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FKS v Marker

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Kogu
Posts: 377 - Karma: 64
I've been doing some digging around and I hear nothing but praise for the Rossi FKS. I searchbar'd and dug through the FS threads and read a lot of interesting stuff and looked at the websites also for a little extra.

I guess my question boils down to this:
I know the FKS is an amazingly effective binding, I am actually looking for one to see in person just so I can see how it feels. But I'm curious if they're better in comparison to most bindings or just flat-out better than everything?
I've been looking at the Griffon Schizos just for the sole purpose of the versatility but I'm starting to question if that's worth it to me if the FKS is such a superior binding. I've always lived with a single mount before so...

Is the FKS worth losing the rail? Still a little unsure exactly how the benefits of the turntable design work. Marker's are still up in the running for #1 binding performance in my mind, is the hype for FKS just more talked about than the proved-tested-Marker? So there's less need to talk about em?

Thanks for any info, not trying to troll just looking for some info before I make my buy.
Jun 3 2010 6:44PM
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no_steeze
Posts: 23992 - Karma: 4,270
griffons suck ass

fks are the best because they're metal, even with the 120's your main heel assembly is metal. griffons are 130% plastic. jesters vs 916's vs fks is just personal preference, it's really what you prefer. i like fks the best so i use those

they're absolutely bombproof
Jun 3 2010 6:47PM
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Kogu
Posts: 377 - Karma: 64
So the plastic on the griffons literally snaps? The toe piece im assuming? So as far as a schizo goes Jesters would be more reliable.
Jun 3 2010 6:58PM
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Kangbang
Posts: 14211 - Karma: 423

schizo's suck ass too

Jun 3 2010 7:06PM
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PC.
Posts: 1105 - Karma: 18
Dont ride schizos.

Dont ride anything but Salomon STH16/916s if you want to buy Salomon.

Tyrolia Peak's are great, though go with 15/18. Look PX15/18, or Rossi/Look FKS/Pivot respectively, ALL are great bindings. Look 18s/Peak 18s should probably go on pow skis/big mountain versus park

Avoid plastic on your bindings man, I've seen so many shot pairs of Griffons, etc, because of plastic. Spend the extra money now, and save yourself the hassle in the long run.

Oh and Schizos suck too, too many moving parts, too much plastic.
Jun 3 2010 7:11PM
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Kogu
Posts: 377 - Karma: 64
Yeah I'm pretty much gonna be doing everything, literally. I'm actually driving to 1 of like 3 stores still selling ski gear atm. What's up with the schizos? Mood swings? Or lil tiny things tgat make big things go wrong breaking? Is it warrantied or anything like that?
Jun 3 2010 7:23PM
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RudyGarmisch
Posts: 25443 - Karma: 13,844
Read the binding thread thats stickied.

Most people really dont need STH's or FKS 18's. Seriously. But if you do a lot of park and need the tradeoff of extra durable for extra weight, all metal is the way to go. Plastic does wear out over time, but no binding, even metal, is absolutely bombproof.

And I find it funny that you think Marker has a sterling reputation in the binding world.
Jun 3 2010 7:28PM
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brenker
Posts: 3188 - Karma: 71
ive seen a friends griffon toepiece explode on a landing. uncool in my opinion
Jun 3 2010 7:29PM
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Style+eeze
Posts: 6901 - Karma: 551
they are heavy as shit, and you never need to move your bindings really, they're pretty useless.

i got to ride a pair of k2s for free this year because my friend's dad is a VP, and they were extremes with schizos.

i would have way rather just had jesters, because they are lighter and less..... annoying?

for good bindings to get:

salomon 16 din bindings only (yes sth 16s are different than 14/12s)

fks/p series (look, same binding, different company name/colors)

jesters

head/tyrolia/whatever else company rebrands those
Jun 3 2010 7:30PM
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brenker
Posts: 3188 - Karma: 71
fischer and 4frnt..mark-up douchers
Jun 3 2010 7:39PM
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no_steeze
Posts: 23992 - Karma: 4,270
i have witnessed griffons being dropped on the floor of my shop and they broke
Jun 3 2010 7:40PM
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Jimmy.
Posts: 2888 - Karma: 27
then again.. i have no problems with my griffons.
Jun 3 2010 7:41PM
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leahey
Posts: 2548 - Karma: 32
I highly recommend the FKS 140, they are all metal, 14 DIN, which is more than enough for mostly everyone, me included, but these have lasted me 2 years with only a few scratches. i expect 2 more years with them.
Jun 3 2010 7:50PM
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DHogg
Posts: 3462 - Karma: 235
I think the griffon schizos are a gimmick personally. Would you really move your bindings throughout the day? I know I probably wouldn't. It's simply adding more weight and more moving parts to break IMO. The griffons are made out of so much plastic, there is no way it can hold up durability wise compared to the FKS.

