Welcome to the Newschoolers forums! You may read the forums as a guest, however you must be a registered member to post. Register to become a member today!
zzzskizzzAre you trying to say women today are going through the same thing as people facing racial discrimination today? I can't believe you just played the pregnancy can be painful and inconvenient for the woman card. why don't you try something impossible and have a kid without someone dumping a load inside of you, I mean this from the bottom of my heart cry me a fucking River.
Sometime in the future we will be able to have a child be born in the lab without the need of a mother having to carry it then what's your argument, only then both parents should have an equal right in saying who should gets the kid? At the end of the day it's half of the mans DNA and half of the mothers DNA it shouldn't come down to who carried it in side of them, in divorce court it should come down to who can raise the child better, because believe it or not life isn't all about you and what you want.
SFBthis video does not reflect my views
https://www.newschoolers.com/videos/watch/763800/MEN-ARE-BETTER-THAN-WOMEN
DingoSeanShe was speaking about why men should never be given any say as far as what women should do with their bodies, idiot. She was speaking to the level of the abortion debate. Everything she said has complete merit. Everything you said needs to be punched in the face.
As for that second statement... That shit's alll hypothetical as fuck. I hope that never happens, and if it does (by which time, I have a feeling that marriage and religion will be a relic of the past) I'm sure Laws will have progressed to suit such a situation adequately and be able to offer the child the best upbringing it can...
However, if a mother carries that child for 9 months, you sure as mother fucking bet it should come down to that. If the woman actually cannot raise the child better and it's proven, then custody does go to the father - this is a common occurrence (I mean, if she's on fucking meth, and raising the child in a dumpster... the law will never side with that), I don't understand why it's thought of as a situation that never happens.
zzzskizzzI reread the post she quoted and it was about women getting favored in divorce court. I didn't see anything in there about abortion, but maybe I miss something, and yeah abortion should exist everywhere forever, I'm not going to try to argue that because it's a stupid thing to believe. surrogates actually do exist so that within itself makes the argument invalid. Women whether they can raise the child better or worse get favorable treatment in family and divorce court. I'm not even going to try to argue that with you, you're welcome to try to find me a credible source that states otherwise.
zzzskizzzI reread the post she quoted and it was about women getting favored in divorce court. I didn't see anything in there about abortion, but maybe I miss something, and yeah abortion should exist everywhere forever, I'm not going to try to argue that because it's a stupid thing to believe. surrogates actually do exist so that within itself makes the argument invalid. Women whether they can raise the child better or worse get favorable treatment in family and divorce court. I'm not even going to try to argue that with you, you're welcome to try to find me a credible source that states otherwise.
zzzskizzzThank you for admitting there's a problem with it, that's all I wanted to hear. You're right it is getting much better with time, however if there are a lot of women that do feel entitled to the children because they carry them. Which as hard as it is to give birth, I think we can both agree is not true.
As I stated before women definitely have it worse. But I don't like it when girls talk about them being feminists, and want equality for everyone. Then go off and bash everything men do and only want to push their agenda for women. Just be honest you want to push your own agenda and you want rights for women and yourself, you don't care about the rights or inequality of the other gender. Which is fine make life better for yourself it's the American way. but if women really think the only problem men face today is "being made fun of when they become a flight attendants." they clearly don't understand the whole social picture. and I'm sure in a hundred years when everyone is considered equal, these groups will die out and won't ask for anything more.
ANDR01DJust to put it out there, my parents got divorced when I was 7 and the lion's share of custody was given to my dad (saw my mom every other weekend). My mom was not a meth head, or a felon, she is actually a very successful veterinarian. My dad just had the backing of mutual friends who recommended that he get custody.
DingoSeanI've already stated in this thread that it's an issue... miles ago... You're good at not reading.
Women should feel entitled to a child if they carry them. If they're obviously a shithead mother, or there's a good reason the father should take custody, than the courts will decide that way...
How often do you actually come into contact with these feminists? I have the feeling you're just coming up with ideas based on others perceived experiences with women.
In 100 years, everyone will still not have the equality they deserve. I mean, you think in 100 years the planet will weed out the ISIS motherfuckers? We haven't even weeded out the KKK here in America and it's been well over 100 years.
That is why this struggle must continue and why I, you, and every other male, female, queer, transgender etc need feminism.
zzzskizzzI see them quite a lot of my life there are a lot of girls who run around back home when in was in New York City for the summer and on college campuses. and I also grew up with four sisters two of them are feminists, one's pretty extreme the others not bad, and they have friends. So don't even start with me, if you really believe extreme feminists don't exist then you clearly have some sort of bias. of course in a hundred years we won't be a utopia I never said that. But in a hundred years women will be much closer to equality with men. when you have a base that's just girls and your only objective is to get more rights for yourself and no one else. what do you think that'll turn you into I set it up top we need to have a group with everyone in it fighting for equality for everyone. women feminists just divide themselves from men and in there lies the problem.
