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60p to 30p - no slow mo

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Ben.
Posts: 21463 - Karma: 683
So theres some shots i have off my t2i that i shot in 60p, but i want to use at full speed without the overly smooth look that 60p gives. What would be the best way to go about dropping frames/losing that 60p look? Is that even possible? Can i just export in 30p and it will look normal?
Jan 27 2011 4:46PM
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WillStart
Posts: 3955 - Karma: 3,192
Eh don't go to 30p..30p sucks

I think if you export it as 24p, you should be fine. It's not the same (so I've heard) but I think it will still be alright. You should just message Landis though, he seems to be quite knowledgable when it comes to frame rates.
Jan 27 2011 4:48PM
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1337
Posts: 31038 - Karma: 29,003
do you have cinema tools? i think thats your only option
Jan 27 2011 4:58PM
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WillStart
Posts: 3955 - Karma: 3,192
maybe if you want to edit with a lower frame rate. But you can just edit it at 60p then just export at 24p (or 30p if you really want to) and boom, 24p/30p video.
Jan 27 2011 4:59PM
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bustinthejus
Posts: 2419 - Karma: 74
Quick thread-jack... I'm curious, what's wrong with 30p? Do most people who film skiing shoot 24p? I was always under the impression that 24p would be too slow for fast-paced skiing...
Jan 27 2011 5:08PM
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WillStart
Posts: 3955 - Karma: 3,192
well if skiing is too fast-paced for 24p, then it also is for 30p.

i don't like 30p because it just is a weird frame rate. 60p is good for slow motion, and 24p is good for lifestyle and achieving the 'film look.' so 30p just doesn't seem useful to me. can't do slow motion very well with it, and it doesn't have as nice a feel as 24p does.

most people who film skiing shoot at 60p, but i know there are kids on here who believe in shooting at 24p to maintain the film aesthetic
Jan 27 2011 5:11PM
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1337
Posts: 31038 - Karma: 29,003
I shoot 30p and slow it down to 24p

Jan 27 2011 5:15PM
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Trojan~Man
Posts: 1996 - Karma: 1,357
id be curious to see all three frame rates side by side to really see the diffrence.
Jan 27 2011 5:29PM
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WillStart
Posts: 3955 - Karma: 3,192
this is just the first video i found when searching 24p vs 30p vs 60p. terrible comparison though because two different cameras were used and both set on auto. so they are probably going to be different shutter speeds


Jan 27 2011 5:39PM
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WillStart
Posts: 3955 - Karma: 3,192
60p on the left, 24p in the center, 30p on the right
Jan 27 2011 5:40PM
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Ben.
Posts: 21463 - Karma: 683
normally id agree on 24p but my other lifestyle/non slow mo was all shot at 30. and my slow mo is 60 conformed to 30, so id rather stick with that for some consistincy. in the future ill keep 24p in mind. gracias though.
Jan 27 2011 5:54PM
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WillStart
Posts: 3955 - Karma: 3,192
aha, did not know you had other 30p footage. makes sense then
Jan 27 2011 6:00PM
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bustinthejus
Posts: 2419 - Karma: 74
What if my camera doesn't have 60p? I'm just starting out filming, and have an HV40, and only has 24p, 30p, and 60i...
Jan 27 2011 6:27PM
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bakedpow
Posts: 8770 - Karma: 10,462
Then you obviously can't shoot 60p...
Jan 27 2011 6:33PM
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WillStart
Posts: 3955 - Karma: 3,192
60i is probably your best bet for slow motion, as much as i hate promoting 60i. 24p will look nicer for things that don't need to be slowed down
Jan 27 2011 6:38PM
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bustinthejus
Posts: 2419 - Karma: 74
Click for larger image

I was wondering what framerate I should use instead...



