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Charlie Hebdo shooting: eleven dead at Paris offices of satirical magazine

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Laurent.
Posts: 10054 - Karma: 25,277
The Guardian Liveblog.

CNBC Article.

Independent Article

Gunmen have attacked the Paris office of French satirical magazine Charlie Hebdo, killing 11 people and injuring 10, French officials say.
Witnesses spoke of sustained gunfire at the office as the attackers opened fire with assault rifles before escaping.
President Francois Hollande said there was no doubt it had been a terrorist attack "of exceptional barbarity".
A major police operation has been launched in the Paris area to catch the attackers.

Charlie's latest tweet was a cartoon of the Islamic State militant group leader, Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi.
The satirical weekly has courted controversy in the past with its irreverent take on news and current affairs.
The magazine was fire-bombed in November 2011 a day after it carried a caricature of the Prophet Muhammad.
People had been "murdered in a cowardly manner", President Hollande told reporters at the scene. "We are threatened because we are a country of liberty," he added, appealing for national unity.
UK Prime Minister David Cameron said in a tweet: "The murders in Paris are sickening. We stand with the French people in the fight against terror and defending the freedom of the press."



'Black-hooded men'

Two of those killed are police officers, France's AFP news agency reports, and five of those wounded are critically injured.
An eyewitness, Benoit Bringer, told French TV channel Itele: "Two black-hooded men entered the building with Kalashnikovs.
"A few minutes later we heard lots of shots."
The men were then seen fleeing the building.
"It's carnage," French police official Luc Poignant told another French channel, BFMTV.
Police have warned French media to be on alert and pay attention to security following the attack.

News extract from BBC
Jan 7 2015 7:29AM
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Laurent.
Posts: 10054 - Karma: 25,277
Amsterdam this evening gathered for Charlie.

Jan 8 2015 7:13PM
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fresh_prince
Posts: 993 - Karma: 11,910
The world would be a better place without religions
Jan 8 2015 8:00PM
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howlongcanausern
Posts: 4982 - Karma: 1,737
.MASSHOLE.I can understand the anti-Muslim feeling right now


it's not anti-muslim.

it's anti-violence, pro speech.


there is a 1 billion+ member culture that exists that opposes these principles...egypt, syria, saudi arabia, pakistan, UAE....how do you think women, homosexuals, those of other religions (infidels), and children get treated in these places?
Jan 8 2015 10:20PM
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Wampire
Posts: 1217 - Karma: 4,684
las.


fucking love that
Jan 8 2015 10:32PM
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SpookyCat
Posts: 1232 - Karma: -2,617
Wampirefucking love that


Yeah man, I fucking love cheaply made JPGs that make it seem fake, instead of posting legitimate news stories with accounts that are corroborated by other people/sources. Cause like, as long as the image looks good, who cares about verifying the legitimacy of it? Its all about the instant impact of the image/text, right?

I mean like because that's so different than the recruiting tactics of the extremists...
Jan 8 2015 11:04PM
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Laurent.
Posts: 10054 - Karma: 25,277
Apparently the police force have them right now cornered in Dammartin-en-goele.







JenniferGarnerYeah man, I fucking love cheaply made JPGs that make it seem fake, instead of posting legitimate news stories with accounts that are corroborated by other people/sources. Cause like, as long as the image looks good, who cares about verifying the legitimacy of it? Its all about the instant impact of the image/text, right?

I mean like because that's so different than the recruiting tactics of the extremists...


You are such a blatant unfunny troll, those are Charb's own words to Le Monde in 2012:

Pourtant, c'est crânement qu'il déclare n'avoir pas peur d'éventuelles représailles. "Je n'ai pas de gosses, pas de femme, pas de voiture, pas de crédit. C'est peut-être un peu pompeux ce que je vais dire, mais je préfère mourir debout que vivre à genoux."

