I'm throughly impressed with both Bryant and Novotny's...

i think bryant had good intentions, but really generalized with about 10 accusations of older companies, and therefore what novotny said really needed to be said

______________________________ " im popping the collar right now, you gotta wear at least 2 polos when you do it though, im rockin 3 burberrys at the moment" ATLSKI

i think novotny handed it to him but i see what josh bryant means

member 9020 newbies are our future unless if we stop them now! BOGART!!

^agreed. nothing at all against josh bryant or jibij or anything like that, but everyone ALL the time hates on the "old guys" in the industry. yea, they might not be as passionate about it as the kid hiking pipe all day, but everyone has a place, and theirs is in the business aspect of skiing. weeee my last name is novotny too.





far too fly to stay stationary...

^really? thats not a very common name

member 9020 newbies are our future unless if we stop them now! BOGART!!

i just posted how i love, seeing that on newschoolers people have the ability to voice there own opinion, and in this case a great discussion, and it's been done repectively, which is usually the downfall of this discissions. It just shows how much everyone cares about the sport and how passionate we are.

Both are great articles that bring up some great points, and both also have some flaws, but that';s what makes them great! Personal opinion.

I love this shit!



Dragon's Lair Member
Drop Cliffs, Not Bombs
Make Turns, Not War
Bomb Hills, Not People
Member #259

i think novotony had some good things that needed to be said, but i think he needs to shut the fuck up. Josh Bryant has been pushing newschool skiing more than anyone, and it's going to be people like him that have the ability to talk to the masses that change the sport, not someone who puts together a freeride team.

'core shots just mean you're badass.' -itsbackfliptime

novotony owned

owned? just because notvot spit his shit more profeshionaly doesn't mean a damn thing. I think the people that buy dynastars are the ones getting owned, piece of shit skis they think they can just change the graphics of and trick all the kiddies into buying them.




My weiner is probably harder than yours.

I think they both had a lot of good things to say, despite some large generalizations on Bryant's part and a little more anger than I would deem necessary on Novotny's. I think when reading Bryants interview it is important to remember that he wants nothing more than to further progress the industry and if possible try and overlook some of the overgeneralizations he made. While some of his notions of "old guys running the business" etc. may or may not be overly accurate he merely fears the stagnation of our sport and wants to see it progress. In his mind (whether true or not) it is largely the smaller companies who are doing this and so it is with them that he places his trust.

For Novotny's part I can definitely understand why these overgeneralizations make him so angry and I found everything he had to say very interesting (particularly about the newschool book dynastar made and distributed) but I think it is important that we remember we are all on the same side here. That being said Novotny did make some excellent points and refuted Bryan's arguments very well, I would just prefer to see people like Bryant and Novotny who by all rights should be on the same team on better terms as they're both working towards the same thing.

'Taco Del Mar invites you to roll a big one today!'

novotony knows what he is talking about

absolutely and I'm not saying he doesn't by any means, I think he did an excellent job of arguing that Dynastar and other big companies have done every bit as much or more to progress freeskiing, I guess I'm just not one for bitter arguments, can't we all just get along I say.

'Taco Del Mar invites you to roll a big one today!'

novotony had a good argument, but he doesnt back his riders as much as he makes it seem. giray, didnt you get your skis in like january?




Logic is working to stock up on premade hats so our store is closed for now. If you have a suggestion don't hesitate to e-mail me.

Logic Headware

This was my response to Novotny:

Novotny,
now you try awfully hard to create a rift in people's perceptions of us by bringing up Asian manufacturing as though we keep it a big dark secret. We don't. You even go so far out as to claim it is nothing personal, yet you lash out as though the fact of our production is to be despised. That was both poorly thought out and entirely juvenile of you. You say that Dynastar would never move their factory to save money. You cannot make that call. Your job is apparently youth marketing and by all accounts, you don't do a standout job. So let's stick to what you know first before you make claims about the whole of your company's buisiness and operations. K2 moved finalized production becasue they financially couldn't last here as it was. K2's engineering, prototyping, testing, marketing, administrative, and creative is all still here on Vashon Island. Everyone I work with is a skier as well Josh, the only difference between us is that we actually make the calls.

