Another teacher-student sex debacle.

S.J.Wconsent can be retracted at any time.

yea fuck this. and fuck you for saying this. know how many guys' lives have been ruined from girls saying 'he raped me because I regretted it after'?

Consent cannot be retracted after the fact.



If this had happened in Canada she would only loose her job and that's it. It would be 100% legal. It's fucked that she's getting nearly 1/4 century for a consensual act.

Those people are old enough to join the military, and are certainly old enough to give consent. There's a reason consent is 16 in most reasonable first world countries. But I guess we're talking about a country with a drinking age of 21.

.lenconMaybe they chose 22 years because by the time she gets out she won't have the hotness to seduce anyone. You know, with natural aging, prison fights, and all that good stuff.

A few shankings here and there

S.J.WThere's a reason most colleges and universities don't allow teacher/student relationships. And it's due to the power dynamic of the class room. Consent can not be given to the full extent under the law if someone holds authority over you. It's simple. Yes students know what they're doing and no this teacher didn't force herself upon her students in the cliche rape type situation. However rape is when someone doesn't give consent to the full extent. 100% (different states different meanings). So when someone is drunk, coerced, pressured, scared or someone is a teacher it's rape. Plain and simple. This teacher doesn't get off free because she's hot. That's a slippery slope to allow rapists to get off on the level of their attractiveness, as well it's not equal.

Rape is very rarely where someone physically over powers someone. Rape often happens between people that know each other. It may even start off as consensual between partners. But consent should never be assumed, consent must be a clear yes, and consent can be retracted at any time. It's not a hard concept to figure out.

If I banged Christy Clark when I was blackout drunk I wouldn't call it rape. I still have more power to stop the action than her even though she's the premiere of BC. The fact I didn't stop it obviously means I wanted to do it at the time. How on earth do you think it's reasonable to use being drunk as an excuse for having sex? You would honestly send someone to prison for a very long time because you were drunk and had consensual sex? You are responsible for your choice to get drunk, responsible for everything you do when you're drunk, and responsible for dealing with the dumb shit afterwards when you sober up.

I know it's the American way to put the blame on someone else through any means necessary, I suppose you support those sex contracts mentioned in the other thread eh. They're trying to raise a generation of cowards by allowing people to sue anyone for anything and completely evade any accountability for their lack of common sense.

If she wasn't hot I would probably just have slightly less respect for the students, but I know where respect is due and I can't say I've ever plowed a teacher so I'd still be pretty stoked for these kids.

VinnieFyea fuck this. and fuck you for saying this. know how many guys' lives have been ruined from girls saying 'he raped me because I regretted it after'?

Consent cannot be retracted after the fact.



If this had happened in Canada she would only loose her job and that's it. It would be 100% legal. It's fucked that she's getting nearly 1/4 century for a consensual act.

Those people are old enough to join the military, and are certainly old enough to give consent. There's a reason consent is 16 in most reasonable first world countries. But I guess we're talking about a country with a drinking age of 21.

I never said consent can be retracted after the fact. If you went to the police and said this man raped me and said it was consensual throughout the entire act then only later decided when the act was done that it wasn't consensual then you have no grounds for a rape claim. Anyways only 2% of rape claims are false, and on top of that only 6% are reported to the police, so even if you were to rape a girl. Chances are, you won't even go to jail. As apposed to 1 in 5 woman experiencing some form of sexual assault in their life time.


I don't care if those boys are old enough to join the militarily of drive a car or whatever. Teachers are held to a higher standard in society and she's abusing that power of trust. I'm glad she got 22 years fuck that bitch and fuck any teacher who think it's okay to have sex with their students. And if you think it's okay for a student to fuck their students even if it's "consensual" then you'er a fucking idiot.

erikKIf I banged Christy Clark when I was blackout drunk I wouldn't call it rape. I still have more power to stop the action than her even though she's the premiere of BC. The fact I didn't stop it obviously means I wanted to do it at the time. How on earth do you think it's reasonable to use being drunk as an excuse for having sex? You would honestly send someone to prison for a very long time because you were drunk and had consensual sex? You are responsible for your choice to get drunk, responsible for everything you do when you're drunk, and responsible for dealing with the dumb shit afterwards when you sober up.

