Notre Dame

saeb101Have u lived in the US

I currently live in the US

mattybaumsI currently live in the US

Then you know you know

saeb101Then you know you know

Ye I know I know the U.S is def one of the shittiest western countries to live in, where u have to pay thousands for healthcare, worry about getting shot going to school, and deal with people who still think the world is 6000 years old

mattybaumsYe I know I know the U.S is def one of the shittiest western countries to live in, where u have to pay thousands for healthcare, worry about getting shot going to school, and deal with people who still think the world is 6000 years old

Yeah I mean there may be better countries and the USA got a lot of problems, all I’m tryna say is that a lot of people take for granted what we do have in this country, there’s a lot of good stuff to be grateful for

mattybaumsYe I know I know the U.S is def one of the shittiest western countries to live in, where u have to pay thousands for healthcare, worry about getting shot going to school, and deal with people who still think the world is 6000 years old

yeah.. ok.

I guess you could live in places like the UK where the knife crime is so bad that they want to put GPS trackers in the handle of every knife and maintain a knife owner database. Not only that, but it's so bad that somalians are moving back to somalia..

https://www.bbc.com/news/newsbeat-47211971

https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2019-03-15/british-mp-mocked-over-gps-tracking-national-database-knife-buyers-plan

https://www.nrk.no/urix/mohamed-er-pa-flukt-_-innad-i-sverige-1.13138814

But seriously, why go to London just for the knife crime? I've heard every day is a nice day for acid attacks!

https://edition.cnn.com/2017/07/14/europe/acid-attacks-london-numbers-trnd/index.html

Or maybe stop by sweden where the grenade attacks have been on the rise for a few years. Better stay out of the no-go zones in malmo though.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_grenade_attacks_in_Sweden


I've lived on the east coast in the thick of Appalachia, the midwest where there's farms as far as the eye can see, and I've lived in the rocky mountains where people come from all over the world to work and live. I've never met a person who thinks the world is 6000 years old. Literally never. Not one.


You have no idea what you're talking about.

T.L.yeah.. ok.

I guess you could live in places like the UK where the knife crime is so bad that they want to put GPS trackers in the handle of every knife and maintain a knife owner database. Not only that, but it's so bad that somalians are moving back to somalia..

https://www.bbc.com/news/newsbeat-47211971

https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2019-03-15/british-mp-mocked-over-gps-tracking-national-database-knife-buyers-plan

https://www.nrk.no/urix/mohamed-er-pa-flukt-_-innad-i-sverige-1.13138814

But seriously, why go to London just for the knife crime? I've heard every day is a nice day for acid attacks!

https://edition.cnn.com/2017/07/14/europe/acid-attacks-london-numbers-trnd/index.html

Or maybe stop by sweden where the grenade attacks have been on the rise for a few years. Better stay out of the no-go zones in malmo though.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_grenade_attacks_in_Sweden


I've lived on the east coast in the thick of Appalachia, the midwest where there's farms as far as the eye can see, and I've lived in the rocky mountains where people come from all over the world to work and live. I've never met a person who thinks the world is 6000 years old. Literally never. Not one.


You have no idea what you're talking about.

No one is saying other countries are perfect, you're missing his points, so let me simplify things and summarize his points:

1. The homicidal rate in the US is much, much, much higher than in any other western country. Meaning the odds of you getting murdered in the US are much higher than in any other western country. Can you get murdered in London? Sure. In Sweden? Sure. But your odds are still much lower there than in the US where the rate is 5.35/100000, to keep your examples, in the UK it's 1.20/100000, in Sweden 1.08/100000. So we're talking like significantly higher odds in the US. Unfortunate, but facts are facts.

2. A lot of people in the US are extremely religious. I believe he was referring to some of these people who take the bible literally. Which, based on today's scientific evidence, is pretty hard to justify from an intellectual perspective. Not saying these people are idiots, but maybe they could benefit from opening another book.
Secondly, If you never met someone who believed the earth was 6,000 years old, then you're definitely in luck because we actually have plenty of those in the US! In fact: 38% of adults in the US believe that the earth was created by God within the last 10,000 years. Again, pretty sad statistic, but facts are facts. So while you may not have broached the topic with them, odds are you definitely have crossed paths with plenty of these people on your travels.

3. His last point was about healthcare being pretty fucked up in the US. You didn't even bring that up so I won't expand, I don't think anyone could possibly disagree with that, it is in fact, seriously fucked up.

