as important as i was under the impression of like 2 years ago but there is some value in it imo)



Idea #2: How about not having anonymous votes?

This way you can agree/disagree and it's not anonymous so being a shit head with voting is more consequential. Then those who don't have anything to really add to the conversation can still voice their opinion even if they don't post.



Idk. That's just an idea. I'd love to see a way to keep the basic format while simply adjusting the way it's used.
Aug 29 2016 9:37PM
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Cyanicenine
Posts: 966 - Karma: 2,296
Just wanted to chime in that I like the lack of votes. If you want a popularity contest http://www.reddit.com/r/skiing is that way --->. Actually wanting in depth discussion and not people clamoring for useless internet points is the reason I'm most active on geartalk rather than ski gabber. I'm a little older than some of the members here though, so I can see lack of votes potentially alienating many of the younger crowd who have gotten addicted to likes/views/subscribe/upvote numbers that seem to be embeded in all social media these days. Not sure what can be done about that, or what kind of compromise, if any, could be made. The hidden upvotes is an interesting idea, but I'm not sure if that would be enough to appease the pro vote crowd or not.
Aug 31 2016 5:50PM
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Julius_Steezer
Posts: 776 - Karma: 4,527
Why not keep votes anonymous until you up/downvote something and then that one comments votes becomes visible to you (and obviously the poster). That way you can't see votes before so there's no herd mentality but you can still see the votes after which will help show people how everyone else is thinking once they've cast their vote

Also if votes are kept anonymous then maybe display next to thread the total number of up/down votes cast (so they dont cancel each other out) so members can see the most popular/divisive threads when scrolling
Sep 1 2016 4:35AM
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