I know it's the American way to put the blame on someone else through any means necessary, I suppose you support those sex contracts mentioned in the other thread eh. They're trying to raise a generation of cowards by allowing people to sue anyone for anything and completely evade any accountability for their lack of common sense.

If she wasn't hot I would probably just have slightly less respect for the students, but I know where respect is due and I can't say I've ever plowed a teacher so I'd still be pretty stoked for these kids.

If you were drunk to an extent where you could be manipulated, and your friend used that and coerced you into signing a contract which stated that all of your property and money is his, you would honour that contract???

S.J.WIf you were drunk to an extent where you could be manipulated, and your friend used that and coerced you into signing a contract which stated that all of your property and money is his, you would honour that contract???

??? Yes of course I would honour it. I signed a contract and have no other choice. If you don't want to be manipulated don't willingly put yourself in a position to be manipulated. Christ.

erikK??? Yes of course I would honour it. I signed a contract and have no other choice. If you don't want to be manipulated don't willingly put yourself in a position to be manipulated. Christ.

Okay that's the biggest bullshit statement I've ever heard. No you wouldn't honour it. You could fight it in court and you would win because of your level of drunkness and your friends manipulation.

S.J.WOkay that's the biggest bullshit statement I've ever heard. No you wouldn't honour it. You could fight it in court and you would win because of your level of drunkness and your friends manipulation.

That's the most American statement I've ever heard, screw up and take the bastard to court! Fuck yeah!!! Spill hot coffee on yourself and take the coffee company to court!!!!!

erikKThat's the most American statement I've ever heard, screw up and take the bastard to court! Fuck yeah!!! Spill hot coffee on yourself and take the coffee company to court!!!!!

I'm Australian and we have the least amount of civil claims per capita in the OECD. However, when someone has wronged you have the tools at your disposal to claim what is yours and take justice. Anyways, your actions don't get to determine the actions of every girl who has been raped.

S.J.WI never said consent can be retracted after the fact. If you went to the police and said this man raped me and said it was consensual throughout the entire act then only later decided when the act was done that it wasn't consensual then you have no grounds for a rape claim. Anyways only 2% of rape claims are false, and on top of that only 6% are reported to the police, so even if you were to rape a girl. Chances are, you won't even go to jail. As apposed to 1 in 5 woman experiencing some form of sexual assault in their life time.


I don't care if those boys are old enough to join the militarily of drive a car or whatever. Teachers are held to a higher standard in society and she's abusing that power of trust. I'm glad she got 22 years fuck that bitch and fuck any teacher who think it's okay to have sex with their students. And if you think it's okay for a student to fuck their students even if it's "consensual" then you'er a fucking idiot.


Yes. If a teacher wants to have sex with a consenting student that should absolutely be legal. Just like any other person in society, so long as it's consensual then there should be no criminal charges what so ever. Whether she should loose her job is a totally different matter. She should absolutely loose her job because it's totally unprofessional.

It's no OK, but it also shouldn't be criminal. It's not OK to sleep with your boss, but it's not criminal. It's not OK for a professor or TA to sleep with students but it's also not criminal. So long as all parties are consensual and of age. Very unfortunate in her case the age of consent wasn't a logical 16 like it is in most forward thinking countries.

It sucks for her she decided to do it in a place with an unfortunately high age of consent.

VinnieFYes. If a teacher wants to have sex with a consenting student that should absolutely be legal. Just like any other person in society, so long as it's consensual then there should be no criminal charges what so ever. Whether she should loose her job is a totally different matter. She should absolutely loose her job because it's totally unprofessional.

It's no OK, but it also shouldn't be criminal. It's not OK to sleep with your boss, but it's not criminal. It's not OK for a professor or TA to sleep with students but it's also not criminal. So long as all parties are consensual and of age. Very unfortunate in her case the age of consent wasn't a logical 16 like it is in most forward thinking countries.

It sucks for her she decided to do it in a place with an unfortunately high age of consent.

Then you are a fucking idiot. I'm going to guess you're my ageish around 18, 19 and if you want to have your little schoolboy fantasy of fucking a teacher, go right ahead. But it still doesn't change the fact that what she did was illegal and should be illegal. Larry Morris put it rather nicely, in his book Dangerous Women: Why Mothers, Daughters, and Sisters Become Stalkers, Molesters, and Murderers.