Hope this helps.

Monsieur_PatateNo one is saying other countries are perfect, you're missing his points, so let me simplify things and summarize his points:

1. The homicidal rate in the US is much, much, much higher than in any other western country. Meaning the odds of you getting murdered in the US are much higher than in any other western country. Can you get murdered in London? Sure. In Sweden? Sure. But your odds are still much lower there than in the US where the rate is 5.35/100000, to keep your examples, in the UK it's 1.20/100000, in Sweden 1.08/100000. So we're talking like significantly higher odds in the US. Unfortunate, but facts are facts.

2. A lot of people in the US are extremely religious. I believe he was referring to some of these people who take the bible literally. Which, based on today's scientific evidence, is pretty hard to justify from an intellectual perspective. Not saying these people are idiots, but maybe they could benefit from opening another book.
Secondly, If you never met someone who believed the earth was 6,000 years old, then you're definitely in luck because we actually have plenty of those in the US! In fact: 38% of adults in the US believe that the earth was created by God within the last 10,000 years. Again, pretty sad statistic, but facts are facts. So while you may not have broached the topic with them, odds are you definitely have crossed paths with plenty of these people on your travels.

3. His last point was about healthcare being pretty fucked up in the US. You didn't even bring that up so I won't expand, I don't think anyone could possibly disagree with that, it is in fact, seriously fucked up.

Hope this helps.

1. Don't wanna get murdered in the US? Don't live in a big city that's been run into the ground by shit politicians for decades. Simple enough.

2. "A few people, somewhere, believe something, and that alarms me." Not an argument, but ok. I don't buy that stat from gallup even a little bit. Regardless, people who might believe that sure as hell aren't the ones shooting up Chicago every day. They're harmless and minding their own stupid, make believe business. At least our religious people aren't throwing gays off buildings, beheading teenage girls, and splitting children in half at shopping malls with trucks.

3. Healthcare is broken. No one in America with an iq higher than 4 would argue with that. That's why I didn't bring it up in a thread about notre dame burning down.. but yes, I agree, it's really fucked up that the government wants to charge me more for health insurance than I get it for independently.

Can we change this thread from RIP Notre Dame to Rip US Healthcare?

mattybaumsYe I know I know the U.S is def one of the shittiest western countries to live in, where u have to pay thousands for healthcare, worry about getting shot going to school, and deal with people who still think the world is 6000 years old

My parents have lived in Spain, France, Italy, and many places in the United States. Ya, the USA has a bad healthcare system, but I have never gone to school worrying about being shot, or anything close. The USA has a very large population, ( 5 times as much as France), but France has more terrorist attacks than the USA per capita. USA may have more mass shootings, but France has its own problems. The opportunity in the USA is much higher. France's middle class is much more poor than the United States. Finding jobs in France, Italy, and Europe is much harder than the USA. People are more dependant on the government in France. The USA is also much more scenic and free. I live in Boise, Idaho and I can drive 10 minutes to go shoot guns. Bet you cant do that in france. Me and my friends have burnt like 3 acres of goverment land from fireworks and building bombs. Bet you can't do that in France.

I don’t think the French really wanna be going around blowing up there land and shooting shit

PhreeKandiMy parents have lived in Spain, France, Italy, and many places in the United States. Ya, the USA has a bad healthcare system, but I have never gone to school worrying about being shot, or anything close. The USA has a very large population, ( 5 times as much as France), but France has more terrorist attacks than the USA per capita. USA may have more mass shootings, but France has its own problems. The opportunity in the USA is much higher. France's middle class is much more poor than the United States. Finding jobs in France, Italy, and Europe is much harder than the USA. People are more dependant on the government in France. The USA is also much more scenic and free. I live in Boise, Idaho and I can drive 10 minutes to go shoot guns. Bet you cant do that in france. Me and my friends have burnt like 3 acres of goverment land from fireworks and building bombs. Bet you can't do that in France.

mattybaumsI don’t think the French really wanna be going around blowing up there land and shooting shit

Outstanding reply

PhreeKandiOutstanding reply

As a European myself this was a serious response. Guns and shit aren’t part of our culture which is why we don’t go around shooting shit and blowing things up for fun unless ur Russian

mattybaumsI don’t think the French really wanna be going around blowing up there land and shooting shit

Ya your right, they just wanna live off the government.

mattybaumsAs a European myself this was a serious response. Guns and shit aren’t part of our culture which is why we don’t go around shooting shit and blowing things up for fun unless ur Russian

At least we have the option to in America.