Dolan.Escobar1, understanding that women can assault a man with virtually 0 repercussions while a man hitting back carries huge repercussions is not a cop out.
2. Im not talking about women business owners. Im talking about the relative contribution to science and technology between men and women. Is it 2 to 1? 3 to 1? 10 to 1?
No its more like 100 to 1. Let that marinate as you flip through a physics textbook, skipping past hundreds of male innovators searching desperately for your one female innovator who you will parade around saying "look, women have had just as much impact on the stem fields as men!"
In hard engineering youll have just as hard of a time digging for female contribution to the building of smart phones, cars, and tbms.
You need better excuses dingo!
3. Prenups are not the norm. I dont know what recess of your rectum you pulled that authoritative statement from but your gonna have a hard time selling that shit stinking propaganda to anyone with a brain.
4. Ive had lots of girls ask me if i wanted to buy them a drink. Its not out of style yet. Maybe chicken wings will work better haha
Basically youre fighting a losing battle. I got nothing against you, but the reason that its such an uphill battle for you is because the facts are not on your side. Your brazen bullshitting only serves to alienate people from your position, as do the petty insults.
People here arent your sheep. You think you can outsmart everybody here to the point that everybody cries "eureka dingo, woman are so oppressed!" but you cant.
People arent stupid, especially on ns, which is why ur bs isnt gonna fly very far. But keep trying. You get an a for effort.
ScaredwhiteboyYour point about women in science is on point. Go to your local university, walk into an any engineering class, and count the women. Now walk into a womens-studies class and do the same thing. The reason women get paid worse than men on average is because they chose to get a degree in complaining about men instead of a degree in a high-paying field. If you compare salaries for men and women in the same field, women are actually paid better.
ScaredwhiteboyYour point about women in science is on point. Go to your local university, walk into an any engineering class, and count the women. Now walk into a womens-studies class and do the same thing. The reason women get paid worse than men on average is because they chose to get a degree in complaining about men instead of a degree in a high-paying field. If you compare salaries for men and women in the same field, women are actually paid better.
zzzskizzz^ its not smoking mirrors and that's what you and all the feminists aren't getting. women don't have it equal and are being oppressed in the sense that they have a much harder time getting into those fields. A much harder time getting help and support with the education in those fields, and it's much more difficult for a woman to not raise a family and keep a continuous career in that field. however, if those problems were to fix themselves and we look at the few women that do not have that problem some times they make even more than men. what women need to realize is once their education and resources for those fields get fixed they will not be making less money because they are a woman.
zzzskizzzPaying people less based on gender or race is illegal. You seem to not be able to realize there's a lot more to be somebody's salary then what gender they are. When you take a woman who has the same years of continuous experience same college education, and same amount of sales and profit I wounder what the numbers are? [video]http://youtu.be/G_sGn6PdmIo[\video]
DingoSeanWhat? You just made absolutely no fucking sense.what about that post did you not understand, because I would love hear what you think about my point.
...seriously. Go to school or something and learn to convey what the fuck youre trying to say. You go on constant tirades of word blocks where you contradict yourself and don't get to any solid point.
momsspaghettiimma leave this here:
http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-505125_162-28246928/the-gender-pay-gap-is-a-complete-myth/
-Men are far more likely to work in higher-paying fields and occupations (by choice).
-Men are far more likely to take work in uncomfortable, isolated, and undesirable locations that pay more.
-Men work longer hours than women do. The average fulltime working man works 6 hours per week or 15 percent longer than the average fulltime working woman.
"Unmarried women who've never had a child actually earn more than unmarried men, according to the Census Bureau."
This study leads to the unambiguous conclusion that the differences in the compensation of men and women are the result of a multitude of factors and that the raw wage gap should not be used as the basis to justify corrective action. Indeed, there may be nothing to correct. The differences in raw wages may be almost entirely the result of the individual choices being made by both male and female workers.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
WHICH IS EXACTLY THE POINT OF EMMA WATSON'S VIDEO IF YOU FUCKING WATCHED IT
Women are NOT encouraged to go after these higher-paying "dirtier" jobs because they're girls, it's not an expected of them. THAT is Emma's point in her video.
DingoSeanSure, that's absolutely one thing, but the immediate issue is that women that DO have the same exact qualifications as men are constantly being paid less at the same position - IF they can even get such a position.