"But most of these women come from conflict-ridden families where they didn't learn healthy social skills. Many learned to get their emotional needs—for love, attention, approval—met through sexual behavior." Once they start teaching, if faced with some kind of serious stressor (marital problems, for example) in addition to the right child sitting in their class, it's not a far leap to sex offender"

A teacher having sex with their students isn't about sex. It's about using those children to fill an empty spot in their heart. To fix their emotional scars they once had. This is why we need to protect children and should sure as hell be illegal for a teacher to fuck a student. Can you imagine if you were a parent and you found out your son or daughter had sex with a teacher and was basically used so said teacher wouldn't feel like shit? Yeah, it would make you angry because that teacher has abused your trust, manipulated their power and used your kid.

S.J.WA teacher having sex with their students isn't about sex. It's about using those children to fill an empty spot in their heart. To fix their emotional scars they once had. This is why we need to protect children and should sure as hell be illegal for a teacher to fuck a student. Can you imagine if you were a parent and you found out your son or daughter had sex with a teacher and was basically used so said teacher wouldn't feel like shit? Yeah, it would make you angry because that teacher has abused your trust, manipulated their power and used your kid.

"Fuckin rights son, you banged that hot crazy bitch AND got her ass fired? Let me buy you a beer and take some advice from you."

An 18 year old isn't a child, they're young men in the prime of their life trying to spread their seed as wide as possible. Pretty natural in mammals

erikK"Fuckin rights son, you banged that hot crazy bitch AND got her ass fired? Let me buy you a beer and take some advice from you."

An 18 year old isn't a child, they're young men in the prime of their life trying to spread their seed as wide as possible. Pretty natural in mammals

You want to legalise student-teacher relationships? Go ahead, but just know that you'll be undermining the whole profession. Students won't look at their teachers as their authority. They'll look at them like any other man looks at a female at a bar. Legalising student-teacher relationships would single handling ruin the entire education system.

S.J.WThen you are a fucking idiot. I'm going to guess you're my ageish around 18, 19 and if you want to have your little schoolboy fantasy of fucking a teacher, go right ahead. But it still doesn't change the fact that what she did was illegal and should be illegal. Larry Morris put it rather nicely, in his book Dangerous Women: Why Mothers, Daughters, and Sisters Become Stalkers, Molesters, and Murderers.

"But most of these women come from conflict-ridden families where they didn't learn healthy social skills. Many learned to get their emotional needs—for love, attention, approval—met through sexual behavior." Once they start teaching, if faced with some kind of serious stressor (marital problems, for example) in addition to the right child sitting in their class, it's not a far leap to sex offender"

A teacher having sex with their students isn't about sex. It's about using those children to fill an empty spot in their heart. To fix their emotional scars they once had. This is why we need to protect children and should sure as hell be illegal for a teacher to fuck a student. Can you imagine if you were a parent and you found out your son or daughter had sex with a teacher and was basically used so said teacher wouldn't feel like shit? Yeah, it would make you angry because that teacher has abused your trust, manipulated their power and used your kid.

-My age has nothing to do with this.

-My fantasies or lack of fantasies has nothing to do with this.

-The urges for the sex has nothing to do with this, and on top of that you have no idea whether she just likes having sex with young

-Don't call them children, they're not children (biologically). They're your age. They're pretty much fully developed human beings. They do not need protecting.

-Yes they may abuse their power and trust and anything else, but that doesn't mean it should be illegal. Should a boss who gives a promotion for sex face criminal charges? Should your best friend having sex after consoling your recent ex face criminal charges? Should a doctor having sex with a patient face criminal charges?

No. Maybe loose jobs or be told they're cunts, but there is nothing criminal about consensual sex.

This is what you are completely failing to understand. This was consensual. This was completely and 100% consensual. Doesn't matter what the circumstances are the guys could always have just said 'no'. They would even have had to go out of their way to be able to have sex with her. They aren't 13. They're 17. US is one of the only 1st world countries that doesn't think a 17 year old can make their own decisions about their sexuality.

