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There is NO spoon!!

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skisebski
Posts: 5970 - Karma: 21

No really! it doesnt exist! Do you people understand this? its fucking with me  We were dicussing this stuff in my philosophy of perception class and i thought id share and promote hate free discussion haha.. Think about this:                                                                                                             How can I be so sure that a spoon exists (or anything for that matter)? If the spoon is a stimulus, then light bounces off the spoon and into my eye…. and therefore my cognitive reaction to the light bouncing off my eye is me believing that it is a spoon… but how can an object be the stimulus and reaction at the same time? If it is our subjective reality (which means each person's own viewpoint) that creates the spoon, then how com everybody else is also seeing the spoon?? weird eh. Makes you want to question everything around you.

Nov 19 2007 5:14PM
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FUUUCK
Posts: 18426 - Karma: 4,888
everyone sees the spoon because it IS the stimulus, how we see it depends on our own reaction.
Nov 20 2007 4:56PM
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babujib
Posts: 5039 - Karma: 104
hahahah thats hilarious

but yeah no i see what your saying but its all shit like that when you overthink life, your gonna go nuts
Nov 20 2007 5:29PM
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djikstra
Posts: 2471 - Karma: 6,014
what about the whole " i think i am therefore i am" I have to exist in some reality if i am able to think i exist, even if I'm just some fragment of some kid with autism's imagination, that's still existing right?
Nov 20 2007 5:42PM
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2bi40s
Posts: 275 - Karma: 15
except... there really is no chicken johnnathan
Nov 20 2007 6:15PM
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RJD2
Posts: 3532 - Karma: 921
this movie has all the answers

Click for larger image

Nov 20 2007 6:59PM
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Journey
Posts: 421 - Karma: 16
im pretty sure if im holding a spoon, its there... how is it not there if im holding it in my hand?
Nov 20 2007 8:34PM
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skisebski
Posts: 5970 - Karma: 21
right on dude, yea im a 4th psych student so we talked about this in relation to the psychological moment. a little different approach but pretty much coming to the same conclusions.
Nov 21 2007 12:25AM
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Mr_Bojangles
Posts: 2585 - Karma: 16
This thread is a little too idealist for me, you and your mind-dependencies and sensible things...

If anyone's interested, read George Berkeley, one of the few philosophers who actually argued for idealist monism. He famously held that 'sensible things exist in their being percieved', and that there was no material substance, only immaterial substance, such as ideas.
Nov 21 2007 3:07AM
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Ski311
Posts: 595 - Karma: 8
My spoon is too big.
Nov 21 2007 11:19PM
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Mr_Bojangles
Posts: 2585 - Karma: 16

I just finished my first year of philosophy, I think I'm going to take it all the way. David Hume's teleological argument for the existence of God was a good read last semester, I should definately look into him a little more. I just wrote on Locke and Berkeley in an exam a few days ago, although I don't agree with their views, it's fascinating stuff.

Nov 22 2007 1:14AM
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charmander
Posts: 10636 - Karma: 372
ha i just saw that on the history channel!
Nov 22 2007 2:09AM
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whattheshit
Posts: 6562 - Karma: 107
so does that mean you don't take part in thanksgiving?


Nov 22 2007 8:13PM
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grapesoda
Posts: 999 - Karma: 31
haha yes! i was waiting for someone to say that.
Nov 22 2007 9:31PM
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Kazabazua
Posts: 3529 - Karma: 1,128
we all exist and there is a fuckin spoon. and that shit about how we exist in the future... no we dont exist in the future maybe our thoughts are slower than our bodies by like .0005 seconds but our bodies are still in the present our thoughts just lag. your brain needs time to take things in but its not like your body is moving in the future or anything your body only moves when your mind tells it to react, therefore your mind and body go together.
Nov 22 2007 10:06PM
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liquidsword
Posts: 566 - Karma: 10
then why can you feel the spoon with your sense of touch and your sense of vision... go debate you master debater
Nov 23 2007 1:00AM
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liquidsword
Posts: 566 - Karma: 10
see it with your sense of vision sorry
Nov 23 2007 1:01AM
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skisebski
Posts: 5970 - Karma: 21
thank you. haha.
Nov 23 2007 12:05PM
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Mr_Bojangles
Posts: 2585 - Karma: 16

'sense', eh...

Senses are the only faculties through which you are able to percieve the world; considering this, can you guarantee that these sensible things exist outside of your mind?

Nov 24 2007 4:56AM
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skisebski
Posts: 5970 - Karma: 21
exactly! you can't!
Nov 24 2007 10:57AM
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A[yellow]Nation
Posts: 39 - Karma: 10
youre all missing the point, the only reason that people question whether or not one sees the spoon is because nobody wants to see you spoon in the first place.  Observing someone spoon with your sister is a no and nobody wants to see that.  then again..

but then hey, if someone wants to spoon with you, why not? right?
Nov 24 2007 12:11PM
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VT_FLO
Posts: 3806 - Karma: 147
you can feel, taste, smell, see, and if you hit it you can hear the spoon. Isnt that enough proof to proove that what you refer to as a spoon exists.

If somebody stabs you with a spoon it will hurt. Does the spoon exist if it causes harm to you? pretty sure
Nov 24 2007 1:02PM
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Mr_Bojangles
Posts: 2585 - Karma: 16
You're still considering senses, which are mind-dependent, meaning that they cannot exist outside of a mind. You haven't put forward any arguments for objective, or mind-independent, matter. However, it is sufficient to say that mind-dependent things exist, 'sensible things exist in their being percieved'.
Nov 25 2007 7:32AM
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