PhreeKandiAt least we have the option to in America.

It’s not an option I want it leads to higher murder rates and mass shootings.

mattybaumsIt’s not an option I want it leads to higher murder rates and mass shootings.

And self defense. I agree, who would want to be able to defend themselves. Sounds like too much work, especially when the government provides everything I need for me. Ya! In France we can all be poor and call it middle class because everyone is poor!

Also the USA has way better skiing than France no doubt. So if you like skiing then USA all the way.

T.L.1. Don't wanna get murdered in the US? Don't live in a big city that's been run into the ground by shit politicians for decades. Simple enough.

2. "A few people, somewhere, believe something, and that alarms me." Not an argument, but ok. I don't buy that stat from gallup even a little bit. Regardless, people who might believe that sure as hell aren't the ones shooting up Chicago every day. They're harmless and minding their own stupid, make believe business. At least our religious people aren't throwing gays off buildings, beheading teenage girls, and splitting children in half at shopping malls with trucks.

3. Healthcare is broken. No one in America with an iq higher than 4 would argue with that. That's why I didn't bring it up in a thread about notre dame burning down.. but yes, I agree, it's really fucked up that the government wants to charge me more for health insurance than I get it for independently.

1. That applies to any major city, in any country, crime is always lower in the countryside, and higher in large cities. Just like that London knife crime stat you cherry picked. Bottom line is homicide rate is higher in the US than in any other western country, so odds of being murdered are higher in the US, period. Not trying to start a gun debate or debate the reasons for that, but the fact remains.

2. I'm sorry you don't like that stat, but I'll go and trust the established and trusted polling company over your "feelings" and anecdotal evidence.
You saying these people are "harmless" is missing the point. Again, no one was saying these people are worse than those who "behead teenagers", stay focused please, he was just listing things he dislikes about the US, and people with extreme religious views such as believing the earth was created by God a few thousands of years ago is one of those things he doesn't like much about the US culture. Again, you may not like it, but these views definitely exist in the US, as polling data shows.

PhreeKandiMy parents have lived in Spain...

I'm going to go out on a limb and assume you're still quite young to make such an argument, one can only hope that when you reach voting age you'll realize freedom isn't limited to the ability to burn public lands, and that is actually absolutely not what freedom is about. This being the internet and all, I'll waste a couple of minutes explaining a few things:

- "I have never gone to school worrying about being shot, or anything close" Good for you, but again stats show that a kid is increasingly more likely to get killed going to school in the US than in Europe, that was his point, and that is simply a fact. Your "feelings" don't matter when debating factual evidence.
- "The USA has a very large population, ( 5 times as much as France), but France has more terrorist attacks than the USA per capita". That is again, factually incorrect. There is the GTI (global terrorism index) which aims to provide insights into which countries suffer the most from terrorism and they publish data updated annually. If we take the last 10 years, the US had a higher GTI than France 6/10 years, including 2018, for which the US ranked 20th and France 30th.
- "France has its own problems" Oh yes, let's agree there, every country has their problems.
- "The opportunity in the USA is much higher" I would agree too!
- "France's middle class is much more poor than the United States" I would disagree here, based on statistics the median wealth per adult is higher in France than in the US, but the average wealth is higher in the US than in France. Which highlight higher wealth disparities in the US than in France.
- "Finding jobs in France, Italy, and Europe is much harder than the USA" I would say yes, but it goes both ways, meaning you have better job safety in Europe than in the US, once you do get a job, as an employee you can't get laid off as easily, so it's mostly because the system is set up differently, so I'd nuanced your statement but overall I'll give you that one too.
- "People are more dependant on the government in France." Yes, and I don't think it's necessarily a bad thing, people pay more taxes and in exchange, the government does more for them in terms of social security: healthcare, unemployment, education, etc. So it's just a different system, where society has a whole is trying to provide a safety net for everyone. It's the way people want it to be, so good for them.
- "The USA is also much more scenic and free". Freedom can be evaluated from a variety of perspectives (economic, political, social, etc.) so it all depends on what people value I guess. One could argue that your freedom to shoot guns and blow shit up takes away some people's freedom to simply live due to high gun violence and related deaths. One could also argue that the French enjoy the freedom to not worry about healthcare or drink alcohol in the street, or something else. The Freedom House rankings say France is free-er than the US, but I think it's pretty close and all in all both countries are pretty damn free and having lived in both country, I'll add my own anecdotal evidence to say that the freedom is similar in both countries and it depends on what aspects you value most, so it's a toss-up.
Regarding the US being more scenic, sorry but no, France is the most visited country in the world and has some pretty amazing scenery while being smaller than Texas, so no, France is absolutely beautiful both from a natural and architecture standpoint, but again that one really depends on personal preference.

