Parents outraged over 6 year old girl security pat down

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no, not really. you're choosing to enter the airport, and by doing that you have agreed to comply with whatever they want to do. like people have said, you don't have to fly. if you don't agree with the searches, then get the fuck out of the airport. when you're about to be stuck 35,000 feet above the ground for hours, NO search is unreasonable.

it's kind of like when you go to a college, especially a private college. a lot of what they do is pretty much retarded and questionably constitutional, but since you're choosing to be there, they can do whatever the hell they want

Apr 13 2011 10:14PM

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The_Big_Tuna

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her parents should deal with it. the terrorist can do some crazy shit suck as 6 year old suicide bombers...

Apr 13 2011 10:19PM

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Nazi Germany, Circa 1938:

You know, it's unfortunate that the Jews were upset, but they had to know this was a possibility. If you're not ok with it, no one is forcing you to walk in the street, go to the store, or go to certain restaurants. You can't make an exception for one person just because they might not like it. What about a smart Jew with a lot of money? I'm sure he doesn't want to be subjected to the cruel and unusual punishment, but if you're potentially going to segregate one person, the same has to go for everyone, and it's up to the parents to prepare their jewish kids for it.

Now some bonehead's gonna take that the wrong way and think I'm some Nazi racist, but hopefully someone will see the blatant point I'm trying to make. You can't just let a human injustice slip by just because it's one of your laws, or commonplace amongst your society. Your country, the god-fearing U S of A, does not, though you may all think it, possess the key to freedom and liberty; this video being a damn good example of that. Children do not deserve this, and it is NOT our responsibility to avoid it, it is THEIRS (TSA) to stop it.

Apr 13 2011 10:20PM

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forum10

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you are a complete and utter moron. i don't think i've ever seen anyone fuck up a comparison so terribly. wow. nice job, you idiot.

Apr 13 2011 11:20PM

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fujarome

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Aircraft are the airline's property. Their very, very expensive property. So they do have the right to search you before you board it. And that applies to anyone boarding their plane.

And flying is not a right. It's a convenience offered by private companies for a fee. It's pretty much become essential, but not necessarily a right.

That said however, TSA is absolutely worthless. Watch "Please Remove Your Shoes." It's an extremely well done documentary about just how useless they are. The idea behind is good, but when put into practice....they butchered it.

Apr 13 2011 11:24PM

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MaMann

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I may have to sig this...

Apr 13 2011 11:25PM

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did you even watch the video? that little girl was chillin throughout the whole thing. i seriously doubt a little kid would be traumatized this. it is in no way a human injustice. how is keeping us safe an injustice? i agree that the mom's panic probably made the girl freak out. she probably would have been fine if the mom had acted like an intelligent human and not an overly sensitive soccer mom with a meth addiction.

remember how when you're little the doctor feels your balls while you cough to make sure you don't have a hernia (or something)? did that traumatize you? yeah, didn't traumatize me either. you could just as easily call that a human injustice by your standards.

your argument was fucking terrible dude

Apr 13 2011 11:27PM

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pomme-de-terre

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i just dont see the big deal, its not a huge violation of human rights, its related to the 4th amendment, its just a fucking search. you are going to get on an airplane, they dont want you to bring bad things onto airplanes. they fucking search you. you dont like it? dont get on the airplane.

if i was going to give you a ride somewhere in my car but demanded you let me search you before i did so, it wouldnt violate any human rights shit either. if you wanted to, you could say "no" and walk away. just like that litter girl and her family. if they didnt want to do the search they could have said no and not flown that day and left. thats how it works.

Apr 13 2011 11:34PM

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Cthulhu

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ummm, boo fucking hoo. its an air port, people have kids smuggle drugs and weapons all the time so as far as i'm concerned its completely fair, by purchasing the ticket they are agreeing to the airports security measures and they had a woman do the pat down, not some creepy 50 year old man, granted its pretty messed that the world is at a stage where shit like this is necessary but i don't see why the parents have to raise shit over this. they're just doing their job and had it been another family and another child that actually had a bomb or anything along those lines, those two parents would be shitting a brick that they didn't search that kid. in closing, fuck people like this, that is all.