I'm sure I could create you a "little book" that could illustrate the things K2 has done for freeskiing since you expressed interest in learning such knowledge. A few small instances if you will:

1995-1996 released the twin-tip Poacher. Creating a forward-thinking product long before your competitors, including Salomon and your friends at Dynastar Josh, shows support for freeskiing.
1996-1997 Created the K2 Factory Freeride Team, the first company to step up and promote and market this segment of the sport
1998-1999: Having the first line devoted the this demographic graphically and supporting the athletes with the first modern day pro model ski for Morrison and later Kent Kreitler.
1998-present: Sponsoring High North ski camp, the first ever newschool skiing summer camp, shows support for freeskiing.
2000-2001: Starting a nationwide tour with Factory Team athletes and Glen Plake showing up to local mountains in Willy Nelson's old tour bus shows support for freeskiing.
2002-2003: Releasing products with details meant to prolong the life of the equiment, such as rivets, sidewalls and thick edges shows support for freeskiing.
2002-2003: Creating 2 twin tip skis fatter than 95mm underfoot shows support for freeskiing
2002-2003: Creating two websites devoted to promoting Freeride skiing and it athletes
2003-2004-Realeasing a performance product with a unique flex at an extreme value price for the end consumer (Fujative $299.00/ Public Enemy $399.00) shows support for freeskiing.
2003-2005 Glen Plake's Down Home Tour, a 30-day blitzkrieg of resort hoping with Plake and team athletes shows support for freeskiing.
And of course, sponsoring various movie companies, events and magazines shows support for freeskiing.
2005 Redesigning the Seth Vicious with a progressive sidecut and widening the Public Enemy to enhance the performance and new demands of the sport

I'll call it out here Josh. Especially if you want to go there bit by bit comparing our respective companies' contributions to our segement of skiing. It is not an even contribution by both parties, so don't fool yourself by claiming it is.

I also hope you realize you work for a company. A company that makes money. Everybody makes money, they try at least. This is what companies do. You said you never went to school for buisiness but perhaps you should have. You even utilized the caps lock to illustrate the point you were trying to make that K2 just wants money.
Your hyped up accusations hold no merrit and I hope it is as evident to the reader's on Newschoolers as it is to me.

oh damn that was good.....i thinnk this might heat up

member 9020 newbies are our future unless if we stop them now! BOGART!!

scmies argument is flawless except for the fact that momentum had the first terrain park to compliment theri moguls in 97

do it for yourself and no one else

As you stated though, "with moguls." High North was freeride only.

Agreed Schmies. If you think about who has thrown money to right elements of the ski industry, k2 comes to mind. Core video contests, solid riders. I'm looking forward to seeing what you guys have in store for this and next year.

By the way, this may be unsubstantiated, but there are whispers of companies looking to buy out Dynastar. Who knows? I'm not saying it is going to happen, I am just saying think about who's going to be around and why.

It's like a gang war, or something... only with ski companies. Next thing we'll see is J-lev making an appearance to tell everyone what a bunch of dickwads they're being, and then we'll have us some REAL internet drama.

You guys are not helping your respective businesses at all by doing this. I hope you get some satisfaction out of speaking your minds about this stuff while you burn bridges and degrade your professional image.

Josh's point to me seemed not so much we need to copy snowboarding exactly but follow what they are doing. I would be very happy if the industry turned the way snowboarding is right now, I love the snowboarding side of the sport and think that we need to learn from it alot. Its not copying its learning and growing in that direction.

yea this is getting pretty serious huh
pretty wierd

i'm not impressed... an argument is not a rant where one person goes out and bashes everyone else. an argument shows one person's side of the story. ratting on everyone else weakens arguments and makes people sound kind of dumb. while all parties involved here seem to want to make good points, their points are shadowed by just simply bashing others.

