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First Hit in Pipe (snowboarding vs. skiing)

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faux_real
Posts: 984 - Karma: 250
Why do snowboarders always start their pipe run with a straight air (or two)? Would it be cool if skiers did the same?
Jan 29 2007 10:00PM
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Changethattape
Posts: 1008 - Karma: 36
Snowboarders dont always but it looks steezy and they pump themselves up for the big spins.
Jan 29 2007 10:01PM
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Vicrum
Posts: 59 - Karma: 10
its cause snowboarders will never get as much air as skiers do.
Jan 29 2007 10:04PM
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dangerdad
Posts: 2228 - Karma: 317
can i just say one thing. it seems like skiing has gotten so much crazier than snowboarding. for example in the slopestyle, skiers rail tricks were on such a higher level. even pipe this year, soo much progression. snowboarding just cannot keep up
Jan 29 2007 10:05PM
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HeathR
Posts: 4357 - Karma: 1,379
right now it just seems like the best skiers are better then the best snowboarders.
Jan 29 2007 10:09PM
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tjski
Posts: 5859 - Karma: 44
its true, they proved it on some ESPN article on the internet.
Jan 29 2007 10:12PM
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nedward
Posts: 841 - Karma: 15
i want a skier to come out doing 1's 3's 5's and 7's all runs with steeze...its just sick that way for the whoel run
Jan 29 2007 10:12PM
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jamesmccormick
Posts: 1481 - Karma: 17
i would agree but im a snowboarder and i know that the snowboarders that were invited to the x games were there for jumping, which would make sense considering that the majority of slopestyle is jumps but if there had been a single good rail rider there you would have been saying the opposite. like my boy magoon. daaaaaaaaamn
Jan 29 2007 10:15PM
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jamesmccormick
Posts: 1481 - Karma: 17
thats what stefan thomas did and it was my fav run
Jan 29 2007 10:16PM
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faux_real
Posts: 984 - Karma: 250
maybe, but i think there's more to the first-hit straight air. it takes skill to go 10+ ft. out and not wave your arms.
Jan 29 2007 10:33PM
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garrett.
Posts: 9304 - Karma: 3,670
its because there trying to be sucked into the same level as dumont while he floats around in the stratusphere
Jan 29 2007 10:34PM
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philipc
Posts: 6651 - Karma: 1,286
that one guy 1260 the first hit but lost a lot of amplitude for the rest of his run
Jan 29 2007 10:41PM
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smknbud420stoner
Posts: 218 - Karma: 11
they do a stright air because they have more trouble keeping there speed through the whole pipe so they need all the tranny they can get on the first couple of hits.
Jan 29 2007 10:42PM
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B-Wald
Posts: 8113 - Karma: 96
no, actually the rails sucked for skiers in the slopestyle this year.  out of the 4 people they showed, pretty much everyone did 270 on swup 270 out on the first box, and pretty much the same tricks on all the other rails. llaaammmeee
half pipe on the other hand, i think the skiers definitely held it down this year.
Jan 29 2007 10:48PM
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Aseets
Posts: 2171 - Karma: 17
I think it's pretty gnarly to see that skiers bronze run did one straight air while the gold for boarding did two or more (i can't remember). But both tanner and dumont both did tricks EVERY hit (if i remember correctly) with tons of height. pretty gnarly you know
Jan 29 2007 10:49PM
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Pigletpen
Posts: 1137 - Karma: 18
No.
the more tricks the better.
If you can keep the height up... trick away!
Jan 29 2007 11:30PM
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drewishish
Posts: 3710 - Karma: 23
well, about that. i was talking to a snowboarder(hes really good) anyways, we were saying how they snowboarders werent doing anything on teh rials. he said that it could be because the run is icy. and then he explained that if the run is icy and there going to do big spins they NEED sharp edges or they're just gonna keep on spinning after they land. so he said that they might go conservative on rails because of there edges.

dont get me wrong, skiers go bigger. that was just one explaination as to why they were going so easy on teh rails and such.
Jan 29 2007 11:35PM
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KillerMonkey
Posts: 6435 - Karma: 108
ye, but also in the slopstyle jumps, skiiers rival snowboarders just as much if not more.
Jan 29 2007 11:48PM
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tride
Posts: 1038 - Karma: 26
In snowboarding, part of what is judged in a pipe run is the ability to perform what they call "standard maneuvers". That is a trick involving 180 or less rotation, meaning straight air, air to fakie, or alley-oop. They used to have a specific "standard maneuver"judge, but now it is simply taken into account for the overall score.

There are some good things about this, it forces more of a priority on style, as the straight airs are judged purely for that aspect. It means that even the guys who can do the most tech tricks also need to show that they can perform simple tricks with great style.

They don't have to do it first hit, they just have to do at least one in their run.
Jan 29 2007 11:51PM
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K2skipunk
Posts: 2837 - Karma: 111
sweet idea
Jan 30 2007 12:01AM
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steezerampage
Posts: 2171 - Karma: 214
Because they suck, I remember like 3 years ago when skiers were doing the same thing, it seems that skiers have taken over the pipe.
Jan 30 2007 12:46AM
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*DrewT*
Posts: 7768 - Karma: 480
uhhh that sounds retarted.

No offence to the boarders but the skiiers killed them in both events this year. Even on the jumps in slopestyle it was at least equal skill and style, rails and pipe skiiers killed it
Jan 30 2007 2:27AM
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skier_boy26
Posts: 11295 - Karma: 502
I've heard that before, and even then I thought that was absolutely rediculous. It puts more of a constraint on what can be done, and essentially, forces the runs to be less that what they can be. If there is an emphasis on style, then that should appear on all hits, instead of requiring a low-spin hit to demonstrate that. If skiing went that route, it would be a sad day. Spinning every hit just makes everything so damn difficult.