En savoir plus sur http://www.lemonde.fr/actualite-medias/article/2012/09/20/je-n-ai-pas-l-impression-d-egorger-quelqu-un-avec-un-feutre_1762748_3236.html#qy5e6iCJMbDm7uBg.99
Jan 9 2015 4:08AM
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MLJ
Posts: 1849 - Karma: 3,649
Mr.HuckHahahaha. Says the guy from Canada which has about the strictest immigration laws on the planet. I will admit freely that I HATE Islamic extremists who kill people and oppress women and people of faiths other than Islam. If that makes be a bad person, I will be happy to have that discussion with God when I die.

You don't have to hate people who are immigrating from the middle east right now to realize that some of them may be Islamic fundamentalist ticking time bombs, and you should scrutinize them a little more than someone immigrating from Iceland.

Just because you don't want to have sex with a woman without a condom doesn't make you a sexist.

Hating Islamic extremists doesn't make you bad, but saying that they are worse than any other religious extremists, or even hating all Muslims because if what they do makes you a bad person.
Jan 9 2015 4:46AM
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Bombogenesis
Posts: 1984 - Karma: 4,006
MLJHating Islamic extremists doesn't make you bad, but saying that they are worse than any other religious extremists, or even hating all Muslims because if what they do makes you a bad person.


Ugh
Jan 9 2015 5:25AM
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JDA
Posts: 572 - Karma: 566
Another siege happening in Eastern Paris in a Kosher Jewish supermarche, apparently some gunfire exchanged before the gunman took a hostage -possibly more than 1 in the supermarche.

Source: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-europe-30722098
Jan 9 2015 8:05AM
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Bombogenesis
Posts: 1984 - Karma: 4,006
JDAAnother siege happening in Eastern Paris in a Kosher Jewish supermarche, apparently some gunfire exchanged before the gunman took a hostage -possibly more than 1 in the supermarche.

Source: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-europe-30722098



Reports are 5 hostages.


I can't believe that kid up there ^ said that someone was a bad person because they thought Muslim extremists were the worst out there right now. Have you not turned on the fucking news in the last 15 years you pos?
Jan 9 2015 8:25AM
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Bombogenesis
Posts: 1984 - Karma: 4,006
The hating all Muslims part is messed up yeah, but fanatical Muslims are way worse than any other fringe religious group out there right now and it's not even up for debate.
Jan 9 2015 8:27AM
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Laurent.
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Jan 9 2015 8:27AM
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maximiliaan
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And apperantly another man is walking armed through paris close to the eiffel tower.
nothing official reported yet.
Jan 9 2015 9:24AM
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fghtoffyrdmns
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This whole situation is fucked
Jan 9 2015 9:32AM
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theBearJew
Posts: 10951 - Karma: 15,633
maximiliaanAnd apperantly another man is walking armed through paris close to the eiffel tower.
nothing official reported yet.


I thought about that when they said somewhere around 1200 police were responding to the hostage situations. If another terrorist cell wanted to that was the perfect moment to attack somewhere else across town.
Jan 9 2015 10:05AM
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Laurent.
Posts: 10054 - Karma: 25,277
theBearJewI thought about that when they said somewhere around 1200 police were responding to the hostage situations. If another terrorist cell wanted to that was the perfect moment to attack somewhere else across town.


There's still plenty enough in Paris, they have a seemingly near limitless supply of policeman.

Jan 9 2015 10:07AM
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Monsieur_Patate
Posts: 1393 - Karma: 4,303
theBearJewI thought about that when they said somewhere around 1200 police were responding to the hostage situations. If another terrorist cell wanted to that was the perfect moment to attack somewhere else across town.


Don't you worry, there's still plenty available. You have about 20.000 police officers in the Paris area alone. Plus they could still bring in some from the other regions, or even bring in the army.

You also have different intervention groups, for example the GIPN and the RAID are currently working the hostage situation north of Paris, but the BRI is taking care of the other hostage situation in Paris.

Then remains the GIGN, the PI2G, UCLAT, and probably others I don't even know about. It basically depends on the jurisdiction, but all of those are intervention groups specialized in terrorist situations.