A great example are females in law and medical fields - who tend to be paid less on average than male counterparts. It might not always be 75 on the dollar.. but it's still very much a significant wage gap for equal work.
zzzskizzzA great example? It is not anywhere near 75/100 that is a bullshit statistic you just said. What you just said is taking every woman in amarica's salory and comparing it to every mans for all work. Lets think about what you just said, hey man we need to cut 100k out of the budget this year what are we going to do? I know let's fire 4 men because we pay them 100k and hire 4 woman because we pay then 75k and since they do the same job nothing will change. LOL woman are dumb pay them less.
momsspaghetti-Men are far more likely to take work in uncomfortable, isolated, and undesirable locations that pay more.
zzzskizzzA great example? It is not anywhere near 75/100 that is a bullshit statistic you just said. What you just said is taking every woman in amarica's salory and comparing it to every mans for all work. Lets think about what you just said, hey man we need to cut 100k out of the budget this year what are we going to do? I know let's fire 4 men because we pay them 100k and hire 4 woman because we pay then 75k and since they do the same job nothing will change. LOL woman are dumb pay them less.
caroline.Interesting that you brought this up, I noticed the same thing. Now that I'm in a crappy place, in the middle of no place, living in a forest service "cabin" alone, I noticed why.
All anyone ever says to me is "aren't you afraid?" "What if someone hurts you up there?" "Why would you do that?" "Its scary there as a young woman" or my favorite "you're a girl, you don't have to do that stuff." ITS A GOOD JOB, YES I FUCKING DO.
When my boyfriend worked the same job in the same place, no one said anything of the sort.
We're taught we should be afraid, and that since we're girls we'll be raped by everyone , eaten by bears, lost in the woods, and murdered. No one tells us we're doing a good thing, or that we're capable enough to deal with it. We only get told how bad everyone feels and how scary the big world is.
neutralzombiehttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XP3cyRRAfX0
because i can't embed.
caroline.This is awesome, and the story of my life. I never had a teacher until college that encouraged my interest in nature, mechanics, math or science. When I showed the slightest bit of interest in art BOOM, I was pushed towards graphic design with a vocal bulldozer.
caroline.This is awesome, and the story of my life. I never had a teacher until college that encouraged my interest in nature, mechanics, math or science. When I showed the slightest bit of interest in art BOOM, I was pushed towards graphic design with a vocal bulldozer.
DingoSeanYeah, and for me it was the opposite. I was always given shit for taking philosophy courses rather than business, law, or science.
lIllIOlder people always applaud me for pursing an accounting degree. I just look at the floor and think about how full of shit everyone is.
My growth as a thinking person plummeted the moment I stopped taking art/philosophy courses.
lIllIOlder people always applaud me for pursing an accounting degree.
momsspaghettiyou know why? they didn't have rich ass parents to support them through their mid 20s while they "found themselves"
do you know why people major in accounting or finance? it's a means to an end. they don't LOVE finance and spreadsheets, they love vacations, they love owning their own home, they love their Mercedes-Benz, they love providing their children with a decent education, they love stability and independence. they delay the gratification of easy (yes, they are easy.) arts and philo classes for the long-term satisfaction that a well-paying career offers
i've said this before, but that's the problem with liberal arts degrees, they do not *USUALLY* provide students with the tools to thrive in the real world. that's not to say philosophy and arts classes aren't without merit and practical application. the majors are pretty fucking useless if you have any long-term goals.
momsspaghettiyou know why? they didn't have rich ass parents to support them through their mid 20s while they "found themselves"
do you know why people major in accounting or finance? it's a means to an end. they don't LOVE finance and spreadsheets, they love vacations, they love owning their own home, they love their Mercedes-Benz, they love providing their children with a decent education, they love stability and independence. they delay the gratification of easy (yes, they are easy.) arts and philo classes for the long-term satisfaction that a well-paying career offers
i've said this before, but that's the problem with liberal arts degrees, they do not *USUALLY* provide students with the tools to thrive in the real world. that's not to say philosophy and arts classes aren't without merit and practical application. the majors are pretty fucking useless if you have any long-term goals.
DingoSeanSocial sciences are 'easier' because they aren't in depth.
lIllISocial sciences are easier because you are usually not studying natural law. The "right" answer is often determined by who provides the best argument, and even then you can reasonably reject that argument. You can argue that X or Y is a social injustice until the cows come home, but at the end of the day you're just regurgitating a product of the contemporary cultural climate, and some guy with a backwards fucking opinion will come and have his stance be equally as valid as yours (precisely why I felt gender studies was such a joke of a class).
Not to imply that accounting is black-and-white, because at the end of the day accounting is theatre and money doesn't exist. The difference is that the ability to cynically play the game and learn an employable trade puts you in a power position over other members of society whose lack of cynicism kept them at the social-economic margins. It's easy to look down at them and scoff at first, but as time goes on you begin to realize that riches only exist in proportion to that which you can live without. As you look back on the path you've taken you start to question whether or not living a shitty life for a fat paycheck is anything short of absurd.
