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What are some skis that companies that have discontinued that you would like to be brought back? For me I think that K2 should bring back the Hellbent (yes I know that they came out with the Powdabunga), and that Line should bring back the Lizzie (except in 183 aslo)
LelandBro98Klint Prime/Prime JR/Prime Rockstar. One of the best skis i have skied on, would love to see any Klint ski come back for that matter.
Not to make this a sale thread but I do have a pair of the rockstars for sale. They're mounted up with some squires. If anyone really likes these shoot me a pm
that is the 3rd graphic for the Thall, back when they came with pre rounded edges underfoot. Still don't know why brands don't do this as, well i do but still it was cool if you plan on riding rails anyway.
tomPietrowskithat is the 3rd graphic for the Thall, back when they came with pre rounded edges underfoot. Still don't know why brands don't do this as, well i do but still it was cool if you plan on riding rails anyway.
I've seen a few kids ride these and always wondered what they were. Super dope ski. Thanks!
tomPietrowskithat is the 3rd graphic for the Thall, back when they came with pre rounded edges underfoot. Still don't know why brands don't do this as, well i do but still it was cool if you plan on riding rails anyway.
I don't know why more brands don't take ON3P's lead in how to properly de -tune a ski. The amount of time and effort I put into it at home could well be an easy factory process for most places.
Rounding off the non contact areas is my 1st port of call now, then a progressive detune into the side cut.
LamafamaI don't know why more brands don't take ON3P's lead in how to properly de -tune a ski. The amount of time and effort I put into it at home could well be an easy factory process for most places.
Rounding off the non contact areas is my 1st port of call now, then a progressive detune into the side cut.
They actually took it a stage further. The old thalls actually came rounded underfoot ass well as detuned at th contacts. It was awesome for rails but obviously if you were not plannin on hitting rails it made the ski kind of useless which is why it was stopped. I would like to see the option with the smaller brands though. If you plan I hitting rails get them pre rounded from the factory.
just found a pair of these at the Whistler re-use it. soooooo fucking stoked these were the most bad asss looking ski ever!. gonna ride em this year they are nice and soft and the same dimensions as the E-Dollo.
tomPietrowskiThey actually took it a stage further. The old thalls actually came rounded underfoot ass well as detuned at th contacts. It was awesome for rails but obviously if you were not plannin on hitting rails it made the ski kind of useless which is why it was stopped. I would like to see the option with the smaller brands though. If you plan I hitting rails get them pre rounded from the factory.
Indeed, its a shame how many peoples skiing exp might be let down by having no understanding of how a ski tune actually works. Then again most of my friends managed a week per year in the alps and don't even own skis. One of them was slightly aghast when were were booking a trip to find I had ski luggage, fuck knows what they will think when I turn up with more than one pair...
LamafamaI don't know why more brands don't take ON3P's lead in how to properly de -tune a ski. The amount of time and effort I put into it at home could well be an easy factory process for most places.
Rounding off the non contact areas is my 1st port of call now, then a progressive detune into the side cut.
It really surprises me that other (small) brands don't detune their tips and tails. For big brands, it doesn't surprise me at all.
While it is a relatively easy step, you have to look at it from a value added perspective in manufacturing. Detuning isn't a huge process (assume 60-90 seconds per ski depending on model). This is one edge at a time, so I am sure someone with more capital could cut that time by 50-75% per ski.
For us, there is value added in our customer getting a correctly detuned ski out of the wrapper. Same reason we hotbox + scrap, spend a lot of time tuning our skis, etc. Our customer tends to be more educated and knows what they are looking for. Putting out a better finished ski, out of the wrapper, is part of our brand.
For big brands, with a much, much larger range of customers, there really isn't any value added in adding that step, as the vast majority of skiers won't ever notice. So, why spend the extra time/labor to add a step that most of their customers will never know was taken?