They can handle much more than that.
Jan 9 2015 10:37AM
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maximiliaan
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they started the invation in Dammartin-en-Goele where the two brothers are.
Jan 9 2015 11:04AM
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*SNO*
Posts: 2575 - Karma: 925
Kouachi brothers are apparently dead now and six explosions heard at the Kosher market....
Jan 9 2015 11:21AM
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Monsieur_Patate
Posts: 1393 - Karma: 4,303
*SNO*Kouachi brothers are apparently dead now and six explosions heard at the Kosher market....


Yeah, they killed the two brothers and saved the hostage.
Still waiting on the update from the other situation, but the situation is over. We just don't yet know if/who died.
Jan 9 2015 11:24AM
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Bombogenesis
Posts: 1984 - Karma: 4,006
Early indications are that the French police and security forces did an amazing job. So much respect for those guys.
Jan 9 2015 11:40AM
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Laurent.
Posts: 10054 - Karma: 25,277
AFP says: Five dead, including gunman, four critically wounded in Paris supermarket hostage drama.


Video of the assault at the supermarket by AFP:


https://www.newschoolers.com/videos/watch/747441/Prise-d--39-otages------Vincennes--images-de-l--39-assaut
Jan 9 2015 12:17PM
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shocker611
Posts: 2599 - Karma: 423
Don't know if this has been posted yet but I think it hits it pretty much on the head.

http://www.theonion.com/articles/no-one-murdered-because-of-this-image,29553/
Jan 9 2015 12:24PM
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J.D.
Posts: 21362 - Karma: 5,141
BombogenesisThe hating all Muslims part is messed up yeah, but fanatical Muslims are way worse than any other fringe religious group out there right now and it's not even up for debate.

It's actually a sort of difficult question. If you go by the math it's undoubtedly true - Christian extremists (whatever you want to look at as the modern KKK) simply do not have the sort of body count that is evident when we look at the actions of muslim extremists. And although Jewish extremism in the middle east has certainly produced some atrocities, again, just on a pure numbers basis it doesn't compare.

But on the other hand, is the result what makes a form of religious extremism bad? There are plenty of Christian extremists who, if they could, would kill all homosexuals, stem cell researchers, even cosmologists who dare to question their version of God as the source of all (irony abounds) morality and goodness. Does the difference really just the fact that one sect has the means to carry out their evil beliefs make them inherently worse? I'm not sure it does.

It's really a pointless debate, though. Rather than comparing Muslim extremism to Jewish or Christian extremism, just let's say that religious extremism is the source of the problem here and skip the singling out of one particular group, because they're all enjoining or committing terrible acts in the name of their faith. In light of that it hardly matters what book they say is most important, does it?
Jan 9 2015 12:25PM
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Mr.Huck
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I know I am going to get more hate for this, but I hope every country starts taking this threat more seriously. These guys were on the radar of French Anti-terrorism (not sure what they call them). They knew that the older brother went to an Al Qaeda training camp. People don't go there to learn how to properly position their prayer rugs.

At the very least they should have had their passports revoked. I know everybody gets butt hurt when they think governments are trampling on civil liberties, but civil liberties also include the right to go to work and not be gunned down in your office along with you coworkers by religious extremists that your government has already determined to be a threat. Not saying that all of these attacks are preventable, or that I know the solution but governments have to recognize that the PC, kind and gentle approach isn't working.

It is not all Muslims, but there are those who believe in a very specific interpretation, and they believe that anyone who does not share their specific belief must be killed. They dismiss the concept of tolerance. If they managed to kill off all the Christians, Jews, Hindus, Buddhists, etc; they would then begin exterminating all moderate Muslims.

I can't think of any other time in history or any other culture that has wanted to rid everyone from the face of the earth who did not share their beliefs.

I know TLDR, but something else I find interesting is that the police in France have way more freedom than U.S. cops. They apparently can torture and beat the living crap out of anyone to get information. Makes me wonder why they aren't tougher on these guys when they start threatening attacks.
Jan 9 2015 12:31PM
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SKI.ING
Posts: 2695 - Karma: 2,535
Mr.HuckI know I am going to get more hate for this, but I hope every country starts taking this threat more seriously. These guys were on the radar of French Anti-terrorism (not sure what they call them). They knew that the older brother went to an Al Qaeda training camp. People don't go there to learn how to properly position their prayer rugs.

