Laker Hate Thread

I hate Kobe. Yeah he's good, so i respect him in that aspect. But as a player i fucking hate him.

RON ARTEST IS A RAPIST.  THE ONLY DIFFERENCE BETWEEN HIM AND KOBE IS THAT HE HASNT BEEN CAUGHT.  HE ALSO IS A WOMEN BEATER AND A SOCIOPATH.  HE IS GOING TO HELL WHEN HE DIES. and Gasol is a junkie.

      Wow! Pretty much the most uneducated and ignorant statement I have seen. You should really go and educate yourself on what the role of a coach is in TEAM sports.
Exhibit A: You are aware that the Lakers  had 2 seasons of not making it to the playoffs and being eliminated from the playoffs the following season with Shaq and Kobe.
Exhibit B: Are you familiar with the egos that professional sports players carry? If not, then look that shit up. For a coach in any sport to have to make plays, keep players motivated, and keep egos at bay takes quite a bit of work.
Exhibit C: Have you ever wondered why the coach of Miami, Cleveland, and Orlando not won any Championships lately? All those teams have some pretty big and well known players. Furthermore, those players are surrounded with some other pretty good players.
Last Exhibit: Did you know that the 2004 Olympic team was an All-Star team, yet they only got the bronze medal? Now look up the 2008 Olympic team. Another group of All-Stars, but this time they got the gold medal. Why is that you ask? Because the coaching was better in 2008. Coach Mike Krzyzewski (I suggest you google that name since you appear to be pretty stupid) is a pretty damn good coach, and he really was able to come up with creative plays, keep the team motivated, and keep the egos at bay.
      Overall, don't discredit a coach without understanding what they go through in a WHOLE SEASON. You really made yourself look like a big dumbass.

Players will make up the team.. the coach is the glue that holds them together and motivates them to go the same direction.

You have to admit that the guy in Boston is doing a pretty good job too.

Exactly, you can have a team of Number 1 picks and vet All Stars but if there is no guidance that team will not win any championships. The egos are abound and a coach can halt that crap right away.
Also, I think a true fan of sports will have a favorite team they root for, but have the common sense to have recognize great player/coach no matter what team. Doc Rivers, Stan Van Gundy, Mike Brown, Alvin Gentry, George Karl, Avery Johnson......are a few of the current great NBA coaches out besides Phil Jackson imo.

Perfect example is the Cavs.

BUT, there is at least one plus side for those of us that don't really like the Lakers. We get to see half of LA destroy itself when they win.

What I said might have been a little ignorant with Laker hate. But...

Exhibit B: Sure most players have big egos, but don't tell me that the elite players in the league don't want to win. Just look at the Boston Celtics. Ray Allen had been the #1 option for most of his career but he became the third option for the Celtics without complaint. For every Kobe and Shaq feud, there are stars who put winning at the forefront. And are you telling me that Pat Riley and Stan Van Gundy bad coaches? Or did they just not have the same caliber players as the Lakers?

Exhibit C: You honestly can't compare any of those teams with the Lakers. Pau Gasol is by far the best second option on any of those teams. Coupled with Andrew Bynum on the front line? Even though he was hurt in the finals, he still had an impact.

Exhibit D: And for your Olympic example, apparently you are a dumbass as well because the 2004 team was coached by Larry Brown, a future hall-of-famer. In my ignorant opinion, the 04 team consisted of many established stars with big egos including Allen Iverson and Stephon Marbury. There simply weren't enough touches to go around. If you look at the 08 team, they had many unselfish complementary players to go along with the stars.

Yeah...but too bad their knees got really sore anyways

Good points but you did take things out of context and added in your own assumptions of what I said.
 
    First I did not say either of those guys are BAD coaches, rather I was saying it takes a lot of will power to keep these "ELITE" players from being a cancer to the team. Why did Ray Allen take a backseat? It is because he wanted to win and realized it takes a team effort in order to do so (Also he was not that much of selfish player to begin with). To keep a team from collapsing over a 82 game season takes a shit load of patience and will power. Hence, the reason why the Laker's lost the Finals in 2003 because the feuding between egos got to great to control.
    Second, I mentioned those teams (Orlando, Heat (as of now), and Cleveland) because they have had good players but zero rings. Pat Riley, who is a great coach, did win a ring in 2006 and if you want to look into BS game calls I suggest you look back on that Finals because clearly Dallas was robbed a few times. My point of mentioning those teams was to show was happens when egos collide, and players start to care more about stats than winning. So nice try with that one, but I never said those teams have bad coaching. I was implying that they were fatigued from trying to keep the team on the same page and motivated. Just look at Lebron these last playoffs, he just gave up and lost all motivation.
    Third, yeah the Laker's have a great team. However, Dwight Howard, Wade, and Lebron have had some pretty good supporting casts. The problem arises when people forget to work together. I bring up the 2003 Finals again because the Pistons were the underdogs by a HUGH margin. So don't try to tell me that a great team will win against everybody because of star power. Great teams win because they have every ingredient needed: Patient/Calculated Coach who doesn't lose faith in team and is great at keeping them focused 24/7 for 82 games/playoffs. Then, a cast of players who all know their role/believe in each other and what the coach is trying to instill in them. You can't just put a bunch of all stars together and think a ring is going to be easy to obtain.
    Last, nice try at attempting to make me look stupid. However, you have once again fallen into the trap/fallacy of assuming and adding parts to what I was saying. You should try a critical analysis class and learn to read things clearly before responding. NO WHERE did I say Larry Brown was a BAD coach. I was merely showing how trying to coach a team with those guys is rough on the psyche. What happened in 2004 clearly had that showing. The players were selfish and didn't believe in the coach or the rest the team. However, the 2008 team was different and Coach K made sure to ingrain that team effort into their heads from day 1. And see how I didn't just automatically say "are you saying Coach Mike K is a bad coach". This is because I realized you were making a point, and not saying the other is bad.
    Overall, I am saying that don't write off a coach just because of who he has coached. A nobody can't coach a team of stars and think they will win it all. With a team of egos there needs to be a leader, which most of the time will be the coach more than anything. If a team has a leader who loses focus fast, then the team will lose focus fast (Stan Van is good coach, but you can't deny he tends to lose his cool pretty fast). Trust me when the leader starts to crack, everyone starts to crack.

