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So I'm going to get some boots fitted and whilst I'll let the boot fitter recommend and tell me what boots suit my feet and my skiing style. What are your thoughts on the Atomic Hawx Ultra 130? I was just browsing their boot range seeing what they may recommend to me. and saw these what are your thoughts?
So.... my bootfitter threw away the hanging tag off the boot. Now, I cannot - for the life of me - figure out what the extra small plastic pieces are for and how they might pay a part in the power shift adjustment. I also cannot find any information - whatsoever - online about how to change the power shift setting.
Any info or links on how to get the info that was one the tag would be appreciated.
Thanks.
tripletSo.... my bootfitter threw away the hanging tag off the boot. Now, I cannot - for the life of me - figure out what the extra small plastic pieces are for and how they might pay a part in the power shift adjustment. I also cannot find any information - whatsoever - online about how to change the power shift setting.
Any info or links on how to get the info that was one the tag would be appreciated.
Thanks.
Disclaimer: if you don't know what the adjustments on your boot do or are for, do not mess with them. Things like cuff alignment and Power Shift can either dramatically help when done right or dramatically hinder you if done wrong. Both change how your body interacts with the boot and they should honestly only be adjusted by someone who knows how to assess your biomechanical needs and then change the boot to match your needs. They are more for boot-fitters to mess with than for end users.
The below picture is what was attached to your boot
It basically says this: positioning the boot in 15° (how it comes out of the box) or 17° does not require the plastic shim. If you position the cuff to the 13° setting, you need to place the shim in the gap that is created when the cuff moves rearward away from the shell.
To ideally determine what setting is best for you, a trained boot-fitter should perform an ankle range of motion test to determine your flexibility limitations. Once your limitations (or lack thereof) are found, then the boot should be adjusted to those limitations and/or your personal preferences. Hope that helps.
Thanks for the response on the plastic tab/spacer. I figured it out last night ... the gap you're talking about it on the inside of the boot so you need to remove the liner (or, put it forward enough) to see it.
Do you know if the spacer velcro'ed to the back top of the liner is recommended at all three angles? It seems like it's unnecessary at 17 degrees.
And, I agree about involving a bootfitter ... in messing with the boot last night, I think I like the 17 degree best - I have no flexion issues - but I mussed up the cuff alignment and need to go back to my guy and get the cuffs put back where they were before I started screwing with it.
tripletDo you know if the spacer velcro'ed to the back top of the liner is recommended at all three angles? It seems like it's unnecessary at 17 degrees.
This is the liner spoiler and does not have to be used at all. It serves two purposes: take up excess space around the leg (good if you have skiiny calves like me) and also increases your forward lean.
I know this is the Ultra 130 topic, but is there that same liner spoiler thing on the 110 as well? Because I have a square piece of velcro on the back of my liners but nothing that attaches to it.
Taking some space in the cuff would be very useful for me as I probably have the skinniest ankles/calves known to man.
BrawnTrendsI know this is the Ultra 130 topic, but is there that same liner spoiler thing on the 110 as well? Because I have a square piece of velcro on the back of my liners but nothing that attaches to it.
Taking some space in the cuff would be very useful for me as I probably have the skinniest ankles/calves known to man.
The spoiler is included with the 130 but not the 110. It is available as a spare part (your shop can order it for you), but any velcro spoiler will work (almost every brand makes them) or your boot-fitter can custom shape dense foam and create a spoiler exactly for your needs. Lots of options out there.
onenerdykidDisclaimer: if you don't know what the adjustments on your boot do or are for, do not mess with them. Things like cuff alignment and Power Shift can eitIher dramatically help when done right or dramatically hinder you if done wrong. Both change how your body interacts with the boot and they should honestly only be adjusted by someone who knows how to assess your biomechanical needs and then change the boot to match your needs. They are more for boot-fitters to mess with than for end users.
The below picture is what was attached to your boot
It basically says this: positioning the boot in 15° (how it comes out of the box) or 17° does not require the plastic shim. If you position the cuff to the 13° setting, you need to place the shim in the gap that is created when the cuff moves rearward away from the shell.
To ideally determine what setting is best for you, a trained boot-fitter should perform an ankle range of motion test to determine your flexibility limitations. Once your limitations (or lack thereof) are found, then the boot should be adjusted to those limitations and/or your personal preferences. Hope that helps.
So i was working with my bootfitter to do some adjustments and I like an upright stance. When we looked at the little spacer gor the 13 degree option, it didnt allow the screw to align with the hole. He wanted me to ask you what the purpose of it was since he said he knew of you and possibly knew you
onenerdykidDisclaimer: if you don't know what the adjustments on your boot do or are for, do not mess with them. Things like cuff alignment and Power Shift can eitIher dramatically help when done right or dramatically hinder you if done wrong. Both change how your body interacts with the boot and they should honestly only be adjusted by someone who knows how to assess your biomechanical needs and then change the boot to match your needs. They are more for boot-fitters to mess with than for end users.