Monsieur_Patate1. That applies to any major city, in any country, crime is always lower in the countryside, and higher in large cities. Just like that London knife crime stat you cherry picked. Bottom line is homicide rate is higher in the US than in any other western country, so odds of being murdered are higher in the US, period. Not trying to start a gun debate or debate the reasons for that, but the fact remains.

2. I'm sorry you don't like that stat, but I'll go and trust the established and trusted polling company over your "feelings" and anecdotal evidence.
You saying these people are "harmless" is missing the point. Again, no one was saying these people are worse than those who "behead teenagers", stay focused please, he was just listing things he dislikes about the US, and people with extreme religious views such as believing the earth was created by God a few thousands of years ago is one of those things he doesn't like much about the US culture. Again, you may not like it, but these views definitely exist in the US, as polling data shows.



I'm going to go out on a limb and assume you're still quite young to make such an argument, one can only hope that when you reach voting age you'll realize freedom isn't limited to the ability to burn public lands, and that is actually absolutely not what freedom is about. This being the internet and all, I'll waste a couple of minutes explaining a few things:

- "I have never gone to school worrying about being shot, or anything close" Good for you, but again stats show that a kid is increasingly more likely to get killed going to school in the US than in Europe, that was his point, and that is simply a fact. Your "feelings" don't matter when debating factual evidence.
- "The USA has a very large population, ( 5 times as much as France), but France has more terrorist attacks than the USA per capita". That is again, factually incorrect. There is the GTI (global terrorism index) which aims to provide insights into which countries suffer the most from terrorism and they publish data updated annually. If we take the last 10 years, the US had a higher GTI than France 6/10 years, including 2018, for which the US ranked 20th and France 30th.
- "France has its own problems" Oh yes, let's agree there, every country has their problems.
- "The opportunity in the USA is much higher" I would agree too!
- "France's middle class is much more poor than the United States" I would disagree here, based on statistics the median wealth per adult is higher in France than in the US, but the average wealth is higher in the US than in France. Which highlight higher wealth disparities in the US than in France.
- "Finding jobs in France, Italy, and Europe is much harder than the USA" I would say yes, but it goes both ways, meaning you have better job safety in Europe than in the US, once you do get a job, as an employee you can't get laid off as easily, so it's mostly because the system is set up differently, so I'd nuanced your statement but overall I'll give you that one too.
- "People are more dependant on the government in France." Yes, and I don't think it's necessarily a bad thing, people pay more taxes and in exchange, the government does more for them in terms of social security: healthcare, unemployment, education, etc. So it's just a different system, where society has a whole is trying to provide a safety net for everyone. It's the way people want it to be, so good for them.
- "The USA is also much more scenic and free". Freedom can be evaluated from a variety of perspectives (economic, political, social, etc.) so it all depends on what people value I guess. One could argue that your freedom to shoot guns and blow shit up takes away some people's freedom to simply live due to high gun violence and related deaths. One could also argue that the French enjoy the freedom to not worry about healthcare or drink alcohol in the street, or something else. The Freedom House rankings say France is free-er than the US, but I think it's pretty close and all in all both countries are pretty damn free and having lived in both country, I'll add my own anecdotal evidence to say that the freedom is similar in both countries and it depends on what aspects you value most, so it's a toss-up.
Regarding the US being more scenic, sorry but no, France is the most visited country in the world and has some pretty amazing scenery while being smaller than Texas, so no, France is absolutely beautiful both from a natural and architecture standpoint, but again that one really depends on personal preference.

I never said France was w bad place to live. It's a developed country and tbh you have to be pretty grateful to be born into any developed country. I just hate when people try to make it sound like America is some awful country where kids are getting shot left and right, which in reality is far from true.