---------------- Everybody gets one chance to do something great. Most people never take the chance, either because they're too scared, or they don't recognize it when it spits on their shoes.~The Sandlot Yankees '05 message me to join the Yankee Lovers cult

PEOPLE IN THE SKI INDUSTRY NEED TO STOP EATING EACHOTHER ALIVE!! It is so ridiculous. You all sound like a bunch of losers. Why do skiers do this? It is just so lame that it kills me. We are arguing over who is "core"? This is so gay. That Jibbij guy needs to get off Line's dick and stop disrespecting the ski industry by making huge generalizations and overstatements. "Gosh man, I am so sweet and progressive...old guys suck...I live in Boulder." Like shut up dude, you're a flipping idiot. Then for Novotny to actually address this kid is amazing. Neither of these guys are credible at all. Schmies is probably the only guy that has really been at it since the start and I know that for a fact. He is probably the only kid that is universally loved in the ski world and his opinion on things has always been objective and reasonable. We also got stuff going on with Kendrick and CKO?? Its so pathetic. I am ashamed to be a skier when I read this kind of stuff and I am sure everyone would be friends if you weren't talking through a stupid chatroom. Grow up!!


Schmies did own house though. You rock baby!

i think everyone should just shop at D-Structure, they carry all the skis that jibij does plus the ones they dont want to carry, and on top of that they are super supportive of the industry, there team rips, there events area amaazing, word www.d-structure.com

-Nick Iwanyshyn

www.ninthward.com

Josh Bryant seems a bit close minded to me, singling out ceretin companies to carry, to just the ones he likes. But that is why he has his own shop. He has been close with Line skis for years, so he became a major dealer of the skis.

Also, he wants to carry the little "core" companies skis, and not the same things you can get at Christy Sports or Garts or some shit.

On the other hand, Josh seems a bit anxious to conclude the "old guys" (these are the people, as Novotony mentions, that have made the real money and put it into a ski company to, what? PROGRESS THE INDUSTRY!) dont care about newschool. We (newschool skiers of today) are making great progress, we have the support of the "old guys" and we are simply just the next generation of "old guys" in the industry.

Two very extreme points, one close minded to corporate procedure, and one very angry team manager with substantial evidence. It's a fucking battle!

spinks



...he died doing what he loved. He will always be rememberd as a great snowboarder, but more importantly as a great friend. In loving memory of Josh Malay. RED TEAM!

correct me if i'm wrong, but rossignol already owns dynastar?


-Joel

~Phunkin Phatt Phreerider~
Capital City Rider, DFP
Silent Army

'Everybody calls me a zero. But I'm an internet hero.'

as mucyh as i love d-structure and have bought my last pair of skis there, i find their prices are too high. I know they alwasy say to come in and talk to them etc. but they cannot compete to shit you can find on ebay or other places.

'wow....ATLANTASKI should be dragged behind a truck at 90mp/h over rusty razorblades, stabbed multiple times with ice picks, raped up the bum-bum by rabid gorillas and then shot....'-big_white_hucker

^ which will soon be owned by quicksilver?



Dragon's Lair Member
Drop Cliffs, Not Bombs
Make Turns, Not War
Bomb Hills, Not People
Member #259

on another note , im loving the relpy's final some high quality ns content!



Dragon's Lair Member
Drop Cliffs, Not Bombs
Make Turns, Not War
Bomb Hills, Not People
Member #259

I think novonty knows what hes talking about, but he works for one of the slowest progressing companies around so it doesn't really do much for his argument.

3 years to fill the spot of its little big fat

ignored problems with thier edges since the concepts

pro models that are just a topsheet change with no performance increase.

Take the thousands of dollars that you put into that book and invest it in some differently constructed skis instead of the same busted ass shit over and over. Chances are the book is more opinion anyway because what he explained it as seems to be a book filled with opinions, and preferences. I don't doubt that dynastar throws alot of money into the industry, but the product they produce is not up to par with others on the market.

Upon reading all of this, I can tell who obviously went to school...


*******************
'Chief Heavily Whipped? Yeah guy, THAT's a name to be proud of...'

'Amy, are your ears cold? Your ice is looking icier than usual...' -Turpin

word dishwalla, there prices for there american shop are off the hook, were talking american ski shops......