The below picture is what was attached to your boot
It basically says this: positioning the boot in 15° (how it comes out of the box) or 17° does not require the plastic shim. If you position the cuff to the 13° setting, you need to place the shim in the gap that is created when the cuff moves rearward away from the shell.
To ideally determine what setting is best for you, a trained boot-fitter should perform an ankle range of motion test to determine your flexibility limitations. Once your limitations (or lack thereof) are found, then the boot should be adjusted to those limitations and/or your personal preferences. Hope that helps.
So i was working with my bootfitter to do some adjustments and I like an upright stance. When we looked at the little spacer gor the 13 degree option, it didnt allow the screw to align with the hole. He wanted me to ask you what the purpose of it was since he said he knew of you and possibly knew you
parkplaygroundSo i was working with my bootfitter to do some adjustments and I like an upright stance. When we looked at the little spacer gor the 13 degree option, it didnt allow the screw to align with the hole. He wanted me to ask you what the purpose of it was since he said he knew of you and possibly knew you
Word, what shop is it?
Normally it totally should. Sounds like maybe when they drilled it, it got drilled ever so slightly off that the screw can't align with the claw nut...
Try this: remove the liner, loosen the screws almost all the way out but are still threaded partly in, and see if you can drop the shim in that way. It might be a tight squeeze, but that should work. Or try angling the claw nut from inside the shell with a short handled screw driver to align it with the screw.
Same here. Neither boot allow for lean adjust. The holes simply will not line up. Thinking about returning the boot considering that is one of the more important features I utilize.
Normally it totally should. Sounds like maybe when they drilled it, it got drilled ever so slightly off that the screw can't align with the claw nut...
Try this: remove the liner, loosen the screws almost all the way out but are still threaded partly in, and see if you can drop the shim in that way. It might be a tight squeeze, but that should work. Or try angling the claw nut from inside the shell with a short handled screw driver to align it with the screw.
Its Skirack in Burlington vt and atleast on my pair, it lines up without the little shim so ive been fine without it
I have recently bought Hawx Ultra 110. All ski shops near me had either 110 or 130 so I decided to go for 110 since I didn't want to go for very stiff 130.
However I would like to increase flex of my boot so can you please provide me with a little help how to drill the hole in the boot. I am afraid not to mess something up. :)
When I put the provided screw in will the flex go to 120? Will the boot feel more like Ultra 120 or will it still be different?
Since no store had Ultra 120 I couldn't try them so I don't know how big difference between this two boots is.
Hands down one of the best boots I've skied. The flex is consistent and the boot has a firm fit not being a race boot. The fit is kinda roomy comparing to other narrow lasted 98mm boots thanks to the liner it's paired with. At first I thought I'd throw in a pair of intuition liners but the stock ones were fitting way better out of box somehow. I've been skiing on multiple race inspired boots and ft's for the last 8 yrs and these have been so comfortable and light boots that I'd recommend these to anyone looking for a narrow fitted high performance boot.
So I'm considering buying the Hawx Ultra 130 online and then bringing them out to CO in March to get insoles and a heat mold, I'm in Florida so no skiing until then. The reason I'm considering this option is I've tried the 110s and they fit well, I'm worried by the time I get out there no retailers will have any left in stock, and I found a semi sketchy Dutch site with them for 559 euro, 600 USD.
Anyone have any thoughts, or experience purchasing from this site?
AuschieSo I'm considering buying the Hawx Ultra 130 online and then bringing them out to CO in March to get insoles and a heat mold, I'm in Florida so no skiing until then. The reason I'm considering this option is I've tried the 110s and they fit well, I'm worried by the time I get out there no retailers will have any left in stock, and I found a semi sketchy Dutch site with them for 559 euro, 600 USD.
Anyone have any thoughts, or experience purchasing from this site?
Atomic USA has been sold out for a long time, so whatever boots the retailers have is what they will have until next fall. If you are thinking about pulling the trigger on a pair now, you will at least have a pair now rather than being forced to wait until next fall or order from Euroland.
Are you sure you need to the 130 or would the 120 or 110 be sufficient for you?
onenerdykidAtomic USA has been sold out for a long time, so whatever boots the retailers have is what they will have until next fall. If you are thinking about pulling the trigger on a pair now, you will at least have a pair now rather than being forced to wait until next fall or order from Euroland.
Are you sure you need to the 130 or would the 120 or 110 be sufficient for you?
Not sure. I figured why not go 130 since if I really need to I can always knock it down to a 120. I'm 5'10" 180 lbs. 24 yrs old. I'm not really worried about paying the extra price, hell I don't mind shelling out the 700, I figured it'd be solid if I could save 100 but still get the same boot.