Apr 13 2011 11:51PM

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FilmingBitch

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Everyone always complains when they are 'inconvenienced' by pat-downs and security lines - but I don't see anyone complaining when potential crises are averted. People are such hypocrites. I want security and peace of mind; as a result, I don't mind if I need to be patted down. Plus, now that girl can brag that she's so badass she got checked by security... well, she could, if they hadn't posted a video of her crying during it.... kidding... sort of.

Apr 13 2011 11:54PM

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wrong. Human injustice... not something that should be hard to define really. but it surprisingly is. Nobody touches my body, or my child's body, unless they have an explicit reason to do so.

The lack of brains to come up with a better solution than strip searching my 6 year olds in a crowded public venue is so far away from a good reason my friend. And just because it's the law, or because everyone else says its "ok", or because it's supposedly making it safer for all of us, does not mean I'm going to sit by idly and let it fly.

Apr 13 2011 11:58PM

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Funnel

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My friend's dad made it through security with a 4 inch knife in his bag on the way back from Alaska. There have also been tests done where people have a water bottle in a bag that also contains a questionable/dangerous item and the water bottle was taken out, while TSA did not even bat an eye at the dangerous item.

Apr 14 2011 12:02AM

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Troy.

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Apr 14 2011 12:09AM

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explicit reason: making sure a kid didn't somehow get roped into bring a fucking bomb onto an airplane. how are you this dumb dude?

also, you clearly don't know what strip searching is.

it's "ok" because flying is something you CHOOSE to do. your analogy was fucking stupid because 1. it was just retarded and not the same at all and 2. the jews were living happily and suddenly shit went south. when you fly, you KNOW that you are subject to search. you are literally paying to put yourself in that situation. if you're not ok with that, then it's pretty easy: fucking drive. as has been said, flying is NOT a right. it's not a public service dude. when shit is private, you agree to their terms. if you're not ok with those terms, that's your problem.

by the way, what is your alternative solution?

Apr 14 2011 12:12AM

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Dntel.

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wow, where to begin. First of all, comparing what happened in this situation to genocide in Nazi Germany is not only a gross case of hyperbole, it's also outright disrespectful. You should be ashamed of yourself. A pat down with the back of the hand by a person that is paid to protect the safety of others, INCLUDING THAT LITTLE GIRL, is in no way comparable to an attempt to segregate, and ultimately eradicate a race of people.

Secondly, I don't think there is a reason more explicit in the world to touch your body than to ensure the safety of not only you, but the thousands of people surrounding you while in the terminal, and eventually the hundreds of people that are essentially trapped with you 35,000' above the ground. Not to mention, these searches are conducted in a standardized, professional way. Everybody is subject to the same search, there is no discrimination of treatment here.

To reply to the lack of a better option argument, well, there are full body scanners being implemented around the country, and guess what, people bitch about that equally as much. And since you seem to be such a smart, well informed individual, where is your solution to that problem?

As has been mentioned before in this thread, flying is a privilege, a convenience. It is pretty much everything but a right. Once you enter the terminal, your ass belongs to the TSA. I expect that every time I fly. I don't like it, but i understand the reasoning behind it. Is it an inconvenience? Does it go too far sometimes? Perhaps, but in this case I don't see any reason why people are surprised about what happened.

Lastly, if your idea of not sitting idly by and letting it happen is soap-boxing on an internet skiing forum, well i don't know what to tell you. Maybe that's why things haven't changed yet for ya.

Apr 14 2011 12:27AM

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DsMoK3

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this

Apr 14 2011 12:29AM

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snowdon

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I never knew the line between general airport security and genocide was so fine.

Apr 14 2011 12:44AM

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XtRemE11

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if you cant accept the risks of flying, dont fly?

srsly tho, if this girl set off the metal detector, then yes, they have a reason to search her. however i am against the TSA searching anybody without a reasonable suspicion. its the TSA, the government, doing the searches, not the airlines.

you could kill a shit ton of people, if not more, much more easily with a car/truckload of explosives in the right area. should we allow the government to search any car they want for no reason at all?

if you dont want to deal with any risks, dont leave your home, never drive, fly or walk anywhere and you will be fine. otherwise sack up and dont take away our rights to create an illusion of safety.

Apr 14 2011 12:49AM

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Crazy Fool

did anyone else catch that the father is a OB/GYN?

Dad: "Dont you EVER let anyone touch you down there..."

Daughter: "Daddy, what do you do for a job?"