-Nick Iwanyshyn

www.ninthward.com

As a proponent of Dynastar it is incredibly dissapointing to see them come out with the same shit year after year. yes, the troublemaker skis well, but it's annoying how easily the edges break. I find it unnaceptable for a company to go 3 years without changin anything other than the graphic, when there are obvious problems with the design. the metal tip and tail guards certainly don't help at all with swingweight. The graphics are also sub-par. Take any mid-range or even certain low end snowboard off the shelf and you'll see a creative topsheet graphic and colourful die-cut p-tex base. the base on the new dynastars looks like it's off of a rental ski, it's made that way because it's cheaper. I only write this crap because with all the heat hopefully some Dynastar Execs see it. The big trouble is a step in the right direction (albeit 2 years too late), they have a sick team, and give back to the industry. Just fix the damn skis.

Life sucks, get a fucking helmet -Denis Leary

And other than the edge problem's it's not like it's a BAD ski, it's just completely mediocre. I think if dynatar is serious about this market, they'll make somthing a little more distinctive in the future.

Life sucks, get a fucking helmet -Denis Leary

i agree with you completely man. and josh never attacked dynastar directly. dyna skis blow. enjoy your pieces of shit

--------------------------------
-Jon

go to jibij

This is my response to everyone:

O.K. I guess this has gone on long enough; I would like to address a few concerns here.

First of all I manage the ski team here at Dynastar and I am the Marketing Coordinator, meaning that I have nothing to do with actual ski design. Furthermore everything I said was the opinion of myself personally and not the opinions of Dynastar. And for the record I do have a college diploma, and my mom doesn’t suck.

Moving to K2 and Schmies. My point with K2 was that big companies need to do things like move their production in order to stay in business and continue to support the movement. But moreover I did not understand how Bryant saw K2 as supporting the movement while Dynastar was not. And Shmies for the record, I really didn’t say anything untrue, and for your own personal knowledge, I have a pair of K2 poachers that I bought in ‘96 proudly displayed on my wall and I respect the shit out of what K2 and more importantly you do. I loved the factory free-ride team, and Seth Morrison was one of my childhood idols, and I can honestly say that K2 has helped progress the industry as much if not more than most companies. You and I are both truthfully working towards the same thing, as are all the people on this site. But you had some strict concerns with Bryant’s interview as well “Your generalizations are ridiculous.�

And before anyone misconstrues anything else I said, let me state for the record I SUPPORT JIBIJ. The entire crux of my argument was that huge companies are a necessity for the sport. I also believe personally that kids should support smaller shops and boycott huge chain stores, because those huge stores are the only ones making money on newschool without reinvesting in it. I purely felt as if Mr. Bryant was targeting the wrong “bad guy,� and I wanted to address it. Also I do strongly disagree with a lot of things he said about the industry as a whole, and especially following snowboarding 100%.

Let me please wrap this up by saying a few things…First watch Balance, my heart has been with newschool since I saw Cusson do a 360 mute grab WAY before “big air� Moseley did one. I posted my feelings because the truth is without big and small companies alike there would never be a newschool segment like we have now. Also last year there were 33,000 twin tips sold in the US. That is the most to date, but it still isn’t enough to be a large money making segment... Most companies big and small alike are in newschool because they know without it there will be no future for skiing. Anyone who knows me knows nothing makes me happier than being in this industry and I can honestly say I have never worked harder at anything in my life than trying to help keep newschool alive. In addition at the end of the day, no matter if you’re a big company or small, chain shop or indy, everyone needs to pay the bills.

i would have to agree with both in their different aspects, bryant really generalized when he said all of his shit tho

I HATE NY PRODUCTION - BOGART!!!!!!!!

I would just like to say that if skiing "follows snowboarding 100%" there will be about 400 "core" small ski companies in a few years. Most will make garbage product, but have really cool graphics. Then a few years later, they will all be out of business or bought out and we will be right back where we started with maybe one or two that survived. Hell, Sims has crapped out once or twice, and are now oned by some Japanese company. They were OG.

--rick

i think they should all stop be being pussies and have a big fight. shmies vs bryant vs novotany all against each other with weapons.

im putting my money on..bryant

G R I P S E T

cagematch
with and electric fence around it

it appears schmies and bryant are on the same page now. so they'd team up and beat the shit out of novotny. the kid's only like 5'2" anyway.

and all of you saying that the "old guy" situation is crap cannot say anything unless you have physically been to sia. it's fucking depressing.

and the "skiing following snowboarding 100%" is right, but to a certain point. you go to sia and walk over to the snowboarding side and you see tons of little outerwear companies that you've never heard of before but they have such sick stuff, every one of them. instead of every kid wanting to start their own ski company we need more sick outerwear companies like siver. competition is the fuel for progression.