She did abuse her power and trust and what not, so yes she should loose her job. Maybe a fine. But criminal? That's a bit much. 22 years? That's what you might get for murdering a friend in cold blood who slept with your wife. Completely outrageous.

So long as both parties are old enough to make their own decisions and are both completely consensual then we have no business with what they do in their bedrooms. (Canada fails at this with having anal illegal till 18).

Adam.GuareA few shankings here and there

Exactly. Someone else who understands prison logic

S.J.WYou want to legalise student-teacher relationships? Go ahead, but just know that you'll be undermining the whole profession. Students won't look at their teachers as their authority. They'll look at them like any other man looks at a female at a bar. Legalising student-teacher relationships would single handling ruin the entire education system.

Preeeetty sure they aren't illegal in Canada as it is as long as the student is of legal age. Although I will admit we have a pretty terrible education system, I don't think those laws are the reason why. Its not like the relationships are allowed by the schools and whatnot.

VinnieFThis is what you are completely failing to understand. This was consensual. This was completely and 100% consensual. Doesn't matter what the circumstances are the guys could always have just said 'no'. They would even have had to go out of their way to be able to have sex with her. They aren't 13. They're 17. US is one of the only 1st world countries that doesn't think a 17 year old can make their own decisions about their sexuality.

She did abuse her power and trust and what not, so yes she should loose her job. Maybe a fine. But criminal? That's a bit much. 22 years? That's what you might get for murdering a friend in cold blood who slept with your wife. Completely outrageous.

You are very wrong.

It is an imbalance of power, the same way a supervisor having sex with his subordinates is a form of abuse.

When you wish to exit that relationship, you have a conflict of interests, where you wishing to do so, can be an issue for your success. This applies to a teacher-student relationship in the same way it would for a supervisor-subordinate relationship.

Denying the person with power can have negative consequences. Sure these boys wanted it, but the law exists for a reason.

As to the amount of time, the initial sentencing is large but as it is a non violent crime she likely will be allowed to get out way before that, as a sex offender.

ndyeYou are very wrong.

It is an imbalance of power, the same way a supervisor having sex with his subordinates is a form of abuse.

When you wish to exit that relationship, you have a conflict of interests, where you wishing to do so, can be an issue for your success. This applies to a teacher-student relationship in the same way it would for a supervisor-subordinate relationship.

Denying the person with power can have negative consequences. Sure these boys wanted it, but the law exists for a reason.

As to the amount of time, the initial sentencing is large but as it is a non violent crime she likely will be allowed to get out way before that, as a sex offender.

"The same way a supervisor having sex with his subordinates is a form of abuse"

You just completely supported his point. Does a supervisor get sent to jail for having sex with a subordinate? No. They get fired. That is it. Done. End of story.

So all of you people arguing that this is so wrong.... let me get this straight.... A person who is 17 years 364 days is not capable of giving consent but a person who is 18 years 1 day is capable of giving consent? Is there some magic switch that flips on your 18th birthday?

No, there isn't a switch but is is the "law" so you better toss her in jail for 22 years.

jensen"The same way a supervisor having sex with his subordinates is a form of abuse"

You just completely supported his point. Does a supervisor get sent to jail for having sex with a subordinate? No. They get fired. That is it. Done. End of story.

So all of you people arguing that this is so wrong.... let me get this straight.... A person who is 17 years 364 days is not capable of giving consent but a person who is 18 years 1 day is capable of giving consent? Is there some magic switch that flips on your 18th birthday?

No, there isn't a switch but is is the "law" so you better toss her in jail for 22 years.

Im saying thats why its wrong, except because these people were 17, something she was well aware of, she actually commited rape. And yes, I think a teacher fucking her students is wrong on a whole level, if the genders were switched it would be a non story and not discussed.
The male pig would go to jail

erikKIf I banged Christy Clark when I was blackout drunk I wouldn't call it rape. I still have more power to stop the action than her even though she's the premiere of BC. The fact I didn't stop it obviously means I wanted to do it at the time. How on earth do you think it's reasonable to use being drunk as an excuse for having sex? You would honestly send someone to prison for a very long time because you were drunk and had consensual sex? You are responsible for your choice to get drunk, responsible for everything you do when you're drunk, and responsible for dealing with the dumb shit afterwards when you sober up.