Dad: "I touch people down there..."

Apr 14 2011 12:50AM

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Dntel.

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win!

Apr 14 2011 12:55AM

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This is why I don't get involved in political threads...

I knew someone was going to say I was comparing this situation to the holocaust. I'm not, I'm comparing our reaction to what I believe to be uncalled-for breaches of human right. In 1938, Germans reacted similarly to many of you, believing there to be no consequences (at this point, outright injury of jews was still not commonplace remember-- this was when they were standing as a severely degraded race, but not more) for what they were doing. Many in this thread are simply dismissing this saying they (subjects in the video) buy into this treatment; that it's their own fault. Flying in this case is like being Jewish in my comparison from before... It's not something you can really say "can be avoided". Millions fly every week... are you all really trying to suggest that millions of people should be faced with the choice of either driving or just "coping"?? Isn't a strong sense of independence and freedom what your country (USA) was founded upon?

No one should say flying can just be avoided, or done away with-- it clearly is irrelevant to this argument. Here's another analogy... Say the government was putting picture of porn on all banana's (ridiculous, I know, but just run with it...). Should I not buy banana's for me or my children? Yeah, I can live without them... I can substitute other things for them for sure. But why should I have to do that? You tell me that it's "my own fault for buying them; I should know the risks", but you see, that's not really a risk I think I should need to take.

What I'm trying to say, as briefly as I can:

If you let something like this slide, more follows. If you don't think this is an issue at all, then I have no idea why you choose to live (assuming you are of the age and wealth capable of letting you choose your residence) in a country which is literally built upon the foundation of protecting the rights which are being STOMPED UPON.

oh, and to WillStart. ... If I knew how to fix this, I really, really would try to tell someone. I think anyone who knows how owes it to all of us to do that...

Apr 14 2011 1:01AM

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This is why I don't get involved in political threads...

I knew someone was going to say I was comparing this situation to the holocaust. I'm not, I'm comparing our reaction to what I believe to be uncalled-for breaches of human right. In 1938, Germans reacted similarly to many of you, believing there to be no consequences (at this point, outright injury of jews was still not commonplace remember-- this was when they were standing as a severely degraded race, but not more) for what they were doing. Many in this thread are simply dismissing this saying they (subjects in the video) buy into this treatment; that it's their own fault. Flying in this case is like being Jewish in my comparison from before... It's not something you can really say "can be avoided". Millions fly every week... are you all really trying to suggest that millions of people should be faced with the choice of either driving or just "coping"?? Isn't a strong sense of independence and freedom what your country (USA) was founded upon?

No one should say flying can just be avoided, or done away with-- it clearly is irrelevant to this argument. Here's another analogy... Say the government was putting picture of porn on all banana's (ridiculous, I know, but just run with it...). Should I not buy banana's for me or my children? Yeah, I can live without them... I can substitute other things for them for sure. But why should I have to do that? You tell me that it's "my own fault for buying them; I should know the risks", but you see, that's not really a risk I think I should need to take.

What I'm trying to say, as briefly as I can:

If you let something like this slide, more follows. If you don't think this is an issue at all, then I have no idea why you choose to live (assuming you are of the age and wealth capable of letting you choose your residence) in a country which is literally built upon the foundation of protecting the rights which are being STOMPED UPON.

oh, and to WillStart. ... If I knew how to fix this, I really, really would try to tell someone. I think anyone who knows how owes it to all of us to do that...

Apr 14 2011 1:01AM

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then stop acting like you know a better way man.

sure, flying is basically essential for tons of people. but i think most intelligent people would rather be lightly felt by a random TSA security person than not know what kinds of weapons or explosives people might have. if you would honestly rather not be screened and still get on a plane, then that just seems retarded. it's really, really not that big of a deal.

i see that you avoided my doctor question, which was far more relevant than anything you've said.

just for the record, i fucking hate flying. it's a hassle. i would so much rather take a high speed train, even if it took 2-3 hours longer. plus, one of the best things would be that they would probably be slightly more lax about security since a train could be stopped at any time.

Apr 14 2011 1:07AM

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Crazy Fool

you deserve to be kicked repetitively in the happy sack.

seriously? you continue to push this holocaust shit? 99.9% of passengers are totally fine with going through security. were the jews fine with being sent to concentration camps? there is a big fucking difference between .1% not wanting to be patted down and 99% being sent to their deaths.