One of the allures of the 130 for me is the grilamid. Right now I'm on the original Ace of Spades and my biggest issue with them is how inconsistent they feel depending on the temperature.
AuschieNot sure. I figured why not go 130 since if I really need to I can always knock it down to a 120. I'm 5'10" 180 lbs. 24 yrs old. I'm not really worried about paying the extra price, hell I don't mind shelling out the 700, I figured it'd be solid if I could save 100 but still get the same boot.
One of the allures of the 130 for me is the grilamid. Right now I'm on the original Ace of Spades and my biggest issue with them is how inconsistent they feel depending on the temperature.
Then I would call or email around and see if any shops will cut you a deal. Never hurts to ask and they just might do it.
The nice thing about all of the Ultras is that they will all feel way more stable in a variety of temperatures thanks to the shell material they all use. The 130 is extra special in that it uses Grilamid (all others use our world cup grade PU) and will deliver that next step up compared to the rest of the family.
I have pretty narrow feet and a narrow heel. I've been in another companies low volume 97mm last boot for the last 2 seasons and have been getting a strange leg pain on the side of my calf. I try on boots at all ski shops and nothing except a low volume lange have fit properly until I tried on the Hawx Ultra. Between the several local shops here in Portland, OR I was able to try the 110, 120, and 130. I grabbed the 120 as I'm a lighter guy around 150lbs and they are perfect. I baked the liners to get me started but left the shell as is for now. I have a couple ski days in them and I'm pretty blown away with the level of comfort and performance you get in these boots. Usually there is a trade off between these two attributes. Even with my narrow feet and low volume heel, I can get them snug without cutting off circulation and have no pain in my leg, numbness of feet, and zero heel lift. My search is finally over. Well done, Atomic.
Drewbis1I have pretty narrow feet and a narrow heel. I've been in another companies low volume 97mm last boot for the last 2 seasons and have been getting a strange leg pain on the side of my calf. I try on boots at all ski shops and nothing except a low volume lange have fit properly until I tried on the Hawx Ultra. Between the several local shops here in Portland, OR I was able to try the 110, 120, and 130. I grabbed the 120 as I'm a lighter guy around 150lbs and they are perfect. I baked the liners to get me started but left the shell as is for now. I have a couple ski days in them and I'm pretty blown away with the level of comfort and performance you get in these boots. Usually there is a trade off between these two attributes. Even with my narrow feet and low volume heel, I can get them snug without cutting off circulation and have no pain in my leg, numbness of feet, and zero heel lift. My search is finally over. Well done, Atomic.
Have the boots gotten anymore roomier the more you ride them? I'm asking cause I too have narrow feet and a narrow heels and am unsure about getting them. PS I did get fitted for these at a boot fitter and they felt great, just worried that they will pack out quick.
Buying a pair of Atomic Hawx Ultra 120s, and I'm curious about various ways to handle canting. The boot fitter I worked with said that the molding process itself would likely take care of any canting needs, but I'd like to know about other steps I can take. I haven't been able to find information elsewhere about how the adjustable cuffs and cantable footpads work. Can anyone enlighten me? Diagrams/manuals would be especially appreciated. A little nervous about new boots, since I've been skiing on the same pair of Lang World Cups for more than 15 years and I've loved them, but they're pretty worn out by now. Thanks!
NELionBuying a pair of Atomic Hawx Ultra 120s, and I'm curious about various ways to handle canting. The boot fitter I worked with said that the molding process itself would likely take care of any canting needs, but I'd like to know about other steps I can take. I haven't been able to find information elsewhere about how the adjustable cuffs and cantable footpads work. Can anyone enlighten me? Diagrams/manuals would be especially appreciated. A little nervous about new boots, since I've been skiing on the same pair of Lang World Cups for more than 15 years and I've loved them, but they're pretty worn out by now. Thanks!
Cuff alignment is handled by dual-sided cuff alignment hardware on the cuff. You will be able to adjust the cuff laterally/medially 4° (total movement). The cuff will also shape to the curvature of your leg through the Memory Fit process. I always prefer to set the cuff as close to your needs as possible, then let Memory Fit do the rest.
Sole canting is handled by intra-sole shims that go in between the replaceable grip pad and the shell of the boot. These shims operate on the same principle as Cantology (just we make the shims instead of them) and are available from 0.5° - 3.0°, on every half degree. Once these shims are added the boot, the boot is no longer within the Alpine DIN standard (toes & heels are too high for bindings) and the toes & heels will need to be routered back to the heights specified within the DIN standard. It is basically a much easier process than trying to sole canting your Lange World Cup- fewer steps and less prone to ruining your boot.