I know it's the American way to put the blame on someone else through any means necessary, I suppose you support those sex contracts mentioned in the other thread eh. They're trying to raise a generation of cowards by allowing people to sue anyone for anything and completely evade any accountability for their lack of common sense.

If she wasn't hot I would probably just have slightly less respect for the students, but I know where respect is due and I can't say I've ever plowed a teacher so I'd still be pretty stoked for these kids.

Crying rape because you regretted drunk sex is absolutely terrible.

However, don't people have a right to go out and get blackout drunk if they want to without fearing for their safety? I think they should. I'm not saying its a good idea, but people should be allowed to do whatever they want to their bodies and feel safe. The issue is not as black and white as you make it - have you even ever been drunk? Everything is different, and one can easily be more vulnerable and submissive to coercion. Someone is much more likely to give a lukewarm "I don't think so" and be pressured into doing things they don't want to do when they're drunk; if they were sober, they could give a hard "No" and dip. I think it's a very gray area, but I think your hardline stance is outright ridiculous.

I don't want frivolous lawsuits out the ass either. However, the solution is NOT to remove people's legal rights when people get drunk.

VinnieF-Yes they may abuse their power and trust and anything else, but that doesn't mean it should be illegal. Should a boss who gives a promotion for sex face criminal charges? Should your best friend having sex after consoling your recent ex face criminal charges? Should a doctor having sex with a patient face criminal charges?

No. Maybe loose jobs or be told they're cunts, but there is nothing criminal about consensual sex.

This is what you are completely failing to understand. This was consensual. This was completely and 100% consensual. Doesn't matter what the circumstances are the guys could always have just said 'no'. They would even have had to go out of their way to be able to have sex with her. They aren't 13. They're 17. US is one of the only 1st world countries that doesn't think a 17 year old can make their own decisions about their sexuality.

She did abuse her power and trust and what not, so yes she should loose her job. Maybe a fine. But criminal? That's a bit much. 22 years? That's what you might get for murdering a friend in cold blood who slept with your wife. Completely outrageous.

So long as both parties are old enough to make their own decisions and are both completely consensual then we have no business with what they do in their bedrooms. (Canada fails at this with having anal illegal till 18).

I'm normally on the same page as you on all issues, but I wholly disagree here (though I see what you're saying). I understand that sex can be just sex, and when you strip it down to the bare bones, it's just two (or more) people doin' it. YOLO.

However, I think that if your profession is to make money from a position of trust, it is a serious conflict of interest to engage in a sexual relationship with those who are trusting you. I have no evidence, but I'd guess that in those situations you described (and for sure in the OP), the person in the position of trust is the initiator. She knew that these guys would not say no. She even had enough power over them to force them to lie to everybody about it (there was obviously some period of no one talking, because she managed to get it with five different people before getting caught). The power imbalance automatically skews everything, and it's no longer "just sex" between consenting adults.

That said, I do agree that 22 years is absolutely outrageous, but I think criminal court is appropriate.

Fuckin' unreal. There should be more teachers like her.

VinnieFThis is what you are completely failing to understand. This was consensual. This was completely and 100% consensual. Doesn't matter what the circumstances are the guys could always have just said 'no'. They would even have had to go out of their way to be able to have sex with her. They aren't 13. They're 17. US is one of the only 1st world countries that doesn't think a 17 year old can make their own decisions about their sexuality.

She did abuse her power and trust and what not, so yes she should loose her job. Maybe a fine. But criminal? That's a bit much. 22 years? That's what you might get for murdering a friend in cold blood who slept with your wife. Completely outrageous.

So long as both parties are old enough to make their own decisions and are both completely consensual then we have no business with what they do in their bedrooms. (Canada fails at this with having anal illegal till 18).

And what you're failing to realise is that even though it appears to be consensual it wasn't. Consent can not be given under the law when there's a power dynamic involved. (teacher-student). That's the law, and so it should be. Teachers rarely have sex with students beacuse they feel affection for them. Teachers most of the time have sex with their students because they have mental health issues.

erikKPreeeetty sure they aren't illegal in Canada as it is as long as the student is of legal age. Although I will admit we have a pretty terrible education system, I don't think those laws are the reason why. Its not like the relationships are allowed by the schools and whatnot.