Also, you mentioned marker having the best reputation. Before the royal family series, basically all marker bindings were regarded as complete shit(albeit comp20/30's). Pre releasing, breaking, and general shittyness all round. The griffons are much better, but nothing to write home about.

Is it worth losing the rail?
Have you stopped growing? If you have when you buy new boots most of the time you'll find the shell size only changes a few mm most of the time so its not an issue as fks have about 8mm adjust ability. I think its a huge plus of the fks. It's the reason is so light for an all metal binding. the PX18 is SOOOO much heavier than the fks 18, and this has a lot to do with it. Also, it means there are less parts to break.

What are the benefits of the turnable heel?
Elasticity. Prereleasing is pretty much eliminated as the binding has some "give" in it, and won't pop off unless you actually need it to. Because of this you can generally ride fks on a lower din= better for your knees. Not to mention the lack of the track allows your ski to flex more naturally.

I'm not saying FKS are the best binding out there. Mojo15/18's, STH16, 914 labs, 916 ect are all great too. But I don't think the griffon can really compare to FKS in terms of performance and functionality.



Jun 3 2010 8:07PM
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cbeebzthasteeze
Posts: 1862 - Karma: 85
Quality post, unlike this one.
Jun 3 2010 8:11PM
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Balto
Posts: 25985 - Karma: 4,398
you can't put jesters in the same class as 916s or fks...
Jun 3 2010 8:51PM
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cobra_commander
Posts: 16909 - Karma: 4,682
If it says Marker and does not say 30. it sucks. good rule of thumb.

18 and 20 are semi acceptable.
Jun 3 2010 10:24PM
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Kogu
Posts: 377 - Karma: 64
Alright, well thanks for keeping the thread alive guys. I just got back from the shop, got to see a pair of look px12s. Very sweet. Story time. I saw what the hell a turntable heel was all about. I can definitely see why it hells with pre released and morso, leg injury. After seeing them she pulled out a pair of anthems they got with the px12 on it (love my shop /claim) and I strapped in. Biggest nollie I've ever done. Presses were nice too. Very impressed, though it was on, yknow, floor. Idk how it'd act on snow but I like how it feels when you step in and I popped a boot out to see how much pressure it takes. So, long post getting longer.. now I need to figure out a good point on which to mount SFB for next year. More for added safety than anything I can sacrifice moving my binding, and the shop agreed with most saying that most people even adjust them once and don't touch them again. Someone said -2 of core is a good position for the Bacon. Just an idea but any suggestions would be great, also any places with deals on FKSs? (Threadjacking my own thread)
Jun 3 2010 11:31PM
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no_steeze
Posts: 23992 - Karma: 4,270
px12's are not turntables
Jun 3 2010 11:34PM
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family_vacation
Posts: 6200 - Karma: 7,841
They also happen to be terrible.
Jun 3 2010 11:43PM
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Kogu
Posts: 377 - Karma: 64
Pivots. My bad, too many names.
Jun 3 2010 11:44PM
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tripnip
Posts: 1882 - Karma: 482
FSK all the way
FSK pro's:
Metal
turn table
Fsk Con:
EXPENSIVE!!!


marker jester pro:
light
all way release toe piece
cheaper
Marker jester Con:
plastic
breakable