If a boot-fitter is performing sole canting, he/she should have an alignment assessment system that figures out the proper amount of canting you need. We also make such a tool, but your boot-fitter might have another that works well too.
And no matter which route you end up going down (or both), make sure you have a footbed that properly supports your foot and properly aligns your ankle, leg, hip, and knee. Without this, your cuff alignment and sole canting will most likely be very inaccurate.
onenerdykidCuff alignment is handled by dual-sided cuff alignment hardware on the cuff. You will be able to adjust the cuff laterally/medially 4° (total movement). The cuff will also shape to the curvature of your leg through the Memory Fit process. I always prefer to set the cuff as close to your needs as possible, then let Memory Fit do the rest.
Sole canting is handled by intra-sole shims that go in between the replaceable grip pad and the shell of the boot. These shims operate on the same principle as Cantology (just we make the shims instead of them) and are available from 0.5° - 3.0°, on every half degree. Once these shims are added the boot, the boot is no longer within the Alpine DIN standard (toes & heels are too high for bindings) and the toes & heels will need to be routered back to the heights specified within the DIN standard. It is basically a much easier process than trying to sole canting your Lange World Cup- fewer steps and less prone to ruining your boot.
If a boot-fitter is performing sole canting, he/she should have an alignment assessment system that figures out the proper amount of canting you need. We also make such a tool, but your boot-fitter might have another that works well too.
And no matter which route you end up going down (or both), make sure you have a footbed that properly supports your foot and properly aligns your ankle, leg, hip, and knee. Without this, your cuff alignment and sole canting will most likely be very inaccurate.
Thanks! The Langes actually have a canting adjustment on the body of the boot, so there was no need to treat the soles. With the Ultra 120s we have already gone through the MemoryFit process. Is it too late now to adjust the cuffs? Also: Are there diagrams available somewhere that show how the cuff adjustment works? Not planning to attempt it on my own, but it would be helpful for me to understand what to expect.
NELionWith the Ultra 120s we have already gone through the MemoryFit process. Is it too late now to adjust the cuffs? Also: Are there diagrams available somewhere that show how the cuff adjustment works? Not planning to attempt it on my own, but it would be helpful for me to understand what to expect.
I don't think it's too late, it won't be a problem to adjust the cuff alignment after Memory Fit.
I don't have a diagram for it, but it's a very easy adjustment. For your boot, you need either a tool that we supply to boot-fitters or an adjustable pin spanner (common bicycle tool, Park Tool makes them) and you simply spin the hardware. The hardware is offset, so as it spins, it moves the cuff up and down. You can adjust one side of the boot, or both sides, depending on how much you need the cuff to move in order to match the angle of your leg. The hardware and cuff are notched together, so it will spin and click into place- it won't freely spin while skiing and change on you.
onenerdykidI don't think it's too late, it won't be a problem to adjust the cuff alignment after Memory Fit.
I don't have a diagram for it, but it's a very easy adjustment. For your boot, you need either a tool that we supply to boot-fitters or an adjustable pin spanner (common bicycle tool, Park Tool makes them) and you simply spin the hardware. The hardware is offset, so as it spins, it moves the cuff up and down. You can adjust one side of the boot, or both sides, depending on how much you need the cuff to move in order to match the angle of your leg. The hardware and cuff are notched together, so it will spin and click into place- it won't freely spin while skiing and change on you.
Thanks! Which hardware would that be? Don't have the boots here (they're at the shop for binding adjustment), and I can't quite picture the part you are talking about.
I'm very grateful for your help with this, thank you. Can't wait to ski in these boots!
NELionThanks! Which hardware would that be? Don't have the boots here (they're at the shop for binding adjustment), and I can't quite picture the part you are talking about.
I'm very grateful for your help with this, thank you. Can't wait to ski in these boots!
No worries, hope you can get out on them soon!
The cuff alignment hardware are the circular metal rivets that hold the cuff to the shell, located at each side of each ankle on the boot. You would spin these pieces with the pin spanner to adjust the lateral/medial angle of the cuff.
onenerdykidNo worries, hope you can get out on them soon!
The cuff alignment hardware are the circular metal rivets that hold the cuff to the shell, located at each side of each ankle on the boot. You would spin these pieces with the pin spanner to adjust the lateral/medial angle of the cuff.
Got it, thanks! So it will probably click a bit as I turn it. Do you have a recommendation for which side (inside or outside) to adjust first, if it turns out I don't need much adjustment? Also, I assume it's easy to go back to neutral, just by going back to the original setting? Or is there something I can inadvertently displace?
Thanks so much for your help and information, here and elsewhere on this thread.
NELionGot it, thanks! So it will probably click a bit as I turn it. Do you have a recommendation for which side (inside or outside) to adjust first, if it turns out I don't need much adjustment? Also, I assume it's easy to go back to neutral, just by going back to the original setting? Or is there something I can inadvertently displace?