When we analyze our production, we always work on a scale of value added vs time. I am sure the big brands take the approach the same way. If the step doesn't add value in the final product or for the customer, it likely won't be implemented. The reason being...time/money.
One of our major focuses right now is production efficiency and lean manufacturing. If we can alter a process right now that saves us even 15 seconds/ski and produces the same quality ski, we will make that change. Every second matters, and ON3P is small.
On a large scale, that time really adds up. So, that would be my guess as to why some big brands don't detune at the factory. No value added to their product, so why add on the cost/time.
tomPietrowskiThey actually took it a stage further. The old thalls actually came rounded underfoot ass well as detuned at th contacts. It was awesome for rails but obviously if you were not plannin on hitting rails it made the ski kind of useless which is why it was stopped. I would like to see the option with the smaller brands though. If you plan I hitting rails get them pre rounded from the factory.
We are actually sending Filthy Rich and Presters out pre-rounded underfoot now. Not the same level we would send out to a team rider (which is hit with both a file and detuner) but enough so that the hard edge is gone underfoot. Our detuning method naturally rounds everything over, so it works pretty well.
Funny you mention it as an option, as we've thought adding that. If everything was made to order, could be great, but maintaining inventory with it could prove to be a pain in the ass (aka...sorry we are sold out of the stock FR. We have the detuned model though. Oh you don't ski park?...).
Even with our detune, though, if I were purely a park ski, I would probably knock the edge down a bit more. We have to find a balance in that some people aren't hitting rails on our park skis. It is certainly better than nothing though.
iggyskierWe are actually sending Filthy Rich and Presters out pre-rounded underfoot now. Not the same level we would send out to a team rider (which is hit with both a file and detuner) but enough so that the hard edge is gone underfoot. Our detuning method naturally rounds everything over, so it works pretty well.
Funny you mention it as an option, as we've thought adding that. If everything was made to order, could be great, but maintaining inventory with it could prove to be a pain in the ass (aka...sorry we are sold out of the stock FR. We have the detuned model though. Oh you don't ski park?...).
Even with our detune, though, if I were purely a park ski, I would probably knock the edge down a bit more. We have to find a balance in that some people aren't hitting rails on our park skis. It is certainly better than nothing though.
How long does it really take to detune a pair of skis? Could you not potentially leave them all sharp then when an order is made and a detune is requested, would it be unfeasible to have it done before shipping.
I think having a ski which will see rail use detuned from the factory is just another measure to help ensure durability. By detuning you know that when a ski gets in a customers hands its good to go from day one. I think if you could add it as an option it would be pretty cool.
tomPietrowskiHow long does it really take to detune a pair of skis? Could you not potentially leave them all sharp then when an order is made and a detune is requested, would it be unfeasible to have it done before shipping.
I think having a ski which will see rail use detuned from the factory is just another measure to help ensure durability. By detuning you know that when a ski gets in a customers hands its good to go from day one. I think if you could add it as an option it would be pretty cool.
You would need to stage the skis in an unfinished state, which could work, though really pains my lean-manufacturing sense.
The way to do it would be to stage the skis at a point in hand finishing where their protective cover remains and they have not been shrink wrapped. Once the order came in, you would add the detune accordingly then push the ski through serial number, topsheet pull, clean, then shrink wrap.
You could do it once the skis are in inventory, but then you waste the materials & time of the first go around to get the skis cleaned and shrink wrapped. From a production standpoint, it would be a bit of a pain in the ass, because you couldn't build in the planning for it, but you would just need to build in an expected window each week to account for the work.
So really, the best way would be to maintain a stock someone almost finished and fulfill be need.
In our current system, we track by barcode at around six locations within the finishing line, along with completing daily tracking sheets by everyone on the floor, so that we know what is where at what time and we can track the time it takes for parts to move between each checkpoint.
To implement this, it would require a number of system and factory changes, but it certainly possible.