Bottom line get the FSK'S worth the extra money and best binding ever made.
Jun 3 2010 11:45PM
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VinzenzK.
Posts: 168 - Karma: 286
FKS are the way to go
Jun 4 2010 12:17AM
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Kogu
Posts: 377 - Karma: 64
Amazing post sir. Much +k. I noticed you said you could ride them with a lower din due to their safety. I know that many companies rate things differently than other brands (flex rating on a boot for example) is that also true with bindings and din? Or are they universal? Thank you for the very detailed post!
Jun 4 2010 12:47AM
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LC.
Posts: 5952 - Karma: 2,423
FKS aren't "bombproof" despite what everyone says. I've repeatedly broken parts on both my pairs. If I was buying new at full price I'd definitely get Peak 15s, might even swap to those this winter if I can find a good price and a buyer for my FKS.
Jun 4 2010 5:32AM
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-ShredTheGnar-
Posts: 2038 - Karma: 111
Look PX18s are crap for freestyle though.... Landing switch the heel piece cant handle. I snapped my heel piece twice last season and i only way 68kg.
Jun 4 2010 9:09AM
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Brognar
Posts: 44 - Karma: 10
Make sure they were Pivots or FKS! If it was a 12 din binder, and from 09-10 or 10-11, they were not a turntable heel.
Jun 4 2010 10:49AM
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Jules.
Posts: 768 - Karma: 9
the royal family is by far the best. ive skiied the griffon schizo's, and they are the best.
Jun 4 2010 11:11AM
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Kogu
Posts: 377 - Karma: 64
Yeah they were def look pivot 12s. Couldn't find any fks but I assume they're similar enough to one another ha. There was a decent amount of metal on it too. The heel piece I know was and I think the frame of the toe was too
Jun 4 2010 11:12AM
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Kogu
Posts: 377 - Karma: 64
Yeah, yknow last night I thought I'd look to see more on they durability and went to a thread where they were reading fks parts. The way I'm seeing it now, is that fks have little things that go wrong a lot but nothing ever totals the binding. The lesser of 2 evils maybe? Honestly, I just mainly like the idea of a safety oriented design. My old bindings were notorious for NOT letting go and I'm not gonna lie that's a scary thought =\. I'd like a safe, high performance binding. Even for a little extra, so long as they do last long enough.
Jun 4 2010 11:21AM
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nickyp
Posts: 5673 - Karma: 215
I got a pair of Amplid-branded Tyrolia bindings free with my Anthems. Instead of selling them, and putting the STH16s from my old skis on, I decided I'd use them. Big mistake.

6 months later, the turntable part of the heel doesn't turn, the casing has come off both of the toe pieces, they are heavy as fuck, and difficult to service.
Jun 4 2010 12:06PM
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Jib-in-my-pants
Posts: 132 - Karma: 11
FKS all the way,

I had markers on my afterbangs and the toe piece snapped off the ski. It's not a big deal because I broke my afterbangs a couple of days later but thats not the point.

On the skis that head sends me I ONLY use fks. The reason? They're the only binding I've never had a problem with.

Get yourself some pivots and enjoy. FKS are truly the only binding that I can't complain about. (excluding weight)
Jun 4 2010 12:35PM
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Kogu
Posts: 377 - Karma: 64
Alright.. so is it a safe statement that: marker will last until they fail catastrophically, whereas FKS/Look/whatever turntable, will be more durable in their core pieces (toe/heel structure) however I may be spending some hours and some extra cash on the little pieces of the turntable that frequently break but don't disable the binding fully? Is that a fair statement so far? Thanks for all the answers guys, keep em coming!
Jun 4 2010 1:17PM
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DGOskeeze
Posts: 140 - Karma: 34
Rossi FKS or Look Pivots. Same thing different paint jobs. Both are far superior to any other binding on the market! Don't even think twice about this!
Jun 4 2010 2:16PM
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no_steeze
Posts: 23992 - Karma: 4,270
it's all preference

i know you get hard when you turn your din up but you're honestly not gonna break a pair of good bindings
Jun 4 2010 2:37PM
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cobra_commander
Posts: 16909 - Karma: 4,682
it is really hard to break a good pair of bindings. Jesters are not good bindings. They are easy to break, release funny and to often and a general pain to deal with.
Jun 4 2010 2:57PM
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no_steeze
Posts: 23992 - Karma: 4,270
i honestly dislike my dukes, i just use them because they're the best in their genre of bindings
Jun 4 2010 3:01PM
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RudyGarmisch
Posts: 25443 - Karma: 13,844
Hey guys, listen to me. I've only ridden one set of bindings, and boy do they keep me in (I've never actually released from them, soooooo good, rite?). I totally recommend them over all the other ones I've never tried.
Jun 4 2010 3:18PM
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LC.
Posts: 5952 - Karma: 2,423
You're talking about 12-DIN Tyrolias or the old 15-DIN ones. The newer 15s have a much simpler and stronger heel (no diagonal release) and the toe on the 15s is way more solid than the 12s and a bit better than the old 15s. I had Elan (Tyrolia) 14s before and they crapped out on me pretty quickly too. You can't compare those models to the newer 15 and 18.