Thanks so much for your help and information, here and elsewhere on this thread.
Cheers! It shouldn't matter so much, but I would start on the side that you want the cuff to move. So, if you want to move the cuff laterally, start with the lateral adjustment. Just be aware that if you do it wrong, it can lead to knee pain. So I always recommend doing this with your fitter first and then he can give you better pointers when he sees what you specifically need.
These boots have been a pain to get aligned right. I have had the cuff alignment changed probably 4 times this season going to and from different skis. I can get it to where it feels right on one ski and then going to another it feels crazy off. I just had an alignment check at the shop again this weekend because they felt wonky and was told they were off by 2 degrees on each foot. Of course I can't find anyone who has the Hawx cant shims in stock.
I also have some Mach 1's and have not touched the cuffs or soles since buying them and they are fine.....not sure what the deal is here.
trumphairThese boots have been a pain to get aligned right. I have had the cuff alignment changed probably 4 times this season going to and from different skis. I can get it to where it feels right on one ski and then going to another it feels crazy off. I just had an alignment check at the shop again this weekend because they felt wonky and was told they were off by 2 degrees on each foot. Of course I can't find anyone who has the Hawx cant shims in stock.
I also have some Mach 1's and have not touched the cuffs or soles since buying them and they are fine.....not sure what the deal is here.
Interesting. There's nothing odd or irregular about the core geometry of the boot itself: 4° ramp angle, 15° forward lean (standard, can be changed to 13° or 17°), 0° shell canting, cuff has 4° of cuff alignment potential (2°in, 2° out), hinge point location is very standard for us (not exactly sure how it compares to Mach 1 but it shouldn't be too different)... The only thing you might not be liking is the 1.5mm of abduction the boot has, but it is such a small amount that I can't imagine it's causing issues for you (99% of people don't even know we do this).
Has your boot-fitter done any modification to your insole or boot board?
The boot is very precise while skiing, so if you are in need of 2° of correction with your sole canting, that would be very tangible in this boot. If your shop has assessed your canting needs and determined that you are in need of 2° of correction, then it would be beneficial for them to order you a set. Do they have standard Cant Co. canting shims (binding or otherwise) that they can simply have you stand on to see if that makes an alignment difference?
As soon as the person above talked about issues when switching between skis, I know exactly what they might be feeling and it's ramp angles of the different bindings. Ramp angle is the difference in heights of the front section and back sections of the bindings below where the heel and toe piece of the boot sits.
If the rear of the binding is much higher than the front, it creates an additional forward lean onto the boot and skier which might be causing stability issues.
For example, my Tyrolia Attack 13 bindings only have about a 3mm difference between the front and back but my Fisher X-13 bindings are 9mm difference. A 5mm difference gives about a 1 extra degree forward lean on a mid size men's boot, so 9mm is almost 2 degrees. It would be like going from 15 degree setting on the Hawk 130 to the 17 degree setting just by switching bindings.
To fix this issue, shims could be added to the front of the high back binding or I just swapped to the same binding ramp angle on all skis and swapping skis is way better. Don't have that "back seat feeling" now that is caused with too much forward lean.
I did consider that but I have noticed it even with skis using the same binding. It seems to be more related to the width underfoot of the ski. For instance when I switch between skis of similar width it's fine but on a powder day when I go with something wider everything is jacked and I have to adjust. Then when I go back to something narrow it feels crazy off again.
Doesn't sound like it has anything to do with the boots or binding ramp angle then. Sounds like you are changing your stance when on wider skis to compensate for the way that ski initiates turns or leaning back when on powder skis or something.
If I were you, I'd maybe get someone to video you skiing on the different skis to see what's going on. Might be as simple as moving the powder ski bindings more forward/backwards to the center of the ski or centering your stance regardless ski width.
I'd keep the boots the same for all skis (provided binding ramp angle is the same) as changing them for different skis is masking the problem. With a video you might see your issue more clearly.
Before you order any cants you may or may not need, I would go to a boot fitting shop with the Atomic and Mach 1 boots, one pair of your piste skis and the powder skis that seem to cause the issue wearing shorts so they can easily measure forward lean/canting etc.
Step into the Mach 1 boots and get the place to measure your legs forward lean, check canting levels and get you do stability exercises like crouching with arms forward to see line up of shoulders vs knees etc. Take measurements and pics with each test.
Then step into bindings of piste skis, measure and test again all these things. Click in powder skis and test and measure everything again.
Set the Atomic Hawk 130 Ultra to original factory settings and do all the same tests and measurements with the boots alone, piste skis on and then powder skis on.
This way you will easily to be able to see what each boot is doing to your stance and the effect of the skis to that stance.