Oh, and not to mention skiers do go bigger. This is a crude comparison because it is just comparing two riders, and just captured quickly from online videos, but here is Fisher (snowboard pipe gold) and dumont (ski pipe silver) and their respective first hits (not to say the rest of the run wasnt sick). No fucking comparison. Snowboarding can keep their straight air requisites.
Click for larger image
Jan 30 2007 2:46AM
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00Snowball
Posts: 163 - Karma: 10
Dumont is redic.
Jan 30 2007 2:56AM
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slaydave
Posts: 1697 - Karma: 62
yup... soon it will be "cool" to ski again
Jan 30 2007 3:19AM
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-+Siver+-
Posts: 1902 - Karma: 12
so sick
Jan 30 2007 10:06AM
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tride
Posts: 1038 - Karma: 26
It's basically an example of the different mindsets in skiing and boarding.

Skiers are (obviously) fine with the event being all about spin to win, while boarders are looking for more of skate/surf style asthetic in their run, hence the standard maneuver requirement.

I wasn't agreeing or disagreeing with it, just answering the guys original question about why they do it.
Jan 30 2007 10:37AM
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*ThaMovment*
Posts: 564 - Karma: 50
thats bullshit! every snowboarder did the rails, and it doesn't make a significant difference if they do 270's on or just fs boards..!!! Thats like saying you dont wanna get aids, so you fuck really slow. it just doesn't make sense..!
Jan 30 2007 10:46AM
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Treestman
Posts: 3049 - Karma: 300
the idea for the rider is to win, i mean, they need to make money to live, not to please people on ns who don't want spin to win.

face it, it's spin to win because the riders need to win to make money, and tech tricks matter to judges just as much as steeze
Jan 30 2007 11:24AM
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nedward
Posts: 841 - Karma: 15
well steeze is a plus
Jan 30 2007 7:27PM
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quebecfreestyler
Posts: 13040 - Karma: 1,418
you mean skeir box hits.....

Jan 30 2007 7:33PM
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BLKOUT
Posts: 1287 - Karma: 20
yeah that would be sick if next year everyone just spun up to 5's or 7's and it would just be judged on style and amp
Jan 30 2007 7:36PM
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jos-in-nz
Posts: 90 - Karma: 99
well snowboarders just suck at goin big anyway
Jan 31 2007 1:57PM
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Mr.Bell
Posts: 272 - Karma: 28
snowboarders can do steezy straihgt airs...well skiier cant so much
Feb 3 2007 12:56PM
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bigsoxfan
Posts: 734 - Karma: 10
yea i was pretty dispointed to see so many straight airs in the snowboard pipe, and i dont know if any of the boarders hit the up-flat-down box on the second rail hit, whereas the skiers where doin tons of crazy sw ups on it. that being said the snowboarding big air was pretty sweet tho
Feb 3 2007 1:46PM
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mark311
Posts: 508 - Karma: 21
See, that's what people are saying. It is Sping to Win in skiing right now, and as much as that looks good on TV, it raises the bar to a ridiculous level, so now you're not considered good if you can't do anything over a 9.
The key to any good competition is variety. Ask anyone who has ever judged any type of "action" sport comp and they will tell you that if there is someone doing something that no one else is, it will (should) be taken into account. That makes perfect sense, because sports like skiing/snowboarding/skateboarding/rollerblading/etc are all about creativity and personal accomplishment.
This is why Spin to Win is bad for skiing. By assuming that a 10 beats a 9, and a 12 beats a 10 by default with no room for discussion, it's essentially implementing the rules and regulations that freeskiers got away from in the first place (back in the late 70's/early 80's). Using Spin to Win takes away any of the things that make sports like skiing unique=the fact that you are allowed and encouraged to do a trick however you want. But by competitions and judges using the Spin to Win theory, they're eliminating what makes freeskiing freeskiing.
Feb 3 2007 2:29PM
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holyDINOSAURS
Posts: 7038 - Karma: 639
but that argument doesnt even work here. Dumont 1260. tanner 1080. i understand that he also did a switch 1080 but it would seem that dumont should have won if thats the way we're calculating it
Feb 3 2007 2:36PM
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mark311
Posts: 508 - Karma: 21
Yeah, there's exeptions to the rule, but it's still Spin to Win, it's a 1080 vs a 1260. There is no way anyone would have come close to making the podium with a 7 or a 9, in the Open or any other pro comp.
My main point is that is gives people an unreal representation of what the sport is. Kids go out and think they can't ski for shit until they can get a 9, so they just go out and huck yourself. Is Spinning to Win really progression, or is it just a fail-safe fallback?
Feb 3 2007 2:47PM
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theoz
Posts: 2379 - Karma: 128
Danny kass kills all skiers buut candide and dumont in pipe..
Feb 3 2007 8:20PM
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3ski6guy0
Posts: 9201 - Karma: 132
snowboarders really arent that impressive compared to skiers. i was watching both pipe and slopestyle and skiers killed it way more. in slopestyle, the boarders did ntohing that spectacular on rails where as skiers are throwing switch 630 disasters. in the pipe the boarders also throw so many straight airs..its pretty lame.
Feb 3 2007 8:56PM
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Mr.O
Posts: 1582 - Karma: 23
yeah but on the stair-i-lizer there were some sick thing like cadides sw 630
Feb 3 2007 9:01PM
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