Time wise, I would say when I detune team skis, it takes me 15-20 minutes per pair, but I go to town. Just trying to look at it by angles, assuming the side of the edge = 0, base of the edge = 90, I will file the edge at 30, 45, 60, 75, then do rounding passes over the whole range while moving the file up the up to even it out. I will then hit it for 5-10 passes on the detuner, broken up into two sets of passes to manage the heat. This is normally done from boot center +/- ~30cm or so.
This, again, is for team guys park-specific skis, so we want them ready to slide without any issues catching.
iggyskierYou would need to stage the skis in an unfinished state, which could work, though really pains my lean-manufacturing sense.
The way to do it would be to stage the skis at a point in hand finishing where their protective cover remains and they have not been shrink wrapped. Once the order came in, you would add the detune accordingly then push the ski through serial number, topsheet pull, clean, then shrink wrap.
You could do it once the skis are in inventory, but then you waste the materials & time of the first go around to get the skis cleaned and shrink wrapped. From a production standpoint, it would be a bit of a pain in the ass, because you couldn't build in the planning for it, but you would just need to build in an expected window each week to account for the work.
So really, the best way would be to maintain a stock someone almost finished and fulfill be need.
In our current system, we track by barcode at around six locations within the finishing line, along with completing daily tracking sheets by everyone on the floor, so that we know what is where at what time and we can track the time it takes for parts to move between each checkpoint.
To implement this, it would require a number of system and factory changes, but it certainly possible.
Time wise, I would say when I detune team skis, it takes me 15-20 minutes per pair, but I go to town. Just trying to look at it by angles, assuming the side of the edge = 0, base of the edge = 90, I will file the edge at 30, 45, 60, 75, then do rounding passes over the whole range while moving the file up the up to even it out. I will then hit it for 5-10 passes on the detuner, broken up into two sets of passes to manage the heat. This is normally done from boot center +/- ~30cm or so.
This, again, is for team guys park-specific skis, so we want them ready to slide without any issues catching.
I love your attention to detail!!
Really Interesting hearing about the production side of implementing somthing like this.
brotoON3P jeronimos. typing this across the room from my retired 11/12 jmos which outlived the griffons they had on em. i could still take em out if i wanted to, after nearly 200 days some edge ripped out under one of the skis but i'm not complaining. most fun skis ever.
My Jeronimo's got stolen the year they discontinued them, I was so beyond bummed. Just ordered some Kartel 98's though which I'm super stoked about.
cydwhitI do to. I'm still looking for a slightly longer ski that feels the same, such great skis!
They made longer ones the last year they made them didn't they? I might be wrong. Never had a ski that I could have as much fun on in the park and outside the park.
Had a pair of these babies back in the day, used to just look at the graphic as a kid and try to find all of the hidden shit in it. SO dope classic J lev design
kempswichI still have the 2013 alpha 1s with the space graphic on them and they're still kicking. my favorite park ski I've hard so far. I see some J whipits in the future though. are they fairly comparable?
Not really. Closest thing I've found to the OG alpha 1 is the moment vice. Almost exact same dimensions, but I think they have a tad more rocker.
I just came here to post a pic of my quiver circa 2009
Had a pair of hellbents this season too I think.
I skied the moments more than anything else, dope skis
Park Skis:
Dynastar Trouble Maker (BEST high end park and pipe ski ever)
Salomon Candide LAB
All Mountain Twin:
K2 05/06 Seth Vicious (98mm directional twin, add a little rocker to the tip, keep the burly sidewalls)
Rossignol Scratch BC (92mm version) This is a money all mountain jib ski)
Dynastar Big Trouble (92mm, stiff and poppy)
Directional:
Dynastar Legend Pro 105
Volkl Explosive Wizards
Blizzard 196 Bodacious (first or last season)
DeepskierIve heard they are a ski you love or hate
I can definitly see that. It was fun at first but it skis like a powder ski and was a lot stiffer than I was planning on, even after they were broken in.