If that .1% doesn't want to be patted down, fuck them, don't fly.

If there is a genocide exterminating an entire population you have an entirely fucking different situation.

please go kill yourself.

Apr 14 2011 1:07AM

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forum10

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you don't get it, do you? getting a pat down is hardly a human injustice of any kind. and i don't know who you think you are but you don't have the RIGHT to fly. it's a fucking privilege that you PAY for and you PAY for everything that goes along with it. would you call someone getting patted down for a concert a human injustice? millions of people get to enjoy the privilege of live music... i mean fuck hitler and shit! harden the fuck up you god damned diluted pussy.

Apr 14 2011 1:07AM

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awesomeness17

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What would putting porn on banana's do exactly? The whole point of searches are to keep the greater amount of people safe. And the whole reason they had to revamp the system to allow for these random searches was because a declared terrorist managed to get on a plane with an explosive device (luckily never used it) and almost everyone agreed the US needs better security at airports. They also made it a pain in the ass to fly into the states but that is all for good reason, this threat came from out of the country. The security may be inefficient but it somewhat gets the job done. And the TSA agents are forced to search anyone that is selected (which is done so randomly).

Apr 14 2011 1:11AM

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grillguy44

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love it

Apr 14 2011 1:30AM

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Dntel.

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see how absolutely nobody is agreeing with you here? yeah, thats because what you are saying is fucking, retarded. It's borderline offensive. You aren't even participating in discussion, you're just spewing ridiculous nonsense.

Apr 14 2011 1:49AM

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Crazy Fool

I can't believe all these idiots on here, actually repeating that oh-so-lovely stereotypical American mantra:

"If you don't like ___, get the fuck out/don't do ___."

I gotta say, that brainwashing is really working like a charm over there.

Apr 14 2011 2:47AM

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Crazy Fool

if you don't like the way our country does it, stay the fuck out.

and yes i'm aware i just used your dumb fucking mantra.

personally, i think you're a fucking idiot. you can't seem to do anything but bash on "us idiotic americans" and to be quite honest, i don't ever recall actually agreeing with you on a single one of your opinions.

Apr 14 2011 3:14AM

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Proletariat.

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threads

Apr 14 2011 3:16AM

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Crazy Fool

I have a lot of friends in and from the States, and I love 'em. As I said, I'm talking about stereotypical behaviour and it saddens me that it's so prevalent on NS as well.

It doesn't really matter to me if you think I'm an idiot so i'll just keep voicing my opinions. Plus it's a Canadian website so why care trololo.

Apr 14 2011 3:18AM

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Crazy Fool

maybe its just my past run-ins with you that have left me with a bad taste, but do you mind if i ask your opinion on this topic? sorry if i missed it, if so, a copy and paste will do, i'm just curios to see which side you're on here.

Apr 14 2011 3:23AM

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Crazy Fool

That's okay, I don't try to run around offending people, diffr'nt strokes and all that.

Well, my opinion on this is that the chance of being blown up by a terrorist on an airplane is...amazingly miniscule. The chance of someone somehow getting a bomb strapped onto a 6-year-old girl, even smaller.

The attitude towards "flight safety" in Europe is on a very different level than what I've seen and heard of this newer TSA regulation of strip searches, full body X-rays and pat downs. I don't think people would stand to that here. Patting down this girl I'm sure is not too much of a shock to the girl although stated so in the article, but a mocking shock to the privacy and freedoms that the US tries to represent and hold so dear.

I just think it's not a very wise statement to say "Don't fly then, there are other modes of transportation." That's just inane.

Terrorism as a concept and ideal to some is a very crooked thing and mostly happening because of religious issues, but in your mainstream media it is so blown out of proportion.