Thanks Will, sounds good.
Jan 27 2011 6:43PM
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bakedpow
Posts: 8770 - Karma: 10,462
Fuck that i don't want no rock. Try specifying what you want next time.
Jan 27 2011 6:47PM
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p.hawks
Posts: 2832 - Karma: 581
interlaced and progressive are completely different. You are right about I being bad for skiing, but it is also essentially the same framerate as 30p. 60i is when the camera takes 60 frames a second, but the odd frames have the odd resolution lines, and the evens have the evens, and when it is played back, it looks similar to 30p (only not for action, because the the subject moves between frames, and it just makes everything look shitty and jagged). I would recommend conforming 30p to 24p, or getting twixtor. you could try using speed and motion blur in final cut to go lower, just odn't go too low or it will get choppy
Jan 27 2011 7:13PM
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[~_~]
Posts: 20239 - Karma: 1,273
The debate of 24p vs 30p is purely a matter of aesthetic opinion. Some people like the unrealistic clarity and smoothness from working in 30p, whereas many others (including myself) prefer the organic motion of 24p.

In practice, 30p is much easier to shoot. Because you are capturing more frames per second, it is much easier to catch certain gestures and movements. 24p is a much harder frame rate to film in, because your camera movements have to be VERY steady and controlled. Forget follow cams without a glidecam; 24p takes a while to master, but in my opinion it is worth it. The myth that 24p isn't fit for action is completely FALSE.

Also, shooting 30p with the shutter at 1/120, then conforming it to 24p produces a VERY nice subtle slow motion frame rate for skiing.

And Ben, you can use MPEGstreamclip to drop frames.
Jan 27 2011 7:54PM
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[~_~]
Posts: 20239 - Karma: 1,273
Bah. Or he could acknowledge the fact that 60 fps is incredibly overused and resort to other creative techniques instead, considering that interlaced frame rates are technically half the resolution as progressive frame rates.

Instead of jumping through hoops to product flickering, blurry, and otherwise shitty 60f using 60i, work on your skills as a filmer shooting 24p and 30p and be different from 98% of the videos on here.
Jan 27 2011 7:57PM
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bustinthejus
Posts: 2419 - Karma: 74
Sweet thanks for the info!
Jan 27 2011 8:00PM
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Ben.
Posts: 21463 - Karma: 683
sweet thanks dude. just when converting instead of current framerate change it to 30p?
Jan 27 2011 8:11PM
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WillStart
Posts: 3955 - Karma: 3,192
did you even read what you just wrote? 'interlaced and progressive are completely different.' 'it is also essentially the same framerate as 30p.' no, not at all. so tired of people saying this

please don't try to tell me how 60i and 30p work when you don't even know. 60i is smoother than 30p. it has more of a video look.
Jan 27 2011 10:10PM
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WillStart
Posts: 3955 - Karma: 3,192
dude come on, give me a break. i clearly meant that if he really wants to do slow motion, 60i will probably allow him to slow his shots down the most. in no way did i make it sound like 60i was great.

i would recommend just learning how to shoot 24p over 60i any day.
Jan 27 2011 10:13PM
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[~_~]
Posts: 20239 - Karma: 1,273
chill doot, I was only reinforcing what you said about 60i being the whackness
Jan 27 2011 10:34PM
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WillStart
Posts: 3955 - Karma: 3,192
sounded a lot like you thought i was suggesting 60i and you were arguing against that. i probably got that impression from the 'bah' in the beginning. i wasn't freaking out but it was just unnecessary since what i said still holds true.
Jan 27 2011 10:45PM
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[~_~]
Posts: 20239 - Karma: 1,273
bah! I say bah at everything. dig it
Jan 27 2011 10:49PM
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Trojan~Man
Posts: 1996 - Karma: 1,357
thank you!
Jan 28 2011 2:01PM
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1337
Posts: 31038 - Karma: 29,003
why 1/120th? isn't that a little short for a shutter speed? or would something like 1/1000th be to shuddery
Jan 28 2011 6:31PM
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WillStart
Posts: 3955 - Karma: 3,192
it's probably more film-like if i had to guess. a little more motion blur, not so digital looking
Jan 28 2011 8:49PM
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[~_~]
Posts: 20239 - Karma: 1,273
I personally find 1/125 to most resemble overcranked 16mm.
Jan 28 2011 11:31PM
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