Here are the laws surrounding consent with regards to age.

16-18 years old- are able to consent EXCEPT when partner is in position of authority
14-15 years old – are able to consent IF close in age partner is < 5 years (and partner not in position of authority or exploitative relationship) OR married/ preexisting common-law relationship
12-13 years old- able to consent IF close in age partner is < 2 years (and partner is not in position of authority or exploitative relationship)
Children

altzujungI don't really understand how anyone can not think this is nuts.

17 is above the age of consent in the vast majority of the world. Hell it's legal for people under the age of 23 to have sex with 17 year olds in Florida, where this took place.

I'm not saying there is no wrongdoing here, she's a teacher and has a moral duty not to do something so obviously inappropriate with her students. She should for sure lose her job and never be allowed to be in a position of influence over minors again, but realistically that's where it should stop, perhaps a short sentence.

There is no evidence anywhere in that article that she is in any sense a rapist. Partly this is a problem with the definition of rape/statuatory rape in the US. Rape means forcibly having sex with another individual without consent. Fine, makes sense up to this point. But the idea that a 17 year old, boy or girl, is incapable of consenting to sex is ludicrous.

Most of you here are probably over 17 (he says in hope). Think back, at that time, do you really feel you were incapable of consenting to sex? Do you really feel having sex with an attractive 30 year old woman or man would have caused you long term mental/physical damage? I sure as hell would have managed. I had a girlfriend a fair bit older (though not 30) and more experienced than me, when I was that age (totally legal where I'm from) and I certainly don't feel damaged. The idea that was rape is ridiculous. A legal system where a 17 year old 'consents' to sex, yet this is somehow considered rape, because he/she is supposedly incapable of doing so, is laughable.

I do understand that it's the law, but it's a stupid law, and as a result, there are men and women rotting in jail, branded as rapists/paedophiles, for doing stupid but not unforgivable things, because of what is essentially, human instinct. She fucked up given the law, her job and role as an educator, but that does not mean she deserves to spend the rest of her life in a cell.

This. When I was 17 I met this great 26 year old women we would hang out and smoke as friends, we became really close and started dating, we still are I'm now 23 and she is 32, have been living with here for 5 years. She is my best friend and the most important person in my life I am completly open with her about anything and everything, was I taken advantage of absolutely not. I will most likely end up marrying her and spending the rest of my life with her. My friends and family were always supportive of it, never once was told it was creepy if anything I'd get props lol, years ago I got a pajama set for Christmas from my parents that said cougar hunter and had a image of a cougar in cross hairs all over them hahah

Havent read anything in here, but here's what it comes down to, we don't know what actually happend. A kid in 8th grade can definitely be raped and just because you would have sex with her doesn't mean a 13 or 14 was ready and willing if an older woman said hey f*** me I honestly don't know if I would have done it when I was 14.

Now putting the one eighth grader accusation aside at the age of 17 you probably do know if you do or don't want to have sex. However, inexperienced your sex life is having a teacher take control of it while in a position of power and they can really leverage that over you is a problem. What if the kid wanted it to stop you think you could have just walked away and it all would have been fine, and it would be a very stupid thing to do while you're teaching them it's both morally and ethically wrong and she should have just waited until the year was over. In these discussions a lot of people come down to the argument of she's too hot to rape someone which is just silly.

Men can get raped too

jensen"The same way a supervisor having sex with his subordinates is a form of abuse"

You just completely supported his point. Does a supervisor get sent to jail for having sex with a subordinate? No. They get fired. That is it. Done. End of story.

Incorrect in the military they will be arrested and charged with rape. And that hypothetical supervisor could be sued and arrested very easily.

mirozCrying rape because you regretted drunk sex is absolutely terrible.

However, don't people have a right to go out and get blackout drunk if they want to without fearing for their safety? I think they should. I'm not saying its a good idea, but people should be allowed to do whatever they want to their bodies and feel safe. The issue is not as black and white as you make it - have you even ever been drunk? Everything is different, and one can easily be more vulnerable and submissive to coercion. Someone is much more likely to give a lukewarm "I don't think so" and be pressured into doing things they don't want to do when they're drunk; if they were sober, they could give a hard "No" and dip. I think it's a very gray area, but I think your hardline stance is outright ridiculous.