At the very least they should have had their passports revoked. I know everybody gets butt hurt when they think governments are trampling on civil liberties, but civil liberties also include the right to go to work and not be gunned down in your office along with you coworkers by religious extremists that your government has already determined to be a threat. Not saying that all of these attacks are preventable, or that I know the solution but governments have to recognize that the PC, kind and gentle approach isn't working.

It is not all Muslims, but there are those who believe in a very specific interpretation, and they believe that anyone who does not share their specific belief must be killed. They dismiss the concept of tolerance. If they managed to kill off all the Christians, Jews, Hindus, Buddhists, etc; they would then begin exterminating all moderate Muslims.

I can't think of any other time in history or any other culture that has wanted to rid everyone from the face of the earth who did not share their beliefs.

I know TLDR, but something else I find interesting is that the police in France have way more freedom than U.S. cops. They apparently can torture and beat the living crap out of anyone to get information. Makes me wonder why they aren't tougher on these guys when they start threatening attacks.


It will never happen with the liberal progressive mindset that everyone is adopting these days. I've said it in other threads, people have tied our governments hands behind their back. It's fucked because they yank them and nothing happens so it's unfair so they release them and something happens and then people complain. Theyre pretty good working within their means to prevent this stuff and France was on point in their response.
Jan 9 2015 1:17PM
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J.D.
Posts: 21362 - Karma: 5,141
Mr.HuckI know everybody gets butt hurt when they think governments are trampling on civil liberties, but civil liberties also include the right to go to work and not be gunned down in your office along with you coworkers by religious extremists that your government has already determined to be a threat.

No they don't.

This demonstrates a fundamental lack of understanding about what civil liberties are. They are a protection from tyranny exercised by government. Asking the government to keep you safer at the expense of giving them the ability to prosecute you for thought crimes is idiotic.
Jan 9 2015 2:02PM
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Mr.Huck
Posts: 6096 - Karma: 14,893
J.D.No they don't.

This demonstrates a fundamental lack of understanding about what civil liberties are. They are a protection from tyranny exercised by government. Asking the government to keep you safer at the expense of giving them the ability to prosecute you for thought crimes is idiotic.


Not ashamed at all. Yes, I should probably be more familiar with the constitution, but I don't break laws, and it is not something that comes up on a day to day basis. I'm a ski coach, not a constitutional lawyer. I used the wrong term. The point is that one of the responsibilities of government is to protect it's citizens. And I am not talking about thought crimes. Someone I was watching summed it up perfectly. I have the right to free speech, but if I yell "FIRE" in a crowded movie theater, my free speech directly threatens the safety of others and becomes criminal. Based on all the reports I have seen, these guys crossed this threshold prior to the attack and the french authorities didn't do anything.

What do you propose? Are you happy with the status quo? When they start blowing shit up and killing people in Canada, are you going to be OK with that?

Anyway, I hate these arguments. I hate big, overly intrusive government, but I guess I hate seeing innocent people killed by extremists worse.
Jan 9 2015 3:38PM
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J.D.
Posts: 21362 - Karma: 5,141
Mr.HuckNot ashamed at all. Yes, I should probably be more familiar with the constitution, but I don't break laws, and it is not something that comes up on a day to day basis. I'm a ski coach, not a constitutional lawyer. I used the wrong term. The point is that one of the responsibilities of government is to protect it's citizens. And I am not talking about thought crimes. Someone I was watching summed it up perfectly. I have the right to free speech, but if I yell "FIRE" in a crowded movie theater, my free speech directly threatens the safety of others and becomes criminal. Based on all the reports I have seen, these guys crossed this threshold prior to the attack and the french authorities didn't do anything.

What do you propose? Are you happy with the status quo? When they start blowing shit up and killing people in Canada, are you going to be OK with that?

They already did, some jackass attacked Parliament this year, did you miss that?