Apr 14 2011 3:35AM

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Crazy Fool

so in effect terrorism is working. wouldn't you agree?

and our country is a free country based on democracy, which means, that we are free to give up our freedoms if we choose to do so. as i have said before, thousands upon thousands of people go through airport security every day and all it takes is some arrogant cuntbag soccer mom to make a big deal about her kid (who set off the metal detector) getting a pat-down.

this applies to damn near everything about our daily life. take for example speed limits. can you say that america isn't a free country because you can't drive 120 in a 35 zone? no, we have given up that "freedom" in exchange for a sense of safety. sure, you still could go and drive 120 there, but you run the risk of being caught by the police, or in the case of an airport, the TSA.

one last thing, you can't start letting children through security without being checked. they are already low on the list of people to profile against, yes the TSA profiles, but once you start letting kids through you open the flood gates. and you cant say that a terrorist wouldn't take advantage of a child. a close friend of mine WITNESSED a young girl, maybe 8 years old, run up to the humvee two in front of his in a caravan and literally get detonated when she was next to it. lucky for the soldiers in the vehicle none were injured, but to see a little girl just sacrificed like that really goes a long way in showing what you're dealing with.

Apr 14 2011 3:59AM

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Static

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I'm sick of hearing that crap,
"Privilege, not a Right."

What kindergarten bullshit.

It's actually a business transaction- no more, no less.

Your con is that "freedom" is only for the privileged, and you have convinced yourself into a mental cell.

You are born free, you have no privileges to gain.
Congratulations.

Apr 14 2011 4:02AM

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Crazy Fool

Who is this "we"? I don't think you can speak for every single US citizen any more than I can speak for every Finnish citizen. Did you vote or sign a petition to give up your rights, or were they simply taken from you and you have no choice but to go with the flow and try to justify it for yourself.

In case you haven't noticed, people are outraged, furious about these invasions of privacy and civil rights in the face of statistically trivial issues.

...and I can't believe you actually try to compare speed limits with this issue, seriously...

Apr 14 2011 4:09AM

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alex.bgk.

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name one country that is a true democracy. there are none. at most they are democratic republics. we vote to have people who best represent our views/opinions take political matters into their hands.

rights are not simply taken. particularly pertaining to the fourth amendment involving unwarranted searches and seizures is judicial review. precedents are set from incidents that are questionably unconstitutional. these determinations are made by the justices of the supreme court who often have to balance the ideas of the safety of the general public and the rights provided by the amended portion of our constitution.

prime examples would be the most common exceptions to obtaining a warrant to search: hot pursuit, incident to arrest, exigent circumstances, and plain view.

anyway, the people who make this decisions (the justices) are appointed by the presented, who is chosen by the electoral college, that is a group of people per state proportional to the population of said state (# of house reps + 2 granted granted senators), appointed by the state legislature, who is appointed by the people.

i hope that answers your question as to who "we" is and to people so outraged/furious, they have several options:

#1
set up a lawsuit against the government. thats how this shit works. exceptions and various rules to and from amendments of the constitution either get changed by some sort of suit, appeal or even more rarely a congressional vote with state ratification.

#2
vote. change who represents you if you think they are so wrong

#3
quit being so mother fucking retarded that it ruins option 2. the founding fathers of this nation pretty much built it in so the average dirt clod hopping farmer has no real political say in this nation and rightly so.. a majority of people are just the 21st century equivalent of an 18th century retard

Apr 14 2011 4:44AM

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Crazy Fool

I'd say Switzerland is pretty close to what I'd want my country to become.

Apr 14 2011 5:22AM

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alex.bgk.

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indeed

either way the events of 9/11/01 have shown the insane potential for destruction that the hijacking of commercial aircraft can have (i am in no way talking about likeliness)

all 3 branches of the government are typically on board that the safety gained by increased security outweigh the loss of rights of individuals using airlines. which isn't much of a difference because anyone was subject to search long before 9 and a half years ago

i personally have no issue with this. this girl was checked very non intrusively for objects that could bring significant harm to others that she may not even know she was doing. criminals hide contraband on kids all the time, terrorists are certainly not above that either

the parents are most likely "outraged" because they were inconvenienced and probably thought it was unnecessary because theyre white and the father is a doctor. fuck them. their molestation argument holds as little water as the empty space in my sack not already taken up by my balls. if anyone is inconvenienced, its the TSA agent who had to deal with those parents throwing a fit while the agent was trying to ensure the safety everyone in that terminal

honestly i hold the rights granted by the constitution very dear, but for the sake of common sense and general safety i'm 100% ok with some trade offs

some may call it naive to allow for additional power in the hands of the federal government, while being paranoid of the individual. i however see it the other way around, where to not do so is naive of the dangers of individuals while being paranoid of the government

Apr 14 2011 5:45AM

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