I didnt have time to read the whole discussion, but in dynastars defense, they did have an early season rail jam at their offices 3 years ago...I was there. Dion was there too.


http://www.freeiPods.com/?r=15321805
Go there if you want to help me out and get a free ipod yourself too. thanks.

dynastar and rossi are one company. it's interesting to see novotny's response to the interview go up after he had asked bryant to carry dynastar in the store the previous friday and was turned down. it's no secret that dynastar edges suck and that they will not be doing anything about them in the near future. hell, look how long it took them to put out their 92-waist "fat" twin.

plus you can buy dynastar and rossi products at any chain store, so that wouldn't really help him cater to his niche and he wouldn't be able to compete with their prices. loyalty it seems is hard to come by.

it's really fucking confusing that both of the people being discussed are named josh. someone needs a new name.

from what i hear dynastar is working on their edges and are in the process of coming up with an urban ski so you dont have to worry about edges

member 9020 newbies are our future unless if we stop them now! BOGART!!

im basically agreeing with some points from both their arguements and schmies way to go with that kick ass comeback

--------------------------------------
Valley-Lu

"dude. i've read freeze, talked on the phone, ate pizza, and did homeowrk all at the same time... while i was taking a shit!"- seanpistol

"Schmies is your daddy."


Hesitation = Devastation

'You know there are a buttload of gangs at this school. This one gang kept asking me to join 'cause I'm pretty good with a bowstaff.'

Well, my goal with that interview was to get people thinking. It was an interview, meaning I didn't get to take the time to TYPE OUT my thoughts. So of course a lot of it sounded generalized. It was an opinion, some of you agree with it, some don't. That's as much as I expected. But, it's generated more thought on this site than I've seen in a long time. So I'm happy with that. Schmies is the MAN, and no hard feelings towards Novotny. I hope that in the future we can work together.


Jibij Pro Shop
2714 28th St.
Boulder, CO 80301
303-440-1244
www.jibij.com

novotny ad the crazyest mistys back in the dayz

anyway both josh had good point but both exagerated a bit

'I think I woud be laughing too hard if I had sex with a guy because gay people are so funny' - Marc Balaban (resnick)

I'm glad to see constructive arguments being made rather than all out dumbass remarks that this site is sometimes known for.


www.rightsideproductions.com

I just want to say one thing: Company's like dynastar or K2 or salomon invest way more money in their marketing activities in freeskiing than they make money for it. Just because they now it will keep the industry in general alive and well.

Chuck B
Mushi Mushi
www.plehousefilms.com
White Shine coming out Oct.6.2005
The D team film

I must interject and mention how professional both Novotany and Bryant have been. We have heard two very different points of view here, and neither parties have attacked each other personally, brought up any swiftboat issues, or said anything negative about any company specifically.

This has been a great discussion!

Basically what we all need to keep in mind is, like Novotany says, everybody needs to pay the bills. Further, as both parties agree, skiers need to be making skis for skiers. Honestly, that is what newschool is, has been, and will forever be.

Remember when the Troublemaker came out? Remember how much hype there was? Remember that in the few years since the release of the TM we have seen 4Frnt, Armada, and other core companies, plus K2 (re-design, introduce Pep Pro), as well as companies like Rossignol, Salomon, and other bigger companies all stepping it up to improve the products and progress the industry!

Big companies give fuel for the small companies by sponsoring big events, and increasing awareness with national media marketing. If not for this exposure, people would'nt have any motivation to research and discover our smaller companies. On the other hand, the smaller companies are a bit more experimental with design, discovering what works and what does'nt which the big companies feed off as well!

It all comes around!

*note: Do you really think that the execs/founders of Dynastar started the company because they wanted to make money? Or maybe it is the same reason I started up with Liberty, so we can ski and make skis and work with the industry to make skiing better!



...he died doing what he loved. He will always be rememberd as a great snowboarder, but more importantly as a great friend. In loving memory of Josh Malay. RED TEAM!