If the alternative to the status quo is prosecution for thought crime, then yes, I'll take the status quo. And yes, that is what you are proposing. These guys attended an al qaeda camp and had radical notions, but you're allowed to have whatever notions you like, provided you do not act on them. You're proposing identifying people with threatening beliefs and attitudes and taking action against them because of the perceived risk that they MIGHT do something harmful. That is the quintessence of totalitarianism: "The state knows what you're thinking, and will punish you for it".

So back to the status quo. Well, I'm more likely to die being trampled by a buffalo or falling down an open elevator shaft this year than I am to be killed by a terrorist. I'm not afraid of terrorism. So vis a vis terrorism, I'm generally pretty fine with the status quo. Maybe some adjustments can be made, like increasing police response times or having a crisis unit available to respond more quickly. Gun control measures, that kind of thing. But overall, not too scared of getting shot by a guy yelling "Allahu Akbar" - I have more likely problems to face.

I am afraid of having my right to think and say what I please taken away from me, and when you take it away from someone else, I feel like I could easily be next, because that's how it always goes with this sort of totalitarian action. You see something, no matter how remote it is, and out of fear completely overreact by begging your government to protect you at basically any cost. I consider you and people who talk like you do on this issue to be, bluntly, cowards. And fairly dumb ones, too. If you want to be afraid of something that can feasibly kill you, get angry about drunk drivers and heart disease.
Jan 9 2015 4:41PM
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Mr.Huck
Posts: 6096 - Karma: 14,893
No I didn't miss that. Yeah, I'm sure it shook some folks up, but only one person was killed. I hope we can agree that 9/11 was a whole different thing. This guy is a stud of major proportions BTW:



Here's an example of what I'm talking about. I would not recommend that you pull up this site.

Inspire Magazine|JIHADOLOGY
jihadology.net/category/inspire-magazin - deleted characters to disable link.

^ This is all over the news today. It is a forum site for terrorists. Among other things it teaches jihadists how to make a bomb in their mother's kitchen. The fact that governments allow this site to stay up is truly moronic. It only exists for the purpose of spreading an ideology of jihad. Hackers should spam the crap out of this site. They should constantly be loading up videos of guys fisting donkeys or giving BJs to camels. They should dump so much malware on that site that if you pull it up, your computer craps all over your lap and dies, or fries your testicles. Free speech = good, free speech with the ultimate aim of killing a bunch of people in the name of religious jihad = Bad.

Anyway J.D., you and I are never going to agree on this.
Jan 9 2015 6:35PM
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Laurent.
Posts: 10054 - Karma: 25,277
The footage of the ending of the hostage situation at the supermarket in Paris as shown on TV on France 3.

(Note this includes the visuals of the hostage taker being shot so viewer discretion advised).

https://www.newschoolers.com/videos/watch/747573/Uncensored-original-footage-of-hostage-situation-at-supermarket-in-Paris-coming-to-an-endLiveleak permalink: http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=869_1420833044
Jan 9 2015 7:02PM
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maximiliaan
Posts: 7710 - Karma: 2,849
omnidataThe footage of the ending of the hostage situation at the supermarket in Paris as shown on TV on France 3.

(Note this includes the visuals of the hostage taker being shot so viewer discretion advised).

https://www.newschoolers.com/videos/watch/747573/Uncensored-original-footage-of-hostage-situation-at-supermarket-in-Paris-coming-to-an-endLiveleak permalink: http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=869_1420833044


Whuuut did he got shot like 30 times or something?
Jan 9 2015 8:14PM
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howlongcanausern
Posts: 4982 - Karma: 1,737
omnidataThe footage of the ending of the hostage situation at the supermarket in Paris as shown on TV on France 3.

(Note this includes the visuals of the hostage taker being shot so viewer discretion advised).

https://www.newschoolers.com/videos/watch/747573/Uncensored-original-footage-of-hostage-situation-at-supermarket-in-Paris-coming-to-an-endLiveleak permalink: http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=869_1420833044


holy shit that guy who ran in first
Jan 9 2015 9:06PM
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SpookyCat
Posts: 1232 - Karma: -2,617
J.D.It's actually a sort of difficult question. If you go by the math it's undoubtedly true - Christian extremists (whatever you want to look at as the modern KKK) simply do not have the sort of body count that is evident when we look at the actions of muslim extremists.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crusades

Yeah, only like 4 million people died because of the Christian/Catholic extremists that were in possession of possibly the most powerful army in the world at that time. One of the reasons Islam-phobia exists is because all the other religious nuts believe their religion would never commit such acts of terror... except that most religions have and some have committed worse at one point or another.