You will learn what your body likes as far as forward lean, canting etc and how each boot is effected by the different skis. THEN see what needs to be done to the Atomic Hawk boots to be in your bodies "happy place."
Hi how much does the spoiler affect the forward lean? Also I think the position of the spoiler will affect the amount, higher or lower. I need to take up the volume so I have them in but they are high on the back cuff.
Also my cuff alingments move. I have them in neutral but the inside ones continue to move one setting. I duct taped them and that keeps them in place. I think a screw to keep in place such as many other boots do, would be an improvement.
Some further thoughts on Mach1 LV v HawxUltra.
I tried both and went with Mach1 120 in December. To be frank I was only able to test Ultra 110, since Ultra 130 were sold out and available as a preorder only.
My main motive was better out of the box feel in Mach1 LV and lack of competent bootfitters near me. Ultras were painful to be in after 5 mins for my feet.
I do not regret my choice, but Mach1 is really heavy compared to HUs. On the other hand the liner on Mach1 is looks and feels way more solid/durable at least compared to HU110. HU130 may have a better liner though.
On a side note, I've purchased Ultra 110W for my wife in February, she loves them and her ski control has improved noticeably.
MinKSome further thoughts on Mach1 LV v HawxUltra.
I tried both and went with Mach1 120 in December. To be frank I was only able to test Ultra 110, since Ultra 130 were sold out and available as a preorder only.
My main motive was better out of the box feel in Mach1 LV and lack of competent bootfitters near me. Ultras were painful to be in after 5 mins for my feet.
I do not regret my choice, but Mach1 is really heavy compared to HUs. On the other hand the liner on Mach1 is looks and feels way more solid/durable at least compared to HU110. HU130 may have a better liner though.
On a side note, I've purchased Ultra 110W for my wife in February, she loves them and her ski control has improved noticeably.
In all fairness to Tecnica, they make great boots. If that fit your foot better, no one is going to fault you for going that direction :) The 110 is definitely a different animal than the 130- obvious stiffness difference, material difference in the cuff, and liner difference. Obviously a boot that is a pound lighter per foot is going to be more maneuverable- I notice it especially while tree skiing, or anywhere where making quick movements is relatively important. I imagine this is partly why your wife's skiing improved as you say- the boot simply lets her get from turn to turn more easily.
After a lot of help from this forum, I wanted to give back with a review of the Hawx Ultra 130s. I just skied them for 4 days straight at Mt. Bachelor -- low 20ks of vertical for the first three days and over 38K of vertical on the last, maybe the most I have logged in a day.
FLEX: I was a little worried that 130 would be too much but it wasn't at all for me (I am 6 feet and a little over 200 lbs). I had no desire to make it softer or stiffer.
FIT: After swapping in the custom foot beds I had made for my previous boots, I visited a boot-fitter for cuff alignment and one small punch for one ankle bone and nothing else -- no liner or shell heat/molding. These fit extremely well and stayed that way day after day -- quite different from the fine-tuning I have had to do with previous race-inspired boots I have owned. Despite the 98 last, somehow, these offer me a bit more room to move the toes without compromising performance. I am guessing that will pay dividends in warmth, but the days I just skied weren't that cold. As I mentioned, I logged more than 38,000 vertical in a single day in them -- that's a lot for me and definitely more than I usually do in a day, but the point is that my previous boots would transition from comfortable to not-comfortable-at-all around 30K, but these just stayed comfortable, consistently, all day.
PERFORMANCE: This is the part that inspired me to write: On the one hand, I can still arc high speed turns on Bachelor's high speed groomers and rolling run-outs as well as I could in any race-inspired boot I have skied. So, all that joy is still there. On the other hand they manage to be more forgiving in crud and the odd terrain surprises that one can find off piste. I always thought a stiff boot meant getting knocked around more in uneven or crud terrain -- but these helped a lot in that category. The precision to arc a ski combined with the forgiveness to go anywhere on the mountain is very cool.
LESSONS LEARNED: 1) While they are insanely comfortable once on and worn in, the way the lower boot pinches my foot on both entry and exit was almost a deal-breaker until my boot-fitter coached me on special techniques, involving pulling the tongue sideways to prevent it from sliding between the two overlapping lower boot pieces and, instead, keep in engaged in pulling one of the overlapping pieces away from the foot. Seriously, I have had many boots that hurt to get on or off, but for me at least, these are something else. But with good instruction, the technique can be learned -- I haven't got it consistently yet, but it works most of the time. (If Atomic comes out with a portable jigged to help open the lower boot for entry and exit, I'll buy it.) 2) Go to a boot fitter to adjust the forward lean to 17 from factory 15 if you wish the extra lean (I did). It is definitely a two person job, nowhere near as easy as Atomic's promotional video might lead one to believe.