J.D.Um this makes them harder, not easier. There are answers that are demonstrably wrong, but in many cases no demonstrably right one. This completely fucks a lot of people up. In law school, the kids who had engineering or science backgrounds often had a really hard time on exams because they had to come up with a rational, defensible position on something rather than pointing to "the answer".
This is true in hard sciences, too, though, when you've gotten to a point where you're really figuring new stuff out. There is a lot of supposition and "we can't possibly confirm this, but it makes the most sense as an explanation for what we're seeing" in some of those fields; I'm particularly thinking of physics.
Anyway the quality of my life would be significantly worse without my arts undergrad, which has allowed me to appreciate a lot of things on a deeper level than I might otherwise be able to.
neutralzombiethe paycheck gap ISSUE is FOR THE SAME JOB
EXAMPLE:
WOMAN ENGINEER : 50K
MALE ENGINEER : 60K BECAUSE HE HAS A PENIS AND HIS BOSS IS SEXIST
SAME UNIVERSITY DEGREE
SAME QUALIFICATIONS AND SKILL SET.
EXAMPLE:
WOMAN AT MCDONALDS: 10K WITH A GRADUATE DEGREE
MAN AT MCDONALDS : 15K BECAUSE HE HAS A PENIS AND HIS BOSS IS SEXIST, HAS NO GRADUATE DEGREE
that's HOW IT WORKS. THAT'S WHAT SEXISM IS.
this isn't fucking rocket science and you don't need an engineering degree to understand common sense.
DingoSeanLEARN HOW TO FUCKING READ.
zzzskizzzjust so everyone knows dingo banned me because I beat him in an argument that's a first for newschoolers. I said it back on the 3rd page, and both of you keep ignoring this point. career oriented women in a lot of cases make the same or even more than men in a lot of cases. http://blogs.wsj.com/economics/2010/09/01/cities-where-women-outearn-male-counterparts the problem is most women are not career oriented.
the fact that you threw out 75/100 means you have zero knowledge and have done no research on this subject. Also the fact that you said "or maybe its less" doesn't negate how wrong it is. Thats like me saying do you know women makes 140% to what a man makes or maybe it's a little less. also you keep throwing out for the same credentials, credentials and experience are not the same thing.
I said it at the top of the page, women have a harder time getting excited to become engineers and scientists. Now if they do you get excited and pursue that career, and stay career oriented they make the same amount if not more. the problem is there are a few scholarships and women mentors in that field. That is why they don't make as much it's not because men are evil and pay woman less just because, it's because not many women are career oriented and would rather have a family and do other things then work continuously.
If a feminist came up to me and asked me to help with that problem I would. But they don't they want us to throw more money at them while not changing anything. And that is why you are wrong. U mad bro ban me again
neutralzombiehe probably banned you because you are, always have been, likely always will be an ignorant tool.
DingoSeanI banned you for what I can only call 'trolling' dude... members were getting sick of your shit and actually PMing me pleading for me to give you a timeout...
When that happens, it's an obligation more than my own decision. Had nothing to do with 'winning an argument', as nothing you were saying made any cohesive point anyway.
zzzskizzzI said it at the top of the page, women have a harder time getting excited to become engineers and scientists. Now if they do you get excited and pursue that career, and stay career oriented they make the same amount if not more. the problem is there are a few scholarships and women mentors in that field. That is why they don't make as much it's not because men are evil and pay woman less just because, it's because not many women are career oriented and would rather have a family and do other things then work continuously.
~~~~~~~~Fuck it I'll address your shitty little point. Do you really not see how society steers boys and girls into and away from certain professions beginning as toddlers depending on what's in their pants? Were you given dolls growing up? No, you were probably given legos, because That's what boys do. This societal bias is reflected in most every piece of entertainment or toy marketed aggressively to young kids. Do you remember how the tom boy girl was picked on in elementary school for not fitting those norms? That never went away and only carried into the professional world, only now instead of the boys calling her names they pay her less and belittle her work.
zzzskizzzThat is literally what I said, except you're missing the fact that the tomboy who works that job out of college gets paid the same, and if you clicked on my link on average career oriented women in those fields in a lot of cases they get more. so again and I don't get why none of you people understand this point it's about steering women into those careers, and having them work continuously. then they'll make the same. It has nothing to do with sexiest men paying them less when they have the same experience and qualifications. I thought I made that point very clear.
zzzskizzzShow me 1 p.m from a member outside of this feminist thread that says I need a break.
DingoSeanYou're still ignorant of the fact that even in entry level and base jobs, women are still regularly paid less than men - that is if they can even be hired for it if they're competing with men for the position.