First, the thing that you are failing to realize is that not ALL players have huge egos. Earlier in his career, Kobe probably would have continued to shoot his team out of game 7 of the finals. This year, he realized that the way to win was to pound the ball inside (mostly thanks to cheap fouls). Same with Shaq. This year with the Cavs he accepted a role as a role player even after having a great year with the Suns. You are praising the coaches yet use the example of the 03 Lakers coached by Phil Jackson feuding. Only age and years of not winning will tame most big egos in the NBA.

Second, I don't see any conflicting egos on the Magic, Heat, or Cavs. Each star has the respect of his team who defer to them in the clutch. The only reason they weren't in the finals is simply because they didn't have as good of a supporting cast as the Lakers.

Third, I will agree that teamwork and great coaching led the Pistons to victory. They had great chemistry from being together. Yet you are contradicting yourself. Twice have you criticized the Laker's coach Phil Jackson. Apparently, he couldn't instill good chemistry that year.

Last, you in fact did say "the coaching was better in 2008". I disagree and still stick by the fact that the 2008 team was much better picked. The superstars were complimented with good role players. The 2004 team had too many big egos clashing. The coach can only control so much in the NBA. The 2008 team was also motivated by their lackluster performance in 2004. This led the players to play to win, not to pad their own stats.

I wholeheartedly agree with you that a good coach is important in the NBA. However, i will stand by the fact that the players are the MOST important part of any team. Even Phil Jackson or Greg Popovich couldn't win with the Timberwolves or Nets.

    First I never said ALL, I merely mentioned that professional sports players carry an ego. To me that can be taken how ever you want it to be taken. If I said Physicians treat and cure diseases, does that mean ALL Physicians treat and cure diseases? The answer would be some do and some don't, but not ALL. Bascially, at times you seem to be taking my words out of context at times. However, I agree with getting to a high level and losing over and over will cause a smart minded player to come to their senses. Oh and 6 of 24 shooting did almost shoot the team out of game 7.

     Second, players not getting long is not something one will always be able to see on TV during the game. What goes on behind locked doors is something we as the public will not be aware of. Also, I am being critical of any coach who has not won because with a loss there is both players and coaches at fault. People are quick the praise players for winning and blame coaches for losing. Just like teamwork/coaching is needed to win, bad teamwork/bad coaching contributes to losing. Hence, why I critized Phil in my arguement because the times he has lost were with team with poor chemistry and him not knowing how to get this team to mesh. Leaders have to be both in game and on the side lines (Players and coaches alike need to step up).

    Last, there is a difference between a coach and coaching. Coach is obviously the person, and coaching is what they do. You can be a coach and have games where your coaching didn't go as planned/was terrible. I bascially touched on the fact that coach Mike K used that lack luster performance to motivate this team, which helped to motivate the whole team to not end up like the 04 team. I don't think any coach could have coached that 04 team. It takes too much out of one to keep those egos on a chain, and I think at that point the coach will start to make poor decisions.

  I am not saying a team doesn't need good players in order to win, but I will say some teams need the guidance of a leader (coach) to go just that extra mile. Sure the Nets/Wolves couldn't win with either of the coaches, but are you assuming that Lebron/Wade by THEMSELVES could bring a ring to either of those teams? I say no, it takes a whole team. A winning team will always have a little bit of everything (great coach, great starting 5, and a great bench). I started this little debate because I felt you pretty much discredited a coach's abilities, and say the players do all the work. In this era of basketball, it is understood that you need at least a solid performance from at least 3-4 of the starting 5, a solid bench, and a coach to the keep motivation high and the discouragement/clashing of egos low. Overall, I would say it goes like this: The players are the 100% the physical part of the game, and the coach is 100% part of the mental game. A battle is won with strong soliders and a mentally sound general.

Well...

My first comment was dumb, we both made good points, can we be friends now?

kobe irks me like no other. just his whole persona and his attitude upsets me, i feel like he has a huge chip on his shoulder because he will never surpass jordan as the best player ever, and i feel like he is angry at the world for that but he does not show it

Athletes are supposed to be like that

kobe bryant rapes women. ron artest beats up fans. i'm smarter than andrew bynum, and i just graduated high school. pau gasol touched little boys. lamar odom is dating the uglier kardashian. luke waltons father is senile, and he will someday become senile as well.

as much as i hate the lakers, i respect kobe as an athlete because he has tremendous skill. also, lamar odom could be the best big man in the game if he focused on one aspect of the game, as opposed to trying to do everything at once.

Agreed, I could be quite a bit less condescending in my return post. Sucks with no basketball now, but at least next week will provide some possible interesting to bring up. Bulls and Heat already making some cap space. July 1 should provide some pretty big off-season hype for sure

I'm more than a little worried considered I'm from the Cleveland area. If LeBron leaves, as hard as Dan Gilbert tries, the Cavs are sunk for the next few years.

Yeah the Cavs will for sure be in a rebuilding phase for years to come. No matter what happens I hope he thinks more about where he can win, and not going where he will get a huge paycheck. Sadly though, history of pro sports show more players going for the money rather than the W. I never understood that mentality. I mean sure you have to make money, but taking a pay cut and winning a championship will get a player more money in the end via endorsements and more recognition as a winner.