I don't want frivolous lawsuits out the ass either. However, the solution is NOT to remove people's legal rights when people get drunk.

Yes, I've been blackout drunk and done extremely stupid shit that had serious repercussions wayyy too many times. I definitely should not still be drinking after some of the shit I have done while intoxicated. I've always dealt with the consequences the next day though; usually I have a hard time believing the stories of what happened from my friends but I trust that they remember what happened better than I do. I hold full accountability for my actions when I'm drunk and think it's outright ridiculous to try to get out of something because you were drinking. I stand by this as long as the person had a choice on whether or not to drink. I don't see where I'm suggesting removing people's legal rights. Drunk people aren't above the law.

I'm not implying I think it's okay to have sex with someone when they're passed out or incoherent, I'm hoping you didn't take that away from my previous posts...?

S.J.WHere are the laws surrounding consent with regards to age.

16-18 years old- are able to consent EXCEPT when partner is in position of authority
14-15 years old – are able to consent IF close in age partner is < 5 years (and partner not in position of authority or exploitative relationship) OR married/ preexisting common-law relationship
12-13 years old- able to consent IF close in age partner is < 2 years (and partner is not in position of authority or exploitative relationship)
Children

Alright I was wrong about the law, sure, I'm not a lawyer. I think that's a bullshit law and I know for a fact if I was 18 and had the chance to bang a hot 22 year old teacher I would most definitely be able to consent, in my opinion, which should be all that matters considering I'd be the so called victim. The fact that she's a teacher wouldn't have an influence on me.


At any rate this thread has gone from me trying to stir shit up with mrs social justice there to an internet argument that I don't care enough about so I'm done with the long posts

erikKYes, I've been blackout drunk and done extremely stupid shit that had serious repercussions wayyy too many times. I definitely should not still be drinking after some of the shit I have done while intoxicated. I've always dealt with the consequences the next day though; usually I have a hard time believing the stories of what happened from my friends but I trust that they remember what happened better than I do. I hold full accountability for my actions when I'm drunk and think it's outright ridiculous to try to get out of something because you were drinking. I stand by this as long as the person had a choice on whether or not to drink. I don't see where I'm suggesting removing people's legal rights. Drunk people aren't above the law.

I'm not implying I think it's okay to have sex with someone when they're passed out or incoherent, I'm hoping you didn't take that away from my previous posts...?

Let me pose to you a scenario. I know "what if" situations are not a good way at all to get a point across but I'm tired so I'll go for it.

You get blackout drunk with your friends, but you somehow find yourself alone at the bar. A pretty ugly chick comes up to you. Normally, you would never talk to this girl, but she's pretty insistent. You can tell she's not as drunk as you are. You try to leave the bar alone to go home but she insists on walking you out and walking you home. You're drunk so you don't think too much about it, figuring you can shake her when you get back to her place. However, when you get there, she insists on unlocking the doors for you, and walks you into your apartment. She starts making moves on you and you try to push her away, but she calls you a little bitch for not being down to bone. That hurts - you've always thought you were hot shit, down for anything. Still, you don't really want to have sex with this really pushy girl. She's still making moves, and after a good bit of this back and forth bullshit, you end up having sex with her, just hoping to get her off your case.

That's not just drunk decision making. And it's not taking advantage of a passed out person. The protagonist in the above was clearly pressured into making a decision that they didn't want to have to make. If it doesn't seem unrealistic because of the sexes of the characters, just switch 'em up. There are infinite different versions of this story that span a huge gray area. I just don't think it's so black and white that you can say that all drunk people need to be responsible for their "actions." Certainly, alcohol can play a role in sexual assault/rape. It inhibits decision making and brain function, so when you're in a situation like the above, many available options don't seem so clear.

You're absolutely right in that alcohol alone can't be the only factor. It's true, to some extent, that drunk actions reveal sober thoughts. You can't just blame alcohol for getting drunk and having sex with that person you secretly had a thing for but were too embarrassed to tell your friends about. But that's not rape. However, I think that the above scenario is rape, and unless I've grossly misunderstood your argument, you disagree?