Anyone else feel a big rush of joy after seeing that video of the extremist pig getting shot 80 times? Fucking right.
Jan 9 2015 9:32PM
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SpookyCat
Posts: 1232 - Karma: -2,617
Mr.HuckI can't think of any other time in history or any other culture that has wanted to rid everyone from the face of the earth who did not share their beliefs.

I know TLDR, but something else I find interesting is that the police in France have way more freedom than U.S. cops. They apparently can torture and beat the living crap out of anyone to get information. Makes me wonder why they aren't tougher on these guys when they start threatening attacks.



Aside from the historical event I just posted, yeah you're right... Hitler never existed.
Jan 9 2015 9:34PM
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SkiBum.
Posts: 3597 - Karma: 3,895
If this was in America we would have bombed someone by now.

Merica!
Jan 9 2015 9:49PM
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fujarome
Posts: 8630 - Karma: 1,561
That video is crazy. Looked like the plan was to literally just indicate the building with as many heavily armed officers as possible.

Tragic that a few hostages were killed all the same, but like many I'm just thankful the whole ordeal is finally over.
Jan 9 2015 11:28PM
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Dustin.
Posts: 13839 - Karma: 7,704
J.D.It's actually a sort of difficult question. If you go by the math it's undoubtedly true - Christian extremists (whatever you want to look at as the modern KKK) simply do not have the sort of body count that is evident when we look at the actions of muslim extremists. And although Jewish extremism in the middle east has certainly produced some atrocities, again, just on a pure numbers basis it doesn't compare.

But on the other hand, is the result what makes a form of religious extremism bad? There are plenty of Christian extremists who, if they could, would kill all homosexuals, stem cell researchers, even cosmologists who dare to question their version of God as the source of all (irony abounds) morality and goodness. Does the difference really just the fact that one sect has the means to carry out their evil beliefs make them inherently worse? I'm not sure it does.

It's really a pointless debate, though. Rather than comparing Muslim extremism to Jewish or Christian extremism, just let's say that religious extremism is the source of the problem here and skip the singling out of one particular group, because they're all enjoining or committing terrible acts in the name of their faith. In light of that it hardly matters what book they say is most important, does it?


The means? How difficult do you think it is for an American Christian extremists to go shoot up a gay bar? Way easier than it is to find an assault rifle in France. I'm not at all following your point here so I am either confused or in disagreement.
Jan 10 2015 4:48AM
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BravoWhiskey5280
Posts: 4020 - Karma: 520
SkiBum.If this was in America we would have bombed someone by now.

Merica!


Actually you couldn't be more wrong, someone would have been bombed if this were in Bush's America. But in Obama's America this would of been labeled as an act of work place violence just as it was with the massacre at Fort Hood. The bitch ass pussies that make up the liberal population in America and their supreme leader Kim Jung Obama would never call these events an act terrorism because doing so might be offensive to some.
Jan 10 2015 6:40AM
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Dustin.
Posts: 13839 - Karma: 7,704
WoldsWorldActually you couldn't be more wrong, someone would have been bombed if this were in Bush's America. But in Obama's America this would of been labeled as an act of work place violence just as it was with the massacre at Fort Hood. The bitch ass pussies that make up the liberal population in America and their supreme leader Kim Jung Obama would never call these events an act terrorism because doing so might be offensive to some.


That's a bit of an immature ideology. Especially considering both France and the US are actively bombing ISIL targets in the Middle East either now or very recently. This isn't at all a Bush vs. Obama issue, and I'd argue no issue is since opinion related to that is nothing more than speculation.
Jan 10 2015 9:27AM
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All times are Eastern (-4)