I've not skied Jesters more than about 10 runs on demo skis so can't comment on their performance but the thing that gets to me about them is that you mount plastic rails to the ski first (a pretty small flimsy rail for the toe) then slide the toe and heel on. The toe doesn't seem totally solidly connected to the ski - you can toque it a little side to side. This is the retail model I'm talking about, not demo or Shitzo model.

FKS, they've always performed flawlessly for me and I can run my DIN lower than Salomons, Looks and Tyrolias I've used previously. Only 2 or 3 pre-releases last year on very nose-heavy switch landings but I bent or snapped brakes on those occasions and it's a bitch to have to order new brakes, bend them, take the heelpiece off, dismantle it, swap the brakes and remount. And the baseplates have cracked so many times on mine leading to bits falling off and the forward pressure going out. They still perform fine like that but my boots don't sit totally rigidly in them - there's a little play with the boot snapped in when rolling it in an edge-to-edge motion.

Anyway I'd say just use what you can get cheap and be done with it. I really wish I wasn't so anal about bindings. I know guys who ride way harder than me that ski Jesters, Tyrolia 15/18, FKS, STH 16 all with no problems. Even some guys who rip on Tyrolia 12s, the cheapest PX12s, Rossi Axium (the cheaper ones, not the PX-style) or the cheap-ass 4FRNT 11 or Salomon 12 ones and have no hassle. Land smooth and you'll never have a problem.
Jun 4 2010 5:16PM
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Kogu
Posts: 377 - Karma: 64
Wow that's.. amazing... HA. Even the pictures they use are identical on their little interactive page for each binding!!!!
Jun 5 2010 2:06AM
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Kogu
Posts: 377 - Karma: 64
So.. would a pair of FKS/Pivots that are maybe a bit newer hold up better in those areas you said were breaking? Like higher quality materials or anything? I'm really not into the idea of having to worry about my binders breaking (albeit they're not EXPLODING) but little things going wrong frequently is a bit of a turn off..
Jun 5 2010 2:08AM
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LC.
Posts: 5952 - Karma: 2,423
When I asked about it someone said it's the brake design that causes the baseplates to crack when the brakes get tweaked in crashes but I'm dubious about that because I've cracked baseplates on the ones on my fat skis too and those have never released. Baseplates are plastic on the new ones too apparently.
Jun 5 2010 6:58AM
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Beez
Posts: 1496 - Karma: 39
fks all day. markers always break
Jun 5 2010 7:17AM
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I_Am_Mod
Posts: 13214 - Karma: 3,753
dude, bindings are for pussies, real skiers don't need them !
Jun 5 2010 7:27AM
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Zump.
Posts: 3338 - Karma: 305
Same here. And if I'm not mistaken, the "plastic" seems more like a carbon fiber material. Kind of like a tennis racket. But I have no idea how remotely close to being right I am, so someone enlighten me
Jun 5 2010 11:36AM
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Kogu
Posts: 377 - Karma: 64
Real men drill the toes and heels of their boots to the ski. Just a quick go with a screwdriver and your on for a day of skiing!
Jun 5 2010 11:51AM
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Evan.Frazee
Posts: 2285 - Karma: -40
I love my FKS i have a pair of fks and a pair of sth16 and i feel so much safer in my fks's. I also feel like i have more control. Idk maybe its just me.
Jun 6 2010 1:40AM
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Kirsakid
Posts: 1793 - Karma: 126
I have a pair of FKS 140 and they are mint so good to ride i come out when i should and never before or no release when needed. They are also so durable i have fallen and did shit where any binding should have broken but these took it like a champ.
Jun 6 2010 1:59AM
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