BOOT SOLE LENGTH: So, I doubt most care about this, but I think there is a benefit in having a boot sole length that is as short as possible. This is the shortest BSL (310) in a 27.5 boot I have seen, yet I have more room in the toes. I think this helps performance precision, but I could be all wet on that.
COMPARISONS: The two previous race-inspired boots I have liked the most were Tecnica Icon Alu and Raichle Flexon Comp (now returned as Full Tilt boots). Both gave me a lot of great ski days, but I definitely like the Hawx Ultra 130 better.
So, that's my review. I hope someone finds it of use.
SlowGrooveAfter a lot of help from this forum, I wanted to give back with a review of the Hawx Ultra 130s. I just skied them for 4 days straight at Mt. Bachelor -- low 20ks of vertical for the first three days and over 38K of vertical on the last, maybe the most I have logged in a day.
FLEX: I was a little worried that 130 would be too much but it wasn't at all for me (I am 6 feet and a little over 200 lbs). I had no desire to make it softer or stiffer.
FIT: After swapping in the custom foot beds I had made for my previous boots, I visited a boot-fitter for cuff alignment and one small punch for one ankle bone and nothing else -- no liner or shell heat/molding. These fit extremely well and stayed that way day after day -- quite different from the fine-tuning I have had to do with previous race-inspired boots I have owned. Despite the 98 last, somehow, these offer me a bit more room to move the toes without compromising performance. I am guessing that will pay dividends in warmth, but the days I just skied weren't that cold. As I mentioned, I logged more than 38,000 vertical in a single day in them -- that's a lot for me and definitely more than I usually do in a day, but the point is that my previous boots would transition from comfortable to not-comfortable-at-all around 30K, but these just stayed comfortable, consistently, all day.
PERFORMANCE: This is the part that inspired me to write: On the one hand, I can still arc high speed turns on Bachelor's high speed groomers and rolling run-outs as well as I could in any race-inspired boot I have skied. So, all that joy is still there. On the other hand they manage to be more forgiving in crud and the odd terrain surprises that one can find off piste. I always thought a stiff boot meant getting knocked around more in uneven or crud terrain -- but these helped a lot in that category. The precision to arc a ski combined with the forgiveness to go anywhere on the mountain is very cool.
LESSONS LEARNED: 1) While they are insanely comfortable once on and worn in, the way the lower boot pinches my foot on both entry and exit was almost a deal-breaker until my boot-fitter coached me on special techniques, involving pulling the tongue sideways to prevent it from sliding between the two overlapping lower boot pieces and, instead, keep in engaged in pulling one of the overlapping pieces away from the foot. Seriously, I have had many boots that hurt to get on or off, but for me at least, these are something else. But with good instruction, the technique can be learned -- I haven't got it consistently yet, but it works most of the time. (If Atomic comes out with a portable jigged to help open the lower boot for entry and exit, I'll buy it.) 2) Go to a boot fitter to adjust the forward lean to 17 from factory 15 if you wish the extra lean (I did). It is definitely a two person job, nowhere near as easy as Atomic's promotional video might lead one to believe.
BOOT SOLE LENGTH: So, I doubt most care about this, but I think there is a benefit in having a boot sole length that is as short as possible. This is the shortest BSL (310) in a 27.5 boot I have seen, yet I have more room in the toes. I think this helps performance precision, but I could be all wet on that.
COMPARISONS: The two previous race-inspired boots I have liked the most were Tecnica Icon Alu and Raichle Flexon Comp (now returned as Full Tilt boots). Both gave me a lot of great ski days, but I definitely like the Hawx Ultra 130 better.
So, that's my review. I hope someone finds it of use.
Dude thanks for the tip! They pinch me every time and I could not figure out the best way to take them on and off.
I really liked mine for the 5 days I've had on them. Got them fitted out in Breck with a custom footbed and a heat mold. Only thing I'm a little pissed about is that the heat mold makes me dislike the toe box now. I think I like a tight toe box and the heat mold with toe caps just added too much toe room. Not a crazy amount but just more than I think I like. I'll hopefully remold them next year but I didn't care to get them fixed considering I will not be skiing again till next season.
These boots are killer though. Comfy and performed super well for me so far.
SlowGrooveLESSONS LEARNED: 1) While they are insanely comfortable once on and worn in, the way the lower boot pinches my foot on both entry and exit was almost a deal-breaker until my boot-fitter coached me on special techniques, involving pulling the tongue sideways to prevent it from sliding between the two overlapping lower boot pieces and, instead, keep in engaged in pulling one of the overlapping pieces away from the foot. Seriously, I have had many boots that hurt to get on or off, but for me at least, these are something else. But with good instruction, the technique can be learned -- I haven't got it consistently yet, but it works most of the time. (If Atomic comes out with a portable jigged to help open the lower boot for entry and exit, I'll buy it.)
Oh man... I've had the Ultra 110 since January and I still pinch my feet almost every time I try to get them off... But they're just so comfy once you're in!
SlowGrooveBOOT SOLE LENGTH: So, I doubt most care about this, but I think there is a benefit in having a boot sole length that is as short as possible. This is the shortest BSL (310) in a 27.5 boot I have seen, yet I have more room in the toes. I think this helps performance precision, but I could be all wet on that.
Following Backland (which has a 288mm BSL in 26.5), this was something I was super keen to make sure the Ultra had- as short of a BSL as possible without shortening the internal last length. This is important because the shorter your footprint is on the ski, the less the boot will affect the ski's natural flex. A smaller boot will cause less of a "dead" spot where the ski can't flex and while it's only 5mm, every bit helps.
BrawnTrendsOh man... I've had the Ultra 110 since January and I still pinch my feet almost every time I try to get them off... But they're just so comfy once you're in!
The other thing my boot fitter (Powder House in Bend, OR) recommended was Silcone spray -- he said spray the interior of the boot liner every four or five days of skiing to keep it slippery to get your foot in and out as quickly as possible. He added some and it definitely helped (and, in my case, didn't seem to make any difference to how well, for example, my heel stayed put in the boot while skiing). He warned to buy only the pure Silcone stuff, not some mixture with oil in it. The spray, plus the trick to spread the lower cuff pieces by pulling the tongue sideways, not forward, is enough so my feet don't get pinched badly. I also have my DryGuy boot dryers inserted in the boots and plugged into the cigarette lighter in the car on the way to the mountain to ensure the plastic is a slightly more flexible from the warmth when I put them on. I may also start taking them off in the lodge at the end of a cold day, not at the car. Sounds like a lot of work, I know, but honestly the performance and the comfort, once on, is totally worth it. I figure I'll get better at the technique with time. The other option my boot-fitter spoke about was putting the liner on first and then putting foot and liner in the shell all at once, but he wasn't a fan of the approach if it can be avoided, I think because of the added wear on the liners. (I have not tried that with these, so not sure if it works well.) I'd be glad to read any other suggestions (or comments on the Silcone idea) if any have them.
Currently in rx130 lv 27.5 and love how they ski but ive done easily 150+ days in them and really need to replace them.
a shop near me has the 120 on a super good deal, i was thinking of chucking the 2nd bolt in the back and throwing on a booster strap, in terms of performance, how close do you think that'll get me to how my RX130s ski?
I appreciate i might lose a little performance as im dropping quite abit of weight but dont want to sacrifice too much just for the sake of a slightly lighter boot for hiking and the odd short tour.
JibbaTheHuttCurrently in rx130 lv 27.5 and love how they ski but ive done easily 150+ days in them and really need to replace them.
a shop near me has the 120 on a super good deal, i was thinking of chucking the 2nd bolt in the back and throwing on a booster strap, in terms of performance, how close do you think that'll get me to how my RX130s ski?
I appreciate i might lose a little performance as im dropping quite abit of weight but dont want to sacrifice too much just for the sake of a slightly lighter boot for hiking and the odd short tour.
All the Lange 130 LVs that I have had on my feet recently feel slightly softer than our Ultra 130 at room temperature. And at about -20°C the Lange feels slightly stiffer, and our flex-testing robot confirms both of these.
Compared to the Ultra 120, the Ultra 130 has two bolts in the back, and the lower shell is slightly stiffer than the lower shell of the 120. So, if you get a 120, add the second bolt in the back and put on a stiffer Booster strap, it will feel close to the 130 but not quite since the lower shell is not the same.
Ultimately, it will be close to a 130 but not exact. How did they feel during a carpet test? Make sure you do that and try your Langes side by side.
scottydonaldwith all the talk of adding a booster strap to these boots, why is it not standard or a semi booster strap like the rester boots???
You'd be surprised how many complaints we get on a global level about people not knowing how to operate the metal buckle on these types of straps. When I first joined Atomic, I spec'ed a buckle-type strap on all 130 level boots (Tracker, Burner, and Hawx) for a couple of years. Turns out that many retailers were having to remove the strap and install a normal velcro strap because people (non-racers) didn't want to be hassled figuring out how to work it. It was a crash course in realizing just how different the markets are between North America and Europe/Asia. Everything in Europe needs to be easy to use and convenient and simple, and that is 70% of the ski market. So, when a large segment of the largest market complains, we need to follow suit.
Personally, I love these straps and think they are even easier to use than a normal velcro strap. I put them on all of my boots. If you are interested in them, they are available as a spare part through your local Atomic retailer and can be installed on